ImageImageImage

Rank our assets!

Moderators: dVs33, Snakebites, theBigLip

User avatar
bstein14
RealGM
Posts: 22,476
And1: 2,516
Joined: Jun 22, 2001
Contact:

Rank our assets! 

Post#1 » by bstein14 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:03 am

I know its early in the season, but lets rank our assets. I know we probably have the least valuable assets as a team in the entire NBA.

Take into consideration production, potential, age, contract, etc.

1.Bey
2. Hayes(hard to call here from what we've seen but I don't think he's more valuable on the market than Bey now)
3. Rose (Expiring + late first? perhaps only 2 2nds as he seems to be worse than last season)
4. Jackson (cheap 2 year deal and showing he can play)
5. Stewart
6. Grant (playing well but $20 million contract means would be hard to trade for more than expiring/late first)
7. SVI (bargain deal, great shooter)
8. Sekou (young, rookie deal, still has potential)
9. Wright
10 .Plumlee
11. Lee
12. Ellington
13. Okafor
14. Blake
Invictus88
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,318
And1: 454
Joined: Jun 25, 2013

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#2 » by Invictus88 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:32 am

I'm defining an asset as anyone whose production value is currently or likely to eclipse what we pay them in dollars.

So:
1. Bey
2. Jackson
3. Rose
4. Hayes (He goes higher than Rose if he is deemed healthy anytime soon; He drops if he needs surgery)
5. Stewart
6. Sekou (he goes higher if he ever gets out of Casey's doghouse)
7. Svi
8. Grant. (His good games have him playing closer to his price tag, but his price tag is high).
9. Lee

No one else has positive trade value potential IMO.

EDIT: I forgot to include draft picks in this list and I'm too lazy to do the math/research/thinking w/regards to how much they get paid vs. what they would net in return. The 2021 first we have is obviously the most valuable thing we own right now based on our current trajectory. Beyond that I'm not bothering to figure out :)
User avatar
ElectricMayhem
General Manager
Posts: 8,344
And1: 7,703
Joined: Jul 01, 2006
Location: Kobe-Osaka

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#3 » by ElectricMayhem » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:41 am

1. Grant: I think he's showing that he provides full value for his contract.
2. Bey: Showing a tremendous amount of potential, albeit with a small sample size.
3. Jackson: He's just continuing what he started in Memphis. He can play and he seems to have matured.
4. Hayes: He's shown that he's a project but he still has high upside.
5. Sekou: His highs have been quite high. He needs a coach that's going to just let him play.
6. Rose: He has high value to teams who need someone who can help them win this year.
7. Svi: Shooting is a premium skill and he has it.
8: Stewart: He's an energy guy. I love what he brings but I'm not sure he has a super high ceiling.
9: Wright: Competent but you can get a player like him anywhere.
10: Plumlee: Overpaid, but does the right thing and prepares and plays the right way.
11: Ellington: He's a known shooter so a team who needs that could possibly be interested in him.
12: Lee: Hasn't really shown he's an NBA-caliber player yet.
13: Okafor: One of the worst defensive players I've seen out there. Offense is nothing to write home about either. Net negative.
14: Blake: He launches threes, slowly and gingerly backs down players in the post, and can whip passes to open guys. Nobody's gonna pay $37 mil for that this year and $39 mil for that next year.
At the end of the day, it's not about wins and losses. Teamwork, fair play, and good sportsmanship make champions of us all.

Tom Gores: Sell Securus or sell the Pistons.
User avatar
Mr. Krabs
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,501
And1: 223
Joined: Feb 24, 2008

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#4 » by Mr. Krabs » Fri Jan 8, 2021 10:25 am

1. Bey: Rookie contract, already a solid 3&D guy.
2. Jackson: Cheap contract, young.
3. Sekou: Still extremely young and has the biggest potential,
4. Grant: Looks like he can be an allstar
5. Rose: There has to be a team out there to get him for playoffs
6: Stewart: Good rotation big on a rookie contract
7. Svi: Shooter
8: Plumlee: Steady big
9: Ellington: Shooter
10: Hayes: Worst starter in the league, loses first year of rookie contract due to major injury, no relevant intangibles to make him a valuable asset
11: Okafor: Could be an offensive boost off the bench based on matchup
12: Wright: Have no idea what he does on the court
13: Lee: G-league
14: Blake: Negative value due to contract
User avatar
Pharaoh
RealGM
Posts: 13,627
And1: 3,499
Joined: Aug 10, 2001

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#5 » by Pharaoh » Fri Jan 8, 2021 12:09 pm

1 = our unprotected 2021 pick

2 = Bey - rookie contract

3 = Hayes - rookie contract

4 = Stewart - rookie contract

5 = Rose - expiring deal, proven scorer

6 = Plumlee - less than the MLE

IF we wanted to be a treadmill team we wouldn't be going down this path but:

A combination of the above could get us a real stud, attempting to once again chase some weird goal Gores used to have.

