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Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#941 » by rmfc » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:20 pm

MotownMadness wrote:Holy hell why are you guys arguing about literally nothing? If there's a good offer you explore it, if not you dont, My God!!!!!!


I think we are getting there. :D

:rofl:
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#942 » by Manocad » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:39 pm

MotownMadness wrote:Holy hell why are you guys arguing about literally nothing? If there's a good offer you explore it, if not you dont, My God!!!!!!

The subject matter was pretty clear. It was suggested that the Pistons should move up to #2 to get Anthony Edwards, which clearly is going to cost them something other than just the #7 pick. I asked why because I don't think there's a single player in this draft that stands out as a "we need to move up to get this guy" player, and wondered why that opinion of Anthony Edwards was held or what plan he figured prominently in. The answer back was "He's the one guy in this draft that can create offense off the dribble."

The Pistons need help basically everywhere so giving up assets to get a particular player in this draft doesn't make sense to me. That's why I asked the question. Why people get irritated over stuff on a message board is beyond me.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#943 » by Crymson » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:54 pm

BJK1 wrote:Regardless of how devalued the “traditional” center position has become, there’s clearly a reason that literally every single draft analyst/pundit out there projects Okongwu as a lottery pick.


Yes: he's a high-floor player in a draft that might be entirely devoid of star-caliber talent. In a draft of typical strength, he'd probably be drafted the mid-to-late teens. He's a complementary player. None of those analysts/pundits would disagree. The Pistons really aren't looking for complementary players at #7.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#944 » by Pharaoh » Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:05 am

Crymson wrote:
BJK1 wrote:Regardless of how devalued the “traditional” center position has become, there’s clearly a reason that literally every single draft analyst/pundit out there projects Okongwu as a lottery pick.


Yes: he's a high-floor player in a draft that might be entirely devoid of star-caliber talent. In a draft of typical strength, he'd probably be drafted the mid-to-late teens. He's a complementary player. None of those analysts/pundits would disagree. The Pistons really aren't looking for complementary players at #7.
In this Draft they're all likely complimentary players though.

Edwards, Ball & Wiseman are the only dudes who are currently viewed as more than that right now.

I've seen Okongwu mocked as high as 4th because despite the idea that bigs are dead you still need size!

Who knows if he'll be the BPA but if he is we aren't in a position to ignore him just because he's a big.

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#945 » by ByeByeDre » Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:51 am

Manocad wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:Holy hell why are you guys arguing about literally nothing? If there's a good offer you explore it, if not you dont, My God!!!!!!

The subject matter was pretty clear. It was suggested that the Pistons should move up to #2 to get Anthony Edwards, which clearly is going to cost them something other than just the #7 pick. I asked why because I don't think there's a single player in this draft that stands out as a "we need to move up to get this guy" player, and wondered why that opinion of Anthony Edwards was held or what plan he figured prominently in. The answer back was "He's the one guy in this draft that can create offense off the dribble."

The Pistons need help basically everywhere so giving up assets to get a particular player in this draft doesn't make sense to me. That's why I asked the question. Why people get irritated over stuff on a message board is beyond me.


Why some constantly antagonize is beyond me
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#946 » by BJK1 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:52 am

Pharaoh wrote:
Crymson wrote:
BJK1 wrote:Regardless of how devalued the “traditional” center position has become, there’s clearly a reason that literally every single draft analyst/pundit out there projects Okongwu as a lottery pick.


Yes: he's a high-floor player in a draft that might be entirely devoid of star-caliber talent. In a draft of typical strength, he'd probably be drafted the mid-to-late teens. He's a complementary player. None of those analysts/pundits would disagree. The Pistons really aren't looking for complementary players at #7.
In this Draft they're all likely complimentary players though.

Edwards, Ball & Wiseman are the only dudes who are currently viewed as more than that right now.

I've seen Okongwu mocked as high as 4th because despite the idea that bigs are dead you still need size!

Who knows if he'll be the BPA but if he is we aren't in a position to ignore him just because he's a big.

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Agreed. In a what is largely considered a draft that’s light on elite talent, a team that is devoid of talent in general like the Pistons should take the best player available regardless of position. Maybe he becomes a core player, maybe he becomes a complimentary player, or maybe he’s a piece that allows you to eventually trade for a difference maker. Either way, stay true to what your board says and don’t reach. Be shrewd in accumulating talent and the rest will fall into place.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#947 » by JosephMamah » Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:35 am

Hayes
Haliburton

Okongwu


Vassel
Okoro

(If we trade back)
Lewis
Bey
Maxey
Hampton


Don't want anything to do with
Edwards
Ball
Wiseman
Toppin
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#948 » by Pharaoh » Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:53 am

JosephMamah wrote:Hayes
Haliburton

Okongwu


Vassel
Okoro

(If we trade back)
Lewis
Bey
Maxey
Hampton


Don't want anything to do with
Edwards
Ball
Wiseman
Toppin
That's bold!

