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Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo

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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#21 » by Drwho17 » Thu Oct 1, 2020 4:48 pm

Laimbeer wrote:Buzz is Lamelo is going number one. Wade-lite apparently has an intangibles issue.

Buzz from who? Minnesota trying to drum up value, right now I consider Edwards a done deal to go to Minnesota, BPA and best fit. They aren't real worried about attitudes up there anyway, see KAT and Russell.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#22 » by Crymson » Sat Oct 3, 2020 12:53 am

LaMelo has noted that he has no intention of altering his shot form, and ditched the combine without participating in any official team interviews.

Even if the Pistons were in a position to select him, I'd trade out instead. I have nothing but bad feelings about that guy.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#23 » by 440BB » Sat Oct 3, 2020 12:10 pm

Between the drama his dad brings, the funky shot and playing in remote leagues, LaMelo is not a player I would want on the Pistons. We need hungry players, not entitled players groomed for a payday.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#24 » by MotownMadness » Sat Oct 3, 2020 1:10 pm

Wish he could at least play some defense like his brother. He looks like hes gonna be a elite passer at 6'7 but that shot is broke to go along with no defense (or give a crap to try)
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#25 » by Southern Piston » Sat Oct 3, 2020 9:25 pm

ANyone think we get horford, the 1st, and Richardson for Griffin and Sivi, now that Doc Rivers is there
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#26 » by rmfc » Sat Oct 3, 2020 9:42 pm

Southern Piston wrote:ANyone think we get horford, the 1st, and Richardson for Griffin and Sivi, now that Doc Rivers is there


Isn't Doc the one that traded Griffin to the Pistons?
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#27 » by Pharaoh » Sat Oct 3, 2020 11:16 pm

Anyone that believes we could get anything of value for Griff hasn't been paying attention.

We're stuck with him for a while

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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#28 » by Pandev » Sun Oct 4, 2020 10:02 am

Miami could really use Blake Griffin about right now.

They’re going to need another bonafide star alongside Butler if they’re going to make it out of the East again next season.

I think all teams right on the cusp of the Finals could be on the lookout for a Blake deal.

Just a question of what young talent we could get back. I’d want Nunn back and salary fillers ala Jones Jr
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#29 » by vege » Sun Oct 4, 2020 3:18 pm

Pharaoh wrote:Anyone that believes we could get anything of value for Griff hasn't been paying attention.

We're stuck with him for a while

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No. We'd need to pay to get rid of him. We're stuck with him.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#30 » by Canadafan » Sun Oct 4, 2020 7:03 pm

vege wrote:
Pharaoh wrote:Anyone that believes we could get anything of value for Griff hasn't been paying attention.

We're stuck with him for a while

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No. We'd need to pay to get rid of him. We're stuck with him.


If he stays healthy and produces, maybe at 2022trade deadline we can get a 1st for him lol
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#31 » by Crymson » Mon Oct 5, 2020 2:45 pm

I'm surprised to see continued talk about a Griffin trade at all, let alone one that gains assets for the Pistons. Folks, the Pistons made a heinously stupid mistake in trading for Griffin in the first place. Two-and-a-half-years, 62 missed games, two major injuries, and an entire wiped-out season later, nobody's going to take him on unless the Pistons pay them to do so.

Southern Piston wrote:ANyone think we get horford, the 1st, and Richardson for Griffin and Sivi, now that Doc Rivers is there


That would be a horrible trade for the Sixers, who---as it has been noted here multiple times---would be a stupendously bad fit for Griffin even if his health were not an issue at all.

Pharaoh wrote:Anyone that believes we could get anything of value for Griff hasn't been paying attention.

We're stuck with him for a while

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Correct. The Clippers utterly fleeced the Pistons to begin with. Nobody else was lining up to take that contract even before two more knee injuries and the worst season of his career. Meanwhile, Griffin's slow-paced, antiquated style of offense, poor off-ball utility and inability to switch on defense have made him yet more obsolete as time passes. The fact is that 2018-2019, Third-Team All-NBA Blake Griffin was not good enough to be the centerpiece of a truly successful team, and he cannot play in any way that does not feature him as the centerpiece. And that's if he could stay healthy, and he can't. Why ever trade for a guy whom you've absolutely got to play around yet isn't a championship-winning superstar, is almost guaranteed to miss substantial time, and is paid a huge salary?

Not happening. I can't even see a fit for him on any current playoff team. They're all better off without him.

Pandev wrote:Miami could really use Blake Griffin about right now.

They’re going to need another bonafide star alongside Butler if they’re going to make it out of the East again next season.

I think all teams right on the cusp of the Finals could be on the lookout for a Blake deal.


Griffin and Butler would see severe role overlap, and Butler is more valuable. Avoiding talent overlap with expensive players is extremely important. Van Gundy ignored that maxim, but that's because he was incompetent and desperate. And I don't know why all of these trade proposals ignore the fact that he's constantly injured.

