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We need to trade Blake

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We need to trade Blake 

Post#1 » by Piston Pete » Sun Jul 7, 2019 5:32 pm

Forget ‘mortgaging the future’ type deals like trading for Westbrook, Beal, or any other star players that might be available. The only way we will ever be contenders again is to build via the draft.

We need to look at trading Blake for young assets and picks.

He had possibly his best season ever, statistically, last season. His value is as high as it will ever be right now. We need to look at trading him and accumulating young assets.

We should possibly look at doing the same with Drummond too.

This is not about trying to win this season, obviously. It’s about trying to put ourselves into a position where we could be a contender in 3-5 years.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#2 » by MotownMadness » Sun Jul 7, 2019 5:37 pm

Build through the draft is also just farming them long enough to trade them for stars hopefully. If we could just build through the draft and then grab a couple max FAs like alot of places giving us depth and stars of all ages then hell yeah.

Eventually though yeah we gotta get a couple stars out of the draft but thats far from a guarantee to a title as well.

Thankfully now you dont have to go full tank mode and can have decent odds at a top 4 as just a bad team that misses the playoffs
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#3 » by Liqourish » Sun Jul 7, 2019 5:39 pm

When have we ever drafted well :-?
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#4 » by Snakebites » Sun Jul 7, 2019 6:02 pm

Liqourish wrote:When have we ever drafted well :-?

We've got a new group of people managing our draft now.

If our argument is that we draft badly anyway, then we may as well just give up. Regardless of the path we take to building this team, we aren't going to win or be successful unless we draft well, as that's really the way to gain value without giving anything up.

A rebuild isn't a guarantee of success. But the treadmill we're on is a guarantee of failure.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#5 » by Piston Pete » Sun Jul 7, 2019 6:45 pm

Snakebites wrote:
Liqourish wrote:When have we ever drafted well :-?

A rebuild isn't a guarantee of success. But the treadmill we're on is a guarantee of failure.


Failure? That may be a little harsh. Mediocrity is more accurate, IMO. We will be stuck in the 6-10 seed range in the East, which is frustratingly boring.

We draft poorly? I agree with Snakebites when he points out we have a new group of people managing our draft process and I feel they will be doing a better job for us moving forward. Maybe drafting higher might help too. Being stuck in mediocrity means we don’t get chances to draft game-changing talent. We need to be drafting top-5 a couple times.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#6 » by Snakebites » Sun Jul 7, 2019 6:47 pm

Piston Pete wrote:
Snakebites wrote:
Liqourish wrote:When have we ever drafted well :-?

A rebuild isn't a guarantee of success. But the treadmill we're on is a guarantee of failure.


Failure? That may be a little harsh. Mediocrity is more accurate, IMO. We will be stuck in the 6-10 seed range in the East, which is frustratingly boring.

We draft poorly? I agree with Snakebites when he points out we have a new group of people managing our draft process and I feel they will be doing a better job for us moving forward. Maybe drafting higher might help too. Being stuck in mediocrity means we don’t get chances to draft game-changing talent. We need to be drafting top-5 a couple times.

I believe most teams would characterize our overall recent state as “failure”.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#7 » by BadMofoPimp » Sun Jul 7, 2019 7:33 pm

Piston Pete wrote:
This is not about trying to win this season, obviously. It’s about trying to put ourselves into a position where we could be a contender in 3-5 years.


Even if the Pistons trade away Drummond and Blake, that will never gaurantee success 3-5 years from now. The Pistons could still be a bottom feeder in 3-5 years if they traded away all their assets now. It is a gamble either way. At least trying to win now is trying to win whereas giving up everything we have is gambling that the team gets super lucky in the draft where the odds are extremely low they win an impact player. The odds are greater this team would suck ass in 3-5 years. I think if they can get a Westbrook level player now, may as well enjoy fighting for the next 2-3 years as that is a gauranteed fighting chance of doing something over gambling in the lottery where the odds are greater the team stays a bottom feeder.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#8 » by Mr. Krabs » Sun Jul 7, 2019 8:12 pm

thats correct but we are probably not going to do it
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#9 » by Manocad » Mon Jul 8, 2019 12:19 am

BadMofoPimp wrote:
Piston Pete wrote:
This is not about trying to win this season, obviously. It’s about trying to put ourselves into a position where we could be a contender in 3-5 years.


Even if the Pistons trade away Drummond and Blake, that will never gaurantee success 3-5 years from now. The Pistons could still be a bottom feeder in 3-5 years if they traded away all their assets now. It is a gamble either way. At least trying to win now is trying to win whereas giving up everything we have is gambling that the team gets super lucky in the draft where the odds are extremely low they win an impact player. The odds are greater this team would suck ass in 3-5 years. I think if they can get a Westbrook level player now, may as well enjoy fighting for the next 2-3 years as that is a gauranteed fighting chance of doing something over gambling in the lottery where the odds are greater the team stays a bottom feeder.

You're arguing that a rebuild has higher odds of the team sucking ass 3-5 years from now, but that trying to win now is a guarantee that they'll be competitive.

How'd that strategy work out with Blake?
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#10 » by buzzkilloton » Mon Jul 8, 2019 12:46 am

Why build through the draft when you can keep trading for 30 year olds on supermaxes that their original team doesnt want because they cant win a title with them?
Rebuild plz
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#11 » by BadMofoPimp » Mon Jul 8, 2019 2:01 am

Manocad wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
Piston Pete wrote:
This is not about trying to win this season, obviously. It’s about trying to put ourselves into a position where we could be a contender in 3-5 years.


Even if the Pistons trade away Drummond and Blake, that will never gaurantee success 3-5 years from now. The Pistons could still be a bottom feeder in 3-5 years if they traded away all their assets now. It is a gamble either way. At least trying to win now is trying to win whereas giving up everything we have is gambling that the team gets super lucky in the draft where the odds are extremely low they win an impact player. The odds are greater this team would suck ass in 3-5 years. I think if they can get a Westbrook level player now, may as well enjoy fighting for the next 2-3 years as that is a gauranteed fighting chance of doing something over gambling in the lottery where the odds are greater the team stays a bottom feeder.

You're arguing that a rebuild has higher odds of the team sucking ass 3-5 years from now, but that trying to win now is a guarantee that they'll be competitive.

How'd that strategy work out with Blake?


Blake along with Westbrook could make a competitive team. It would really suck arse if the team traded away all their assets now and end up still being no better than where we are at now 5 years from now. Because, the odds are that is what would most likely happen. I would rather shoot for the moon now for 2-3 years then rebuild instead of giving up all the time.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#12 » by Manocad » Mon Jul 8, 2019 2:18 am

BadMofoPimp wrote:
Manocad wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
Even if the Pistons trade away Drummond and Blake, that will never gaurantee success 3-5 years from now. The Pistons could still be a bottom feeder in 3-5 years if they traded away all their assets now. It is a gamble either way. At least trying to win now is trying to win whereas giving up everything we have is gambling that the team gets super lucky in the draft where the odds are extremely low they win an impact player. The odds are greater this team would suck ass in 3-5 years. I think if they can get a Westbrook level player now, may as well enjoy fighting for the next 2-3 years as that is a gauranteed fighting chance of doing something over gambling in the lottery where the odds are greater the team stays a bottom feeder.

You're arguing that a rebuild has higher odds of the team sucking ass 3-5 years from now, but that trying to win now is a guarantee that they'll be competitive.

How'd that strategy work out with Blake?


Blake along with Westbrook could make a competitive team. It would really suck arse if the team traded away all their assets now and end up still being no better than where we are at now 5 years from now. Because, the odds are that is what would most likely happen. I would rather shoot for the moon now for 2-3 years then rebuild instead of giving up all the time.

This team hasn't "given up" i.e. committed to a rebuild yet. The sucking we've been watching for years has been via continual attempts at remaining competitive. Granted, the team has done a lousy job with their "win now" moves, but that doesn't change the fact that A REBUILD HASN'T BEEN TRIED YET. Even in their worst seasons since the 2004 championship, they did not expect nor intend to be as bad as they were.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#13 » by BadMofoPimp » Mon Jul 8, 2019 2:22 am

Manocad wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
Manocad wrote:You're arguing that a rebuild has higher odds of the team sucking ass 3-5 years from now, but that trying to win now is a guarantee that they'll be competitive.

How'd that strategy work out with Blake?