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#949 » by Manocad » Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:55 am

ByeByeDre wrote:
Manocad wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:Holy hell why are you guys arguing about literally nothing? If there's a good offer you explore it, if not you dont, My God!!!!!!

The subject matter was pretty clear. It was suggested that the Pistons should move up to #2 to get Anthony Edwards, which clearly is going to cost them something other than just the #7 pick. I asked why because I don't think there's a single player in this draft that stands out as a "we need to move up to get this guy" player, and wondered why that opinion of Anthony Edwards was held or what plan he figured prominently in. The answer back was "He's the one guy in this draft that can create offense off the dribble."

The Pistons need help basically everywhere so giving up assets to get a particular player in this draft doesn't make sense to me. That's why I asked the question. Why people get irritated over stuff on a message board is beyond me.


Why some constantly antagonize is beyond me

How ironic.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#950 » by Crymson » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:46 pm

Pharaoh wrote:In this Draft they're all likely complimentary players though.

Edwards, Ball & Wiseman are the only dudes who are currently viewed as more than that right now.

I've seen Okongwu mocked as high as 4th because despite the idea that bigs are dead you still need size!


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He's a complementary player in that he's very limited on offense and has no ability to create it. He'd likely be the #4 guy on offense, at best, on a successful team. The Pistons' first, second, and third needs are guys who can create offense. In terms of the future, they're desperately short on those.

Pharoah wrote:Who knows if he'll be the BPA but if he is we aren't in a position to ignore him just because he's a big.

BJK1 wrote:Agreed. In a what is largely considered a draft that’s light on elite talent, a team that is devoid of talent in general like the Pistons should take the best player available regardless of position.


Best player available isn't determined in a vacuum; it's particular to each individual team. In the context of the Pistons' particular needs, Okongwu will not be the best player available at #7 in any scenario.

Maybe he becomes a core player, maybe he becomes a complimentary player, or maybe he’s a piece that allows you to eventually trade for a difference maker. Be shrewd in accumulating talent and the rest will fall into place.


That mindset is fine so long as a long, multi-year rebuild is the plan from the outset. But very rarely does any team commit to such; where recent examples are concerned, only the Sixers come to mind. For any team that isn't fully intent on waiting five years, specific needs take precedence.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#951 » by Pharaoh » Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:20 pm

Crymson wrote:
Pharaoh wrote:In this Draft they're all likely complimentary players though.

Edwards, Ball & Wiseman are the only dudes who are currently viewed as more than that right now.

I've seen Okongwu mocked as high as 4th because despite the idea that bigs are dead you still need size!


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He's a complementary player in that he's very limited on offense and has no ability to create it. He'd likely be the #4 guy on offense, at best, on a successful team. The Pistons' first, second, and third needs are guys who can create offense. In terms of the future, they're desperately short on those.

Pharoah wrote:Who knows if he'll be the BPA but if he is we aren't in a position to ignore him just because he's a big.

BJK1 wrote:Agreed. In a what is largely considered a draft that’s light on elite talent, a team that is devoid of talent in general like the Pistons should take the best player available regardless of position.


Best player available isn't determined in a vacuum; it's particular to each individual team. In the context of the Pistons' particular needs, Okongwu will not be the best player available at #7 in any scenario.

Maybe he becomes a core player, maybe he becomes a complimentary player, or maybe he’s a piece that allows you to eventually trade for a difference maker. Be shrewd in accumulating talent and the rest will fall into place.


That mindset is fine so long as a long, multi-year rebuild is the plan from the outset. But very rarely does any team commit to such; where recent examples are concerned, only the Sixers come to mind. For any team that isn't fully intent on waiting five years, specific needs take precedence.
Maybe but if we're going team needs first then BPA regardless of position is the go.

I don't believe any team needs to commit to a 5 year plan - that's far too long!

A realistic goal for us is to be a up & coming team just as Blake comes off the books, so the 22-23 season.

2020 - #7 & buy a late first (Flynn)

Retain Wood at a reasonable price
Sign Giles at a reasonable price for 3 years

Wood - Patton
Blake - (Sekou) - Giles
Sekou - Svi - Snell
Luke - Vassell (7)
Brown - Rose - Flynn

2021 - hope for a top 5 pick and get a stud wing.