I do believe it's now safe to say Weaver came here with a plan, executed that (despite some seriously weird choices and cap gymnastics I'll never understand) and has us in a really good position moving forward:

Plumlee - Stewart
Grant - Sekou (Blake)
Bey - Grant - Sekou - Jackson
Jackson - Svi - Hayes
Cade/Suggs - Hayes

That's a 9-man rotation I can get behind next season, one that should once again lose a lot of games while "competing to win"






Sent from my SM-G781B using RealGM mobile app
NYPiston
Junior
Posts: 426
And1: 307
Joined: Jun 21, 2019

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#6 » by NYPiston » Fri Jan 8, 2021 2:33 pm

I'm surprised there's only one mention of the draft pick...

1) 2021 1st round pick - BY FAR their most valuable asset and arguably one of the most valuable assets in the league
2) 2022 1st round pick - BY FAR their 2nd most valuable asset
I would add the 2023 1st but that's looking too far ahead...




3) Hayes - Rookie Contract, I'm not going to throw him down the list because of a struggle to start his rookie season. He still has the tools to be a really good point guard. The injury is the wild card in relation to value.
4) Bey - Rookie contract, showing that he can play well in the league already, 3 and D guys are really valuable
5) Jackson - This is assuming that he keeps up this level of play, very cheap contract for 2 years is a real asset
6) Rose - If he keeps scoring at a reasonably high level and, more importantly, stays healthy I don't think it's unreasonable for Weaver to land a late 1st for him, assuming they are willing to trade him which I'm still skeptical about
7) Stewart - Rookie contract, is showing that he can at least play a little as a rotational guy
8) Grant - Very good start to the season but I still think that contract would be hard to move since the team trading for him would likely see him as a #3/#4 option. Doesn't matter because they aren't trading him which I'm fine with.
9) Svi - Shooters always have value but what will his next contract look like?
10) Plumlee - I don't how much value he has with 3 years on the deal but Plumlee at that price for 2 years could be tradeable for something.










-100) Griffin - He's a buyout candidate this offseason. Arguably the worst contract in the league currently. I loved Blake two seasons ago but he looks crippled out there now, too bad.
User avatar
bstein14
RealGM
Posts: 22,476
And1: 2,516
Joined: Jun 22, 2001
Contact:

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#7 » by bstein14 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 6:22 pm

NYPiston wrote:I'm surprised there's only one mention of the draft pick...

1) 2021 1st round pick - BY FAR their most valuable asset and arguably one of the most valuable assets in the league
2) 2022 1st round pick - BY FAR their 2nd most valuable asset
I would add the 2023 1st but that's looking too far ahead...




3) Hayes - Rookie Contract, I'm not going to throw him down the list because of a struggle to start his rookie season. He still has the tools to be a really good point guard. The injury is the wild card in relation to value.
4) Bey - Rookie contract, showing that he can play well in the league already, 3 and D guys are really valuable
5) Jackson - This is assuming that he keeps up this level of play, very cheap contract for 2 years is a real asset
6) Rose - If he keeps scoring at a reasonably high level and, more importantly, stays healthy I don't think it's unreasonable for Weaver to land a late 1st for him, assuming they are willing to trade him which I'm still skeptical about
7) Stewart - Rookie contract, is showing that he can at least play a little as a rotational guy
8) Grant - Very good start to the season but I still think that contract would be hard to move since the team trading for him would likely see him as a #3/#4 option. Doesn't matter because they aren't trading him which I'm fine with.
9) Svi - Shooters always have value but what will his next contract look like?
10) Plumlee - I don't how much value he has with 3 years on the deal but Plumlee at that price for 2 years could be tradeable for something.










-100) Griffin - He's a buyout candidate this offseason. Arguably the worst contract in the league currently. I loved Blake two seasons ago but he looks crippled out there now, too bad.


We can't trade our pick right now because we already owe it to the rockets, so it's not really an asset until you can trade it or draft someone with it.
User avatar
vege
RealGM
Posts: 15,279
And1: 1,623
Joined: Jul 18, 2008
Location: Fire Troy Weaver

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#8 » by vege » Fri Jan 8, 2021 6:32 pm

bstein14 wrote:
NYPiston wrote:I'm surprised there's only one mention of the draft pick...

1) 2021 1st round pick - BY FAR their most valuable asset and arguably one of the most valuable assets in the league
2) 2022 1st round pick - BY FAR their 2nd most valuable asset
I would add the 2023 1st but that's looking too far ahead...




3) Hayes - Rookie Contract, I'm not going to throw him down the list because of a struggle to start his rookie season. He still has the tools to be a really good point guard. The injury is the wild card in relation to value.
4) Bey - Rookie contract, showing that he can play well in the league already, 3 and D guys are really valuable
5) Jackson - This is assuming that he keeps up this level of play, very cheap contract for 2 years is a real asset
6) Rose - If he keeps scoring at a reasonably high level and, more importantly, stays healthy I don't think it's unreasonable for Weaver to land a late 1st for him, assuming they are willing to trade him which I'm still skeptical about
7) Stewart - Rookie contract, is showing that he can at least play a little as a rotational guy
8) Grant - Very good start to the season but I still think that contract would be hard to move since the team trading for him would likely see him as a #3/#4 option. Doesn't matter because they aren't trading him which I'm fine with.
9) Svi - Shooters always have value but what will his next contract look like?
10) Plumlee - I don't how much value he has with 3 years on the deal but Plumlee at that price for 2 years could be tradeable for something.










-100) Griffin - He's a buyout candidate this offseason. Arguably the worst contract in the league currently. I loved Blake two seasons ago but he looks crippled out there now, too bad.


We can't trade our pick right now because we already owe it to the rockets, so it's not really an asset until you can trade it or draft someone with it.


We can trade our pick, but we need to add some weird protections to it.
Invictus88
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,318
And1: 454
Joined: Jun 25, 2013

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#9 » by Invictus88 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 7:30 pm

vege wrote:
bstein14 wrote:
NYPiston wrote:I'm surprised there's only one mention of the draft pick...

1) 2021 1st round pick - BY FAR their most valuable asset and arguably one of the most valuable assets in the league
2) 2022 1st round pick - BY FAR their 2nd most valuable asset
I would add the 2023 1st but that's looking too far ahead...




3) Hayes - Rookie Contract, I'm not going to throw him down the list because of a struggle to start his rookie season. He still has the tools to be a really good point guard. The injury is the wild card in relation to value.
4) Bey - Rookie contract, showing that he can play well in the league already, 3 and D guys are really valuable
5) Jackson - This is assuming that he keeps up this level of play, very cheap contract for 2 years is a real asset
6) Rose - If he keeps scoring at a reasonably high level and, more importantly, stays healthy I don't think it's unreasonable for Weaver to land a late 1st for him, assuming they are willing to trade him which I'm still skeptical about
7) Stewart - Rookie contract, is showing that he can at least play a little as a rotational guy
8) Grant - Very good start to the season but I still think that contract would be hard to move since the team trading for him would likely see him as a #3/#4 option. Doesn't matter because they aren't trading him which I'm fine with.
9) Svi - Shooters always have value but what will his next contract look like?
10) Plumlee - I don't how much value he has with 3 years on the deal but Plumlee at that price for 2 years could be tradeable for something.










-100) Griffin - He's a buyout candidate this offseason. Arguably the worst contract in the league currently. I loved Blake two seasons ago but he looks crippled out there now, too bad.


We can't trade our pick right now because we already owe it to the rockets, so it's not really an asset until you can trade it or draft someone with it.


We can trade our pick, but we need to add some weird protections to it.


Yeah. I didn't want to go down the rabbit hole of including draft picks into the asset list. I guess I was just lazy :wink:
User avatar
mrroboto4889
Sophomore
Posts: 182
And1: 17
Joined: Mar 14, 2004
Location: On top of the world with the Detroit Pistons

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#10 » by mrroboto4889 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 2:06 pm

vege wrote:
bstein14 wrote:
NYPiston wrote:I'm surprised there's only one mention of the draft pick...

1) 2021 1st round pick - BY FAR their most valuable asset and arguably one of the most valuable assets in the league
2) 2022 1st round pick - BY FAR their 2nd most valuable asset
I would add the 2023 1st but that's looking too far ahead...




3) Hayes - Rookie Contract, I'm not going to throw him down the list because of a struggle to start his rookie season. He still has the tools to be a really good point guard. The injury is the wild card in relation to value.
4) Bey - Rookie contract, showing that he can play well in the league already, 3 and D guys are really valuable
5) Jackson - This is assuming that he keeps up this level of play, very cheap contract for 2 years is a real asset
6) Rose - If he keeps scoring at a reasonably high level and, more importantly, stays healthy I don't think it's unreasonable for Weaver to land a late 1st for him, assuming they are willing to trade him which I'm still skeptical about
7) Stewart - Rookie contract, is showing that he can at least play a little as a rotational guy
8) Grant - Very good start to the season but I still think that contract would be hard to move since the team trading for him would likely see him as a #3/#4 option. Doesn't matter because they aren't trading him which I'm fine with.
9) Svi - Shooters always have value but what will his next contract look like?
10) Plumlee - I don't how much value he has with 3 years on the deal but Plumlee at that price for 2 years could be tradeable for something.










-100) Griffin - He's a buyout candidate this offseason. Arguably the worst contract in the league currently. I loved Blake two seasons ago but he looks crippled out there now, too bad.


We can't trade our pick right now because we already owe it to the rockets, so it's not really an asset until you can trade it or draft someone with it.


We can trade our pick, but we need to add some weird protections to it.


The problem is that there's already weird protections on. If it doesnt convey, it rolls over to the next season with gradually less protection until like 2027 when it would become a 2nd rounder. So we wouldnt know if it would violate the Stepian Rule until after that. Fairly certain we cant trade a 1st for a very long time.

I'm not going to the trouble of ranking assets but I'm seeing alot of recency bias. Keep in mind that Bey is 21, Sekou is 19, and Hayes is 18. If the team didnt suck, Sekou and Hayes would be developing in the G League. I have to assume they'll look better in a couple years. And conversely, Bey wouldve looked terrible had he declared 2 years ago.
User avatar
Han Solo
General Manager
Posts: 9,239
And1: 6,632
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Contact:
     

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#11 » by Han Solo » Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:51 pm

Grant is worth a lottery pick already. He’s an all star caliber player in his prime. On a bargain deal for what he is.
User avatar
Han Solo
General Manager
Posts: 9,239
And1: 6,632
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Contact:
     

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#12 » by Han Solo » Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:52 pm

And for the record, I don’t want Grant traded at all. Even if we land Cade Cunningham next year, Grant will help us be better quicker. Gives us everything you need from a forward and he could even continue to progress.
User avatar
vege
RealGM
Posts: 15,279
And1: 1,623
Joined: Jul 18, 2008
Location: Fire Troy Weaver

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#13 » by vege » Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:54 pm

mrroboto4889 wrote:
vege wrote:
bstein14 wrote:
We can't trade our pick right now because we already owe it to the rockets, so it's not really an asset until you can trade it or draft someone with it.


We can trade our pick, but we need to add some weird protections to it.


The problem is that there's already weird protections on. If it doesnt convey, it rolls over to the next season with gradually less protection until like 2027 when it would become a 2nd rounder. So we wouldnt know if it would violate the Stepian Rule until after that. Fairly certain we cant trade a 1st for a very long time.

I'm not going to the trouble of ranking assets but I'm seeing alot of recency bias. Keep in mind that Bey is 21, Sekou is 19, and Hayes is 18. If the team didnt suck, Sekou and Hayes would be developing in the G League. I have to assume they'll look better in a couple years. And conversely, Bey wouldve looked terrible had he declared 2 years ago.


There is no problem, it's a fact, we CAN trade the pick, we just need to play with the protections. Period, there is no if or but, that pick will never be a lotto pick because of the protections.
MotownMadness
RealGM
Posts: 30,709
And1: 17,737
Joined: Oct 08, 2013
       

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#14 » by MotownMadness » Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:57 pm

Han Solo wrote:And for the record, I don’t want Grant traded at all. Even if we land Cade Cunningham next year, Grant will help us be better quicker. Gives us everything you need from a forward and he could even continue to progress.

If we land Cade I really dont care what direction we take. Build to win if you want or take your chances trying to luck into Emoni.
edmunder_prc
Pro Prospect
Posts: 786
And1: 425
Joined: Dec 06, 2015
   

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#15 » by edmunder_prc » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:13 pm

If Pistons are set on playing Blake at PF for 34 minutes a night, Pistons are a bottom 5 team.

On half of the plays he was guarding against the Bucks, he never went beyond the free throw line. Giannis/Lopez/Portis shot completely uncontested 3s and the Pistons were down 20 points.

Blake has to be in contention for the worst defender in the league.
MotownMadness
RealGM
Posts: 30,709
And1: 17,737
Joined: Oct 08, 2013
       

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#16 » by MotownMadness » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:24 pm

edmunder_prc wrote:If Pistons are set on playing Blake at PF for 34 minutes a night, Pistons are a bottom 5 team.

On half of the plays he was guarding against the Bucks, he never went beyond the free throw line. Giannis/Lopez/Portis shot completely uncontested 3s and the Pistons were down 20 points.

Blake has to be in contention for the worst defender in the league.

Honestly Blake has forced us into this position of tanking. Hes so ball dominant, he sucks and his salary stops us from trying to sign a bunch of treadmill players.

If he was off the team we would probably be back in that late lottery range at this point. He kinda stops us from doing anything stupid but instead forces a tank.
MotownMadness
RealGM
Posts: 30,709
And1: 17,737
Joined: Oct 08, 2013
       

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#17 » by MotownMadness » Fri Jan 15, 2021 5:28 pm

I wouldn't mind going the Dallas route if Cade is a star. Just trade some assets for a secondary cheaper star like they did with Zinger pair with him.

That's the formula for the league is two stars and build around them. Plus I hate the lottery odds and dont see us getting lucky twice at the top.

But if you could add Cade as a number 1 option and find that other 2nd option through trade with Grant as a 3rd option then were gonna be pretty good.
User avatar
Snakebites
Forum Mod - Pistons
Forum Mod - Pistons
Posts: 36,650
And1: 7,064
Joined: Jul 14, 2002
Location: Looking not-so-happily deranged
   

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#18 » by Snakebites » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:00 pm

Han Solo wrote:And for the record, I don’t want Grant traded at all. Even if we land Cade Cunningham next year, Grant will help us be better quicker. Gives us everything you need from a forward and he could even continue to progress.

I’d still prefer to see him traded personally, but it won’t happen.

The notion that Weaver would trade away his one big offseason hit in his first season with the club, the more I think of it, is absurd.
User avatar
Snakebites
Forum Mod - Pistons
Forum Mod - Pistons
Posts: 36,650
And1: 7,064
Joined: Jul 14, 2002
Location: Looking not-so-happily deranged
   

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#19 » by Snakebites » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:02 pm

MotownMadness wrote:I wouldn't mind going the Dallas route if Cade is a star. Just trade some assets for a secondary cheaper star like they did with Zinger pair with him.

That's the formula for the league is two stars and build around them. Plus I hate the lottery odds and dont see us getting lucky twice at the top.

But if you could add Cade as a number 1 option and find that other 2nd option through trade with Grant as a 3rd option then were gonna be pretty good.

Porzingis was a once in a lifetime trade.

The notion that a player that talented was moved for what he was moved is still kind of nuts to me. They didn’t get one blue chip asset for him. Basically some cap space and a couple of marginal young assets.

Saying you wanna go that route is like saying “yeah, winning the lottery seems like the fastest way to get rich, let’s just do that”.

I’m all for consolidating assets to get a good player if we draft a superstar, but expectations need to be managed.
MotownMadness
RealGM
Posts: 30,709
And1: 17,737
Joined: Oct 08, 2013
       

Re: Rank our assets! 

Post#20 » by MotownMadness » Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:06 pm

Snakebites wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:I wouldn't mind going the Dallas route if Cade is a star. Just trade some assets for a secondary cheaper star like they did with Zinger pair with him.

That's the formula for the league is two stars and build around them. Plus I hate the lottery odds and dont see us getting lucky twice at the top.

But if you could add Cade as a number 1 option and find that other 2nd option through trade with Grant as a 3rd option then were gonna be pretty good.

Porzingis was a once in a lifetime trade.

The notion that a player that talented was move for what he was moved is still kind of nuts to me. They didn’t get one blue chip asset for him.

Saying you wanna go that route is like saying “yeah, winning the lottery seems like the fastest way to get rich, let’s just do that”.

I’m all for consolidating assets to get a good player if we draft a superstar, but expectations need to be managed.

Yeah I actually cant even think of another player of that caliber that would come cheap enough like that without trading like 6 picks. Who knows though maybe something pops up eventually we can take advantage of but it needs to be a younger guy like Zinger as well so they can grow together.

Your right that really was a rare situation given his age, price and talent.

Return to Detroit Pistons