Blake along with Westbrook could make a competitive team. It would really suck arse if the team traded away all their assets now and end up still being no better than where we are at now 5 years from now. Because, the odds are that is what would most likely happen. I would rather shoot for the moon now for 2-3 years then rebuild instead of giving up all the time.

This team hasn't "given up" i.e. committed to a rebuild yet. The sucking we've been watching for years has been via continual attempts at remaining competitive. Granted, the team has done a lousy job with their "win now" moves, but that doesn't change the fact that A REBUILD HASN'T BEEN TRIED YET. Even in their worst seasons since the 2004 championship, they did not expect nor intend to be as bad as they were.



I don't care to see a few more KCP's and Stanleys drafted on this team as odds are this is what we end up with the new draft setup! Odds are this team would suck for another decade at the bottom than rise to the top by tanking at this juncture. I would be open to either obtaining Westbrook or trading Blake to OKC for assets. Either way we would make a good trade partner with them.

Besides, if we traded for Westbrook, we would have a good 2-3 year window to win now and if not, then tank.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#14 » by Piston Pete » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:09 am

Tank?

Yeah, we should tank. We have NEVER tanked, and we need to
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#15 » by Cowology » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:12 am

I believe the vast majority of knoweldgeable and passionate fans would agree we need to blow it up. The unfortunate reality is we are severely outnumbered by the casual fans who buy tickets and put dollary-doos in Gores pocket. He won't stomach 3-5 years of an empty arena for a shot at packing it out down the line. He'd rather just be 60-70% capacity year in and year out as the value of the team continues to rise with lucritive TV deals, etc.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#16 » by Liqourish » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:15 am

Cowology wrote:I believe the vast majority of knoweldgeable and passionate fans would agree we need to blow it up. The unfortunate reality is we are severely outnumbered by the casual fans who buy tickets and put dollary-doos in Gores pocket. He won't stomach 3-5 years of an empty arena for a shot at packing it out down the line.



That and we’ve never actually successfully rebuilt a team before, not via the draft so many are clamoring for.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#17 » by Manocad » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:30 am

Liqourish wrote:
Cowology wrote:I believe the vast majority of knoweldgeable and passionate fans would agree we need to blow it up. The unfortunate reality is we are severely outnumbered by the casual fans who buy tickets and put dollary-doos in Gores pocket. He won't stomach 3-5 years of an empty arena for a shot at packing it out down the line.



That and we’ve never actually successfully rebuilt a team before, not via the draft so many are clamoring for.

The Pistons haven't successfully rebuilt a team period. Which means no, not through the draft, and no, not through free agency/trades either.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#18 » by Liqourish » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:33 am

Manocad wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
Cowology wrote:I believe the vast majority of knoweldgeable and passionate fans would agree we need to blow it up. The unfortunate reality is we are severely outnumbered by the casual fans who buy tickets and put dollary-doos in Gores pocket. He won't stomach 3-5 years of an empty arena for a shot at packing it out down the line.



That and we’ve never actually successfully rebuilt a team before, not via the draft so many are clamoring for.

The Pistons haven't successfully rebuilt a team period. Which means no, not through the draft, and no, not through free agency/trades either.


Well, except that one time.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#19 » by Manocad » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:42 am

Liqourish wrote:
Manocad wrote:
Liqourish wrote:

That and we’ve never actually successfully rebuilt a team before, not via the draft so many are clamoring for.

The Pistons haven't successfully rebuilt a team period. Which means no, not through the draft, and no, not through free agency/trades either.


Well, except that one time.

Name it.
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Re: We need to trade Blake 

Post#20 » by Cowology » Mon Jul 8, 2019 3:46 am

Tanking sucks. Even IF you win the lottery you can strike out. Hell, go back the last 20 yrs and tell me how many #1 picks outside of LeBron/Irving won a title. And they missed on Bennet. Go back another decade and you are basically just adding Duncan & Shaq.

You need to suck. A lot. For a long time. Draft well (get lucky), and be able to manage your assets to acquire talent via trades and fa. You need a lot of things to go right.

Don't get me wrong, I'd still rather do that and have a small chance at glory rather than be a treadmill team, but it's not hard to see why it's high risk business proposition. It's a lot of pain with no gaurantee of a pay off.

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