No team on the cusp of the finals will be looking for a Griffin trade. They'd need to dump useful players for a guy who can't remain healthy and doesn't fit.

Canadafan wrote:If he stays healthy and produces, maybe at 2022trade deadline we can get a 1st for him lol


Maybe the 25th-30th pick, but it would be difficult for anyone to match salaries. Anyone who did would also be bowing out of the big 2021 free-agent class for the sake of a player who could very well just end up injured the next season.

There's also the fact that if he stays healthy and produces, he'll have probably helped the rebuilding Pistons vault out of a high draft position.

The likelihood of a happy outcome for the Pistons in this situation is low.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#32 » by vege » Tue Oct 6, 2020 12:50 am

Canadafan wrote:
vege wrote:
Pharaoh wrote:Anyone that believes we could get anything of value for Griff hasn't been paying attention.

We're stuck with him for a while

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No. We'd need to pay to get rid of him. We're stuck with him.


If he stays healthy and produces, maybe at 2022trade deadline we can get a 1st for him lol


Rose played at an all star level and was healthy all season and he's on a cheap deal and we couldn't get any offers to make us want to deal him. Blake is owed a massive ammount of money, even when he's an expiring, he's not getting any younger and he has missed several seasons with several injuries at this point.

He'll either play his entire contract here, or we'll eventually buy him out so he can compete somewhere else. He's like a 2.0 post injury McDyess/Grant Hill at this point imo.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#33 » by Pharaoh » Tue Oct 6, 2020 3:23 am

vege wrote:
Canadafan wrote:
vege wrote:
No. We'd need to pay to get rid of him. We're stuck with him.


If he stays healthy and produces, maybe at 2022trade deadline we can get a 1st for him lol


Rose played at an all star level and was healthy all season and he's on a cheap deal and we couldn't get any offers to make us want to deal him. Blake is owed a massive ammount of money, even when he's an expiring, he's not getting any younger and he has missed several seasons with several injuries at this point.

He'll either play his entire contract here, or we'll eventually buy him out so he can compete somewhere else. He's like a 2.0 post injury McDyess/Grant Hill at this point imo.
That's a insult to Pistons McDyess and Phoenix Hill. Both those players were quality and accepted their reduced role.

From all interviews Blake still believes he's the #1 gun on a playoff contending team!

That's just sad!

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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#34 » by Crymson » Tue Oct 6, 2020 3:25 am

vege wrote:Rose played at an all star level and was healthy all season and he's on a cheap deal and we couldn't get any offers to make us want to deal him. Blake is owed a massive ammount of money, even when he's an expiring, he's not getting any younger and he has missed several seasons with several injuries at this point.

He'll either play his entire contract here, or we'll eventually buy him out so he can compete somewhere else. He's like a 2.0 post injury McDyess/Grant Hill at this point imo.


To be fair, the Pistons were asking a lottery pick for Rose at the deadline. The front office was perfectly happy to keep him absent an excellent offer. And he did not play at an all-star level. 18 points per game on average efficiency isn't all that great for so heavily ball-dominant a point guard as Rose.

That said, the gap in value between he and Griffin is immense. It'll remain so even should Griffin come back healthy next season (which is, unfortunately, probably the worst-case scenario for the Pistons), as Blake is now forever painted by the injury brush: nobody will ever trust in his health again. I doubt the Pistons will buy him out unless he's willing to leave an enormous amount of that $38 million final season on the table. He and the Pistons are almost certainly stuck with each other for the duration of his contract, as he'd need to write off a ton of money to leave the team prior to its expiration.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#35 » by ByeByeDre » Tue Oct 6, 2020 4:24 am

In 21/22, Blake’s contract could fetch some picks along with terrible contracts. The Pistons may want to go that route if all their first rounders this year don’t pan out.

I mean, our one first rounder.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#36 » by Crymson » Tue Oct 6, 2020 5:12 am

ByeByeDre wrote:In 21/22, Blake’s contract could fetch some picks along with terrible contracts. The Pistons may want to go that route if all their first rounders this year don’t pan out.

I mean, our one first rounder.


Teams don't pay draft picks for a gigantic one-year contract in return. That's a delayed salary dump. There was a great deal of hooplah about the assets to be gained last season from the team's expiring contracts, and those predictably amounted to nothing beyond an unusual trade for Leuer. Nobody's going to take on Griffin and stretch that giant final year of his.

Pharaoh wrote:
From all interviews Blake still believes he's the #1 gun on a playoff contending team!

That's just sad!


I'm not sure if he believes that; either way, the result will be poor for the Pistons if he hits the floor. Casey respects his veterans to a fault, so Griffin will get top billing from him even if it forces the Pistons into an old-fashioned offense and stunts the development of the youngsters.

Lose-lose. Awful trade.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#37 » by Pharaoh » Tue Oct 6, 2020 6:56 am

In a ideal world Blake sees the writing in the wall and chooses to take a step back, lead the young guys and be a mentor that plays less than 30 minutes every night.

Wood 30 - Patton 18
Blake 28 - Sekou 20
Sekou 10 - Okoro 30 - Svi 8
Luke 28 - Svi 15 - Brown 5
Brown 20 - Rose 28

9-man rotation where hopefully a line up of Wood, Sekou, Okoro, Luke, Brown gets to see a lot of minutes together.

I think in that scenario we've got:

1 - a multitude of "secondary playmakers" on the floor simultaneously

2 - Luke in that line up is at best the 2nd, 3rd or 4th option and as the season wore on I'd be looking at him being the JJ Redick of that group.

3 - depending on the development of Wood & Sekou defensively we'd be looking at a group that can guard multiple positions

FMD I gotta watch some other draftees cause I'm fixated on Okoro way too much

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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#38 » by ByeByeDre » Tue Oct 6, 2020 1:43 pm

Crymson wrote:
ByeByeDre wrote:In 21/22, Blake’s contract could fetch some picks along with terrible contracts. The Pistons may want to go that route if all their first rounders this year don’t pan out.

I mean, our one first rounder.


Teams don't pay draft picks for a gigantic one-year contract in return. That's a delayed salary dump. There was a great deal of hooplah about the assets to be gained last season from the team's expiring contracts, and those predictably amounted to nothing beyond an unusual trade for Leuer. Nobody's going to take on Griffin and stretch that giant final year of his.

Pharaoh wrote:
From all interviews Blake still believes he's the #1 gun on a playoff contending team!

That's just sad!


I'm not sure if he believes that; either way, the result will be poor for the Pistons if he hits the floor. Casey respects his veterans to a fault, so Griffin will get top billing from him even if it forces the Pistons into an old-fashioned offense and stunts the development of the youngsters.

Lose-lose. Awful trade.


Read more carefully
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#39 » by Billl » Tue Oct 6, 2020 1:44 pm

I just hope our front office has a realistic valuation of our current guys. D Rose can be an asset for some team, but not a rebuilding team like us.
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Re: Pistons looking to add Lonzo AND Lamelo 

Post#40 » by Crymson » Tue Oct 6, 2020 3:00 pm

ByeByeDre wrote:Read more carefully


I read it well. You're suggesting that the Pistons could trade the final season of Griffin's deal in exchange for picks and bad contracts. That is very unlikely to happen. As I said, teams aren't going to spend assets for the sake of a one-year-delayed salary dump. Also, good luck finding a team with multiple contracts bad enough and worth enough aggregate money that they'd do such a thing and have the ability to match salaries in the process.

Like I said, we've all seen that last season's talk of expiring contracts and the supposed value they carried turned out to be predictably empty. The Leuer deal, which was a very irregular piece of work, was the sole product of those. And given that the Pistons had to take on Snell in the bargain, they didn't even really end up ahead on that one.

Pharaoh wrote:In a ideal world Blake sees the writing in the wall and chooses to take a step back, lead the young guys and be a mentor that plays less than 30 minutes every night.

Wood 30 - Patton 18
Blake 28 - Sekou 20
Sekou 10 - Okoro 30 - Svi 8
Luke 28 - Svi 15 - Brown 5
Brown 20 - Rose 28

9-man rotation where hopefully a line up of Wood, Sekou, Okoro, Luke, Brown gets to see a lot of minutes together.

I think in that scenario we've got:

1 - a multitude of "secondary playmakers" on the floor simultaneously

2 - Luke in that line up is at best the 2nd, 3rd or 4th option and as the season wore on I'd be looking at him being the JJ Redick of that group.

3 - depending on the development of Wood & Sekou defensively we'd be looking at a group that can guard multiple positions

FMD I gotta watch some other draftees cause I'm fixated on Okoro way too much

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That lineup has one secondary playmaker in Luke. Brown ain't a secondary playmaker. He can pass, but that ability is neutralized by his non-threat as a scorer and he ain't a maestro at it to begin with. Casey said recently in any event that he considers the experiment of Bruce at point guard to be over. Maybe that'll change, but as of last season Brown does not have the skills to play effectively at point guard. Luke is wasted in that group, because playing with Blake automatically kicks him into an off-ball role. Wood is what he is on defense at this stage. He's a passable not not very agile perimeter defender and he's decent but not particularly good at protecting the interior. Patton's salary for next season is not guaranteed, and he managed in the recent mini-camp to get himself injured yet again; he missed almost the entire event. As you've constructed the bench, it has only a single proven three-point shooter.

That lineup would be bad enough to fall short of any meaningful success but probably good enough to kick the Pistons out of the high lottery. Nightmare scenario. This is another reason why having Blake around sucks so much.

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