Retain Luke on a reasonable deal

Wood - Patton
Blake - (Sekou) - Giles
Sekou - Top 5 - Svi
Luke - Vassell
Brown - Flynn - Bone

2022 Draft - hoping for a stud PG

Wood, Patton, Giles
Sekou, Giles, (Top 5 2021)
Top 5 2021, Vassell, Svi
Luke, (Vassell), Brown
2022 PG, Flynn, Bone

That would mean that in 3 years Weaver and his FO have only retained Wood, Sekou, Luke, Svi, Brown & Bone from what they inherited.

And the end result (hopefully) would be a young, up and coming team that's versatile on both ends of the floor.



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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#952 » by DetroitSho » Sun Oct 18, 2020 12:15 am

Maybe I'm missing something, but is there a post prior to the previously discussed exchange where RMFC actually used the verbiage "whatever it takes"? Because if not, WTF was that whole convo?

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#953 » by rmfc » Sun Oct 18, 2020 1:38 am

DetroitSho wrote:Maybe I'm missing something, but is there a post prior to the previously discussed exchange where RMFC actually used the verbiage "whatever it takes"? Because if not, WTF was that whole convo?

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There isn't.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#954 » by Pharaoh » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:33 am

rmfc wrote:


If Minny goes with LaMelo with the #1 overall, the Pistons should do their best to go get that the #2 from GSW.
That's the post that started that discussion

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#955 » by Manocad » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:37 am

DetroitSho wrote:Maybe I'm missing something, but is there a post prior to the previously discussed exchange where RMFC actually used the verbiage "whatever it takes"? Because if not, WTF was that whole convo?

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That was my mistake. I misconstrued “The Pistons should do their best to get that #2 pick from GS” as meaning doing whatever it takes to get the #2 pick. Apparently it means to not do what it would take to get the #2 pick if it means overpaying which, by most accounts, it would.

So if the Pistons do their best to get the pick by not doing what it takes to get the pick but somehow get the pick, they should apparently draft Anthony Edwards because he is the only player in this draft who can create offense off the dribble. Why that’s more Important than keeping assets, taking the BPA at 7, and finding a player who can create offense off the dribble in next year’s draft was not explained.

That’s it in a nutshell.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#956 » by DetroitSho » Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:29 am

Manocad wrote:
DetroitSho wrote:Maybe I'm missing something, but is there a post prior to the previously discussed exchange where RMFC actually used the verbiage "whatever it takes"? Because if not, WTF was that whole convo?

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That was my mistake. I misconstrued “The Pistons should do their best to get that #2 pick from GS” as meaning doing whatever it takes to get the #2 pick. Apparently it means to not do what it would take to get the #2 pick if it means overpaying which, by most accounts, it would.

So if the Pistons do their best to get the pick by not doing what it takes to get the pick but somehow get the pick, they should apparently draft Anthony Edwards because he is the only player in this draft who can create offense off the dribble. Why that’s more Important than keeping assets, taking the BPA at 7, and finding a player who can create offense off the dribble in next year’s draft was not explained.

That’s it in a nutshell.
Over the course of the 11 months of this thread, and specifically since the draft lottery, there's been several posts about trading up to get Anthony Edwards. It's just a little beyond weird that you singled out this particular instance to nitpick.

Context is already kind of implied when discussing the moves the team should make that they should be within reason. Well, unless a person actually DOES say "whatever it takes".

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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#957 » by chrbal » Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:07 am

Pharaoh wrote:
Crymson wrote:
Pharaoh wrote:In this Draft they're all likely complimentary players though.

Edwards, Ball & Wiseman are the only dudes who are currently viewed as more than that right now.

I've seen Okongwu mocked as high as 4th because despite the idea that bigs are dead you still need size!


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He's a complementary player in that he's very limited on offense and has no ability to create it. He'd likely be the #4 guy on offense, at best, on a successful team. The Pistons' first, second, and third needs are guys who can create offense. In terms of the future, they're desperately short on those.

Pharoah wrote:Who knows if he'll be the BPA but if he is we aren't in a position to ignore him just because he's a big.

BJK1 wrote:Agreed. In a what is largely considered a draft that’s light on elite talent, a team that is devoid of talent in general like the Pistons should take the best player available regardless of position.


Best player available isn't determined in a vacuum; it's particular to each individual team. In the context of the Pistons' particular needs, Okongwu will not be the best player available at #7 in any scenario.

Maybe he becomes a core player, maybe he becomes a complimentary player, or maybe he’s a piece that allows you to eventually trade for a difference maker. Be shrewd in accumulating talent and the rest will fall into place.


That mindset is fine so long as a long, multi-year rebuild is the plan from the outset. But very rarely does any team commit to such; where recent examples are concerned, only the Sixers come to mind. For any team that isn't fully intent on waiting five years, specific needs take precedence.
Maybe but if we're going team needs first then BPA regardless of position is the go.

I don't believe any team needs to commit to a 5 year plan - that's far too long!

A realistic goal for us is to be a up & coming team just as Blake comes off the books, so the 22-23 season.

2020 - #7 & buy a late first (Flynn)

Retain Wood at a reasonable price
Sign Giles at a reasonable price for 3 years

Wood - Patton
Blake - (Sekou) - Giles
Sekou - Svi - Snell
Luke - Vassell (7)
Brown - Rose - Flynn

2021 - hope for a top 5 pick and get a stud wing.

Retain Luke on a reasonable deal

Wood - Patton
Blake - (Sekou) - Giles
Sekou - Top 5 - Svi
Luke - Vassell
Brown - Flynn - Bone

2022 Draft - hoping for a stud PG

Wood, Patton, Giles
Sekou, Giles, (Top 5 2021)
Top 5 2021, Vassell, Svi
Luke, (Vassell), Brown
2022 PG, Flynn, Bone

That would mean that in 3 years Weaver and his FO have only retained Wood, Sekou, Luke, Svi, Brown & Bone from what they inherited.

And the end result (hopefully) would be a young, up and coming team that's versatile on both ends of the floor.



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Here I am trying to work on an ideal offseason plan, and you’re dropping a 3 year plan. Nice
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#958 » by Manocad » Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:27 am

DetroitSho wrote:
Manocad wrote:
DetroitSho wrote:Maybe I'm missing something, but is there a post prior to the previously discussed exchange where RMFC actually used the verbiage "whatever it takes"? Because if not, WTF was that whole convo?

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That was my mistake. I misconstrued “The Pistons should do their best to get that #2 pick from GS” as meaning doing whatever it takes to get the #2 pick. Apparently it means to not do what it would take to get the #2 pick if it means overpaying which, by most accounts, it would.

So if the Pistons do their best to get the pick by not doing what it takes to get the pick but somehow get the pick, they should apparently draft Anthony Edwards because he is the only player in this draft who can create offense off the dribble. Why that’s more Important than keeping assets, taking the BPA at 7, and finding a player who can create offense off the dribble in next year’s draft was not explained.

That’s it in a nutshell.
Over the course of the 11 months of this thread, and specifically since the draft lottery, there's been several posts about trading up to get Anthony Edwards. It's just a little beyond weird that you singled out this particular instance to nitpick.

Context is already kind of implied when discussing the moves the team should make that they should be within reason. Well, unless a person actually DOES say "whatever it takes".

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Troll much? :lol:

It wasn't beyond weird at all. That happened to be the post I saw. :dontknow:

Certainly you're aware that the implied context of almost every topic in this forum at this point is "how can the Pistons get better?" And certainly you're also aware that it is quite common for posters to ask other posters why they would make the particular draft pick, trade, free agent signing, etc. being suggested. Because it's also already kind of implied that the poster suggesting said move has an answer if asked that question after posting "draft this guy" with no other detail, and it's also kind of implied that the answer is something beyond "because he's good/it will make the team better." So what's beyond weird is that anyone finds asking the question (paraphrased) "What's the bigger picture reasoning for this move?" beyond weird or trolling. Generally that information is provided rather than just "draft this guy" but whatever; no detail was provided so I asked why.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#959 » by JosephMamah » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:59 pm

Pharaoh wrote:
JosephMamah wrote:Hayes
Haliburton

Okongwu


Vassel
Okoro

(If we trade back)
Lewis
Bey
Maxey
Hampton


Don't want anything to do with
Edwards
Ball
Wiseman
Toppin
That's bold!

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Edwards... questionable motor, low bball iq, poor shooting efficiency, doesn't like to play defense. The kid sounds like Corey Maggette 2.0 to me.

Wiseman sounds a little too similar to Drummond for my liking.

Ball comes with the Lavar circus, and he's also an inefficient shooter, with chucker tendencies,
that doesn't want to play any defense.

Toppins a late bloomer who played in a mediocre conference, so I'm not really sure if he'll be good enough offensively against NBA players to make up for his defensive shortcomings. He's probably the guy I'd be least upset with of this group though, if the Pistons took him.
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Re: Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread 

Post#960 » by DBC10 » Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:58 pm

Anyways

What do people think about Aleksej Pokusevski? I've just heard about him today being a international hype machine that can sort of do it all on the offensive end and is crazy young. Likely a big reach at 7 but he reminds me of a poorman's mix of Porzingis and Jokic in feel of the game a little bit. But I wouldn't be shocked if he goes 4 to 10 considering how much emphasis is placed on smart and crafty Euros these days and this draft being a complete crapshoot in raw talent

Which would already make him the best bigman we have on the roster, which isn't to say it's much but it does provide a decent prospective

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