ImageImageImage

Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST

Moderators: dVs33, Snakebites, theBigLip

Pistonrings
Senior
Posts: 732
And1: 124
Joined: Jul 03, 2021
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#281 » by Pistonrings » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:33 am

Liqourish wrote:
Pistonrings wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
I know your love for Killian, but the team was better balanced tonight. If Stewart stays in the game, we might win this one. What we lack is another big man and shooters, neither of which include killian.

So when Killian was 3 boards short of a triple double while injured and on the road at Toronto, we would have been better off without him? He is obviously one of the best defenders on the team and is the best passer on the team. Thank goodness Weaver and Casey obviously think as I do about him.

Who said anything about Toronto? :lol: You said we win tonight with Killian. We lost due to lack of big bodies inside and shooting. Neither of which Killian brings to the table.

It sounded as if you were saying better for all games, why would balance be different tonight compared to other nights?

Westbrook went on a streak of hitting shots and getting inside. It's quite obvious that Killian would have been helpful against him on D and likely would have had a few steals as well.
Mogolo
Sophomore
Posts: 161
And1: 108
Joined: Mar 11, 2016
     

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#282 » by Mogolo » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:34 am

so how many games do we think Stewart will get?
Liqourish
RealGM
Posts: 14,554
And1: 2,037
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#283 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:36 am

Pistonrings wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
Pistonrings wrote:So when Killian was 3 boards short of a triple double while injured and on the road at Toronto, we would have been better off without him? He is obviously one of the best defenders on the team and is the best passer on the team. Thank goodness Weaver and Casey obviously think as I do about him.

Who said anything about Toronto? :lol: You said we win tonight with Killian. We lost due to lack of big bodies inside and shooting. Neither of which Killian brings to the table.

It sounded as if you were saying better for all games, why would balance be different tonight compared to other nights?

Westbrook went on a streak of hitting shots and getting inside. It's quite obvious that Killian would have been helpful against him on D and likely would have had a few steals as well.


Westbrook went on a tear to start the 4th qtr when Casey normally goes to the bench before putting them in half way through to close it out. As a starting PG, Killian wouldn't have been out there anyway, Cory Joseph would have. Where we lacked was inside the lane when we were over matched by Lakers size.
User avatar
bstein14
RealGM
Posts: 24,293
And1: 3,773
Joined: Jun 22, 2001
Contact:

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#284 » by bstein14 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:48 am

Mogolo wrote:so how many games do we think Stewart will get?


Four so he can't play against LA Sunday. What should he get? One and LeBron should get four.... but we know how things work with Superstars in the league.
Pistonrings
Senior
Posts: 732
And1: 124
Joined: Jul 03, 2021
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#285 » by Pistonrings » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:48 am

Westbrook scored 26, I assure you they all weren't in the 4th. Joseph started and had 5 points. To Claim Westbrook wasn't a problem is not correct,candy it's obvious Killian's D would have helped dramatically, not to mention his stealing prowess. CoJo had 4 boards, but Westbrook had 9, Killian might have been able to gram 6 or 7 in 38 minutes, which is what CoJo played.

Cade only scored 13 and I also believe he would have had better setup passes from Killian than he got from CoJo, much better actually and I believe Cade may have been closer to 18 to 20 points if Killian is adding to him instead of CoJo.

So nope, seems quite obvious we win this game with Killian alongside Cade over CoJo.
DetroitSho
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,070
And1: 1,750
Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#286 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:54 am

Liqourish wrote:
DetroitSho wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
I know your love for Killian, but the team was better balanced tonight. If Stewart stays in the game, we might win this one. What we lack is another big man and shooters, neither of which include killian.
If we lack big men and shooters, subtracting Killian helps neither. So that take doesn't make sense. Again, guys actually hit shots tonight.


Neither does adding him.
You're the one alluding to this being the difference.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app
Liqourish
RealGM
Posts: 14,554
And1: 2,037
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#287 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:56 am

Liqourish wrote:
bstein14 wrote:It would normally be super exciting to see the youngest Piston to ever get a tripple double but that 1-9 shooting from deep kills the overall performance a bit, as well as losing a game we really should have won.


They still had AD, Westbrook, Melo, etc on that team. We had no one over 6'7" on the floor. We had better balance without Killian out there, but we need bigs in the worse way. This is a game KO would have opened things up.


Somehow, this is me alluding to Killian being the reason we lost, despite saying the lack of bigs was the reason we lost.
Mogolo
Sophomore
Posts: 161
And1: 108
Joined: Mar 11, 2016
     

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#288 » by Mogolo » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:56 am

bstein14 wrote:
Mogolo wrote:so how many games do we think Stewart will get?


Four so he can't play against LA Sunday. What should he get? One and LeBron should get four.... but we know how things work with Superstars in the league.


yea thats about what I was thinking 1 for Stew and 3-5 for Lebron... we will see if the NBA is going to do the right thing... but knowing Silver and Lebron... prolly 4 games for Stew and a fine for Lebron.

BUT if Stew and Lebron both play on SUnday I will have popcorn ready^^
DetroitSho
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,070
And1: 1,750
Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#289 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:59 am

Liqourish wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
bstein14 wrote:It would normally be super exciting to see the youngest Piston to ever get a tripple double but that 1-9 shooting from deep kills the overall performance a bit, as well as losing a game we really should have won.


They still had AD, Westbrook, Melo, etc on that team. We had no one over 6'7" on the floor. We had better balance without Killian out there, but we need bigs in the worse way. This is a game KO would have opened things up.


Somehow, this is me alluding to Killian being the reason we lost, despite saying the lack of bigs was the reason we lost.
It's odd you bold every sentence around the actual sentence where you make an erroneous claim about Killian. Let me help you out, YOU STATED WE HAD BETTER BALANCE WITHOUT HIM. Just how?

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app
Pistonrings
Senior
Posts: 732
And1: 124
Joined: Jul 03, 2021
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#290 » by Pistonrings » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:00 am

It's ridiculous to claim having one of our top 3 defenders in the starting lineup against a guy who scored 26 points wouldn't have helped, again, not to mention the 3 or 4 steals he might have added, more than the 4 boards CoJo had, the switching off to defend other guys and helping double team as well as getting Cade more shots in better rhythm than CoJo did.
Pistonrings
Senior
Posts: 732
And1: 124
Joined: Jul 03, 2021
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#291 » by Pistonrings » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:09 am

DetroitSho wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
They still had AD, Westbrook, Melo, etc on that team. We had no one over 6'7" on the floor. We had better balance without Killian out there, but we need bigs in the worse way. This is a game KO would have opened things up.


Somehow, this is me alluding to Killian being the reason we lost, despite saying the lack of bigs was the reason we lost.
It's odd you bold every sentence around the actual sentence where you make an erroneous claim about Killian. Let me help you out, YOU STATED WE HAD BETTER BALANCE WITHOUT HIM. Just how?

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

We weren't with better balance without Killian, not sure how he arrived at that. Cade only had 13 points. The one 3 he hit was from a good pass that came near the nd of the clock and he hit it because he had no time to think about it. Killian would have gotten more passes to Cade in that type rhythm for sure and Cade would have had more than 13.

But it is crazy to suggest having one of our best defenders in against a guy who scored 26 points and was one rebound away from his own triple double wouldn't have helped. It was a close game even with Grant, Frank, and Diallo going off. Add in Killian's D, steals, much better passing and likely more than the 4 rebounds CoJo had in 38 minutes and it is very reasonable to suspect this would have been a win. And oh, seems he forgot Killian is one of the best 3 shooters on the team, CoJo scored 5 in 38 minutes, I think Killian also would have put up 8 to 10.
Liqourish
RealGM
Posts: 14,554
And1: 2,037
Joined: Oct 03, 2005
       

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#292 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:12 am

DetroitSho wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
They still had AD, Westbrook, Melