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Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!!

Moderators: dVs33, Snakebites, theBigLip

Grade the pick

A
61
88%
B
3
4%
C
3
4%
D
0
No votes
E
2
3%
 
Total votes: 69

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#121 » by mattao313 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:26 pm

I think we need another playmaker and a real big man. Cade is the only guy on the roster that can create for himself and others. Grant is purely a scorer/finisher on offense, Corey Joseph is very limited, and Killian is a decent passer but can't break the defense down or score. Stewart is just too small and unathletic to be s difference maker without refined basketball skills at center. Im ok with Cade not being the main ball handler but gotta get a better pg before that.

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#122 » by zeebneeb » Sat Nov 20, 2021 9:01 pm

DBC10 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:
Snakebites wrote:If you exclude those first 2 god-awful games (write them off as his preseason) then he’s averaging 16.7 ppg on 40% shooting and 33% from the three point line.

Still inefficient but that’s par for the course for a rookie perimeter player. I’d like to see his percentages go up and he needs to get to the line more if he’s going to be our main offensive weapon, but it’s a sufficiently impressive start.

He’d benefit from benching Killian. I know, I know.
Disagree with only the last part.

He'd benefit from removing Grant from the starting lineup.


I'm surprised to see you souring on Grant this early. Even though I know where you're coming from in terms of him taking shots away from Cade and the young guys.

I think he's still steady enough to not be a net negative. I wish he was more spot up shooter oriented instead of going for those mid range shots that teams are giving him
Perhaps I should clarify, which I did in a different thread. I like Grant. I actually really like Grant. He is an awesome weakside defender, plays good defense as a whole, and can get you a bucket in a myriad of ways.

I just don't like the fit next to Cade. Grant, when he receives the ball, has a tendency to stop, and stare at his defender for up to 5 seconds before he makes a move. This grinds the offense to a halt. This is not an opinion, this is what Grant does. If you have the ability to watch replays, it becomes alarmingly apparent, he is the exact opposite of Cade. Cade is on the move, dribbling, darting, driving, passing, e.t.c in a motion type offense. Grant is a good ISO player. Its water and oil out there, and it stunts what Cade is doing.

Cade is the type of player that raises the level of his supporting cast by a point or two, because he puts them in a position of success, by the way he drives the lane, by the way he dribbles, and, by the way/when he passes. Often times Grant will start his ISO move, after having stood for a few seconds, and if he isn't successful in breaking down his man, or if he's doubled, he throws a bad pass, or a pass with just seconds left on the clock.

Grant also straight line drives to the basket, which always results in less movement, as it cuts off running and cutting lanes for other players, so they all stand around waiting for the shot, or pass.

Now, with all that said, maybe Grant can evolve, and understand that he can't just stand still, waiting to receive the ball so he can go one on one. Cade thrives on movement form his teammates. It directly affects his drives, passes(another reason I so desperately want a springy bigman for lobs as a pressure release valve)and his shots. Grant.plays PF. It would be great if on offense he was nearer to the basket, for offensive rebounds, or lobs, but he loves to stand outside the three point line, so he can either shoot, or begin the slow process of breaking his man down.

This is what is breaking down Casey's offense to such a degree. It's Grant.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#123 » by Billl » Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:45 pm

Grant has played in multiple types of offenses and never had any issues moving or playing his role. He was really good moving without the ball in Denver and consistently was getting back door dunks. Casey just is calling iso after iso.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#124 » by edmunder_prc » Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:58 pm

First things first - we can all let out that sigh of relief.

Cade is going to be awesome. Once that 3-ball gets to high 30s% wise, he is going to be unstoppable. Defense will have to always go over the screen and lets pray that we can a big man like Wood that can catch lobs.

Cade in 2 years is going to be a monster if he as any talent at all around him. Pistons brick 30 threes a game, really, thats a true thing. If we werent so terrible at shooting, Cade would have 15 assist games.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#125 » by dVs33 » Sat Nov 20, 2021 11:05 pm

zeebneeb wrote:
DBC10 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:Disagree with only the last part.

He'd benefit from removing Grant from the starting lineup.


I'm surprised to see you souring on Grant this early. Even though I know where you're coming from in terms of him taking shots away from Cade and the young guys.

I think he's still steady enough to not be a net negative. I wish he was more spot up shooter oriented instead of going for those mid range shots that teams are giving him
Perhaps I should clarify, which I did in a different thread. I like Grant. I actually really like Grant. He is an awesome weakside defender, plays good defense as a whole, and can get you a bucket in a myriad of ways.

I just don't like the fit next to Cade. Grant, when he receives the ball, has a tendency to stop, and stare at his defender for up to 5 seconds before he makes a move. This grinds the offense to a halt. This is not an opinion, this is what Grant does. If you have the ability to watch replays, it becomes alarmingly apparent, he is the exact opposite of Cade. Cade is on the move, dribbling, darting, driving, passing, e.t.c in a motion type offense. Grant is a good ISO player. Its water and oil out there, and it stunts what Cade is doing.

Cade is the type of player that raises the level of his supporting cast by a point or two, because he puts them in a position of success, by the way he drives the lane, by the way he dribbles, and, by the way/when he passes. Often times Grant will start his ISO move, after having stood for a few seconds, and if he isn't successful in breaking down his man, or if he's doubled, he throws a bad pass, or a pass with just seconds left on the clock.

Grant also straight line drives to the basket, which always results in less movement, as it cuts off running and cutting lanes for other players, so they all stand around waiting for the shot, or pass.

Now, with all that said, maybe Grant can evolve, and understand that he can't just stand still, waiting to receive the ball so he can go one on one. Cade thrives on movement form his teammates. It directly affects his drives, passes(another reason I so desperately want a springy bigman for lobs as a pressure release valve)and his shots. Grant.plays PF. It would be great if on offense he was nearer to the basket, for offensive rebounds, or lobs, but he loves to stand outside the three point line, so he can either shoot, or begin the slow process of breaking his man down.

This is what is breaking down Casey's offense to such a degree. It's Grant.


I would guess grant is being asked to carry more of the offensive load while Cade and the others develop. I can see grant moving back into a number 2 or 3 option by the second half of the season. Grant is a security blanket for now.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#126 » by DetroitSho » Sun Nov 21, 2021 2:36 pm

dVs33 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:
DBC10 wrote:
I'm surprised to see you souring on Grant this early. Even though I know where you're coming from in terms of him taking shots away from Cade and the young guys.

I think he's still steady enough to not be a net negative. I wish he was more spot up shooter oriented instead of going for those mid range shots that teams are giving him
Perhaps I should clarify, which I did in a different thread. I like Grant. I actually really like Grant. He is an awesome weakside defender, plays good defense as a whole, and can get you a bucket in a myriad of ways.

I just don't like the fit next to Cade. Grant, when he receives the ball, has a tendency to stop, and stare at his defender for up to 5 seconds before he makes a move. This grinds the offense to a halt. This is not an opinion, this is what Grant does. If you have the ability to watch replays, it becomes alarmingly apparent, he is the exact opposite of Cade. Cade is on the move, dribbling, darting, driving, passing, e.t.c in a motion type offense. Grant is a good ISO player. Its water and oil out there, and it stunts what Cade is doing.

Cade is the type of player that raises the level of his supporting cast by a point or two, because he puts them in a position of success, by the way he drives the lane, by the way he dribbles, and, by the way/when he passes. Often times Grant will start his ISO move, after having stood for a few seconds, and if he isn't successful in breaking down his man, or if he's doubled, he throws a bad pass, or a pass with just seconds left on the clock.

Grant also straight line drives to the basket, which always results in less movement, as it cuts off running and cutting lanes for other players, so they all stand around waiting for the shot, or pass.

Now, with all that said, maybe Grant can evolve, and understand that he can't just stand still, waiting to receive the ball so he can go one on one. Cade thrives on movement form his teammates. It directly affects his drives, passes(another reason I so desperately want a springy bigman for lobs as a pressure release valve)and his shots. Grant.plays PF. It would be great if on offense he was nearer to the basket, for offensive rebounds, or lobs, but he loves to stand outside the three point line, so he can either shoot, or begin the slow process of breaking his man down.

This is what is breaking down Casey's offense to such a degree. It's Grant.


I would guess grant is being asked to carry more of the offensive load while Cade and the others develop. I can see grant moving back into a number 2 or 3 option by the second half of the season. Grant is a security blanket for now.
Nobody wants to see it that way. They expect it to be where Cade has the ball every waking second he's on the floor and he either gets the score or the assist.

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#127 » by Manocad » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:00 pm

Billl wrote:Grant has played in multiple types of offenses and never had any issues moving or playing his role. He was really good moving without the ball in Denver and consistently was getting back door dunks. Casey just is calling iso after iso.

Exactly. Casey’s offense more often than not is ball handler goes one on one, tries to drive for a score, kicks it back out for a three. Now that sounds great in theory if the ball handler’s intention is to draw the defense, kick it back out for an open 3, and the shooter hits it. However more often than not it’s a missed 3 or the ball handler doesn’t try to kick it out until he’s smothered and then can’t find a man for an open 3 and either makes a bad pass that results in a turnover or a just a handoff for an entire reset to try the same thing again.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#128 » by DetroitSho » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:09 pm

Manocad wrote:
Billl wrote:Grant has played in multiple types of offenses and never had any issues moving or playing his role. He was really good moving without the ball in Denver and consistently was getting back door dunks. Casey just is calling iso after iso.

Exactly. Casey’s offense more often than not is ball handler goes one on one, tries to drive for a score, kicks it back out for a three. Now that sounds great in theory if the ball handler’s intention is to draw the defense, kick it back out for an open 3, and the shooter hits it. However more often than not it’s a missed 3 or the ball handler doesn’t try to kick it out until he’s smothered and then can’t find a man for an open 3 and either makes a bad pass that results in a turnover or a just a handoff for an entire reset to try the same thing again.
No bruh, you don't understand. In the huddle Casey is drawing up plays for Cade on the dry erase board and Grant is literally erasing the board mid huddle and drawing up his own play to himself. At least that's the word around here.

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#129 » by FloridaMan78 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:35 pm

DetroitSho wrote:
Manocad wrote:
Billl wrote:Grant has played in multiple types of offenses and never had any issues moving or playing his role. He was really good moving without the ball in Denver and consistently was getting back door dunks. Casey just is calling iso after iso.

Exactly. Casey’s offense more often than not is ball handler goes one on one, tries to drive for a score, kicks it back out for a three. Now that sounds great in theory if the ball handler’s intention is to draw the defense, kick it back out for an open 3, and the shooter hits it. However more often than not it’s a missed 3 or the ball handler doesn’t try to kick it out until he’s smothered and then can’t find a man for an open 3 and either makes a bad pass that results in a turnover or a just a handoff for an entire reset to try the same thing again.
No bruh, you don't understand. In the huddle Casey is drawing up plays for Cade on the dry erase board and Grant is literally erasing the board mid huddle and drawing up his own play to himself. At least that's the word around here.

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Yea I saw an interview with James Edwards the Pistons beat writer and he said Casey has said some of Grant’s ISOs are him going rogue on a play and him doing his own thing.

Edit:Found it
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#130 » by Manocad » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:42 pm

DetroitSho wrote:
Manocad wrote:
Billl wrote:Grant has played in multiple types of offenses and never had any issues moving or playing his role. He was really good moving without the ball in Denver and consistently was getting back door dunks. Casey just is calling iso after iso.

Exactly. Casey’s offense more often than not is ball handler goes one on one, tries to drive for a score, kicks it back out for a three. Now that sounds great in theory if the ball handler’s intention is to draw the defense, kick it back out for an open 3, and the shooter hits it. However more often than not it’s a missed 3 or the ball handler doesn’t try to kick it out until he’s smothered and then can’t find a man for an open 3 and either makes a bad pass that results in a turnover or a just a handoff for an entire reset to try the same thing again.
No bruh, you don't understand. In the huddle Casey is drawing up plays for Cade on the dry erase board and Grant is literally erasing the board mid huddle and drawing up his own play to himself. At least that's the word around here.

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Aaah...got it. I need to look deeper.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#131 » by zeebneeb » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:25 pm

Kind of sensing an asshat tone from several posters i wouldn't have expected from.

Interesting.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#132 » by rmfc » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:16 pm

zeebneeb wrote:Kind of sensing an asshat tone from several posters i wouldn't have expected from.

Interesting.


Probably because they have always been just that and everything else was a facade?
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#133 » by breezypeezy » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:29 pm

Reading some of this is making me pretty pissed with Grant.
Don't fit with Cade, there's the door dirtbag.
Get on that page or move em out.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#134 » by Manocad » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:42 pm

zeebneeb wrote:Kind of sensing an asshat tone from several posters i wouldn't have expected from.

Interesting.

I don't think Grant is necessarily a bad fit with Cade at all and I don't think he's trying to establish himself as the #1 option, Cade be damned. It's more reasonable to me to believe that he's playing the way Casey is telling him to play. In Grant and Cade you have two guys who can both drive to the hole and hit the outside shot so I personally don't see any reason why they can't fit well together. Now, I see there's that video posted where Casey said sometimes Grant goes rogue but given the percentage of time Grant is pushing iso plays I struggle to believe that he's flipping the finger at Casey and doing that all the time because he wants to. Casey would certainly be in his ear about it if he didn't want Grant doing it as much as he does.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#135 » by BadMofoPimp » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:25 am

I don't look at it as Grant trying to be the #1 option. He just is sometimes because this team doesn't have one and he takes it upon himself at times being the team is one of the worst teams int he league. it happens. I am sure on a good team or when Detroit becomes one, he will make for a nice 3rd option. I see people complaining about vets taking too many shots on bottom tier teams on this board constantly. It happens when your team sucks.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#136 » by breezypeezy » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:56 am

breezypeezy wrote:Reading some of this is making me pretty pissed with Grant.
Don't fit with Cade, there's the door dirtbag.
Get on that page or move em out.

Ayyykarumba......this post didn't age too well.
Grant was destroying the Lakers for 3 quarters anyways.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#137 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:22 am

BadMofoPimp wrote:I don't look at it as Grant trying to be the #1 option. He just is sometimes because this team doesn't have one and he takes it upon himself at times being the team is one of the worst teams int he league. it happens. I am sure on a good team or when Detroit becomes one, he will make for a nice 3rd option. I see people complaining about vets taking too many shots on bottom tier teams on this board constantly. It happens when your team sucks.
This.

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#138 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:34 am

Interesting to see Cade outplay Scottie Barnes the last 5 games outside of 3 pt shooting. If Cade could just lay off the 3 pt attempts and go inside for contact, I think the game would open up even more for him.

Last 5 Games:
Cade- 16.6 pts 7.4 rebs 6.8 asts 2.0 stls 0.8 blks 39.5% fg 27.3% 3pt 87.5% ft in 35.2 mpg
Barnes- 10.2 pts 8.0 rebs 4.6 asts 0.8 stls 0.2 blks 35.2% fg 33.3% 3pt 64.7% ft in 34.8 mpg.
Green- 14.6 pts 3.2 rebs 1.8 asts 0.6 stls 0.0 blks 36.6% fg 28.6% 3pt 86.7 % ft in 32.0 mpg.

Will be interesting to see how these trends go, especially after Mobley comes back from injury, but for everyone talking about Cade's poor shooting, he's on par with the other top 5 guys.
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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#139 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:01 am

Cade's going to win ROY guys, just sit back and watch it happen.

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Re: Welcome to Detroit Cade Cunningham!!! 

Post#140 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:26 pm

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-weekly-awards-giannis-antetokounmpo-171923076.html?src=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

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Rookie of the Week: Cade Cunningham

Weekly stats: 18.3 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 7.5 apg, 2.7 spg, 39.4 FG%

After a slow start to his inaugural campaign, Cade Cunningham has really turned things around recently, playing some of the best basketball of his young career over the previous week.

Cunningham flashed his do-everything ability for the Detroit Pistons over the past week, scoring at a respectable level but also rebounding and playmaking very well for his position while playing a highly stingy level of defense.

Cunningham will still need to get more efficient as a scorer, as he shot under 40 percent from the floor last week and under 28 percent from three, but the signs are all there that he was right pick for Detroit at No. 1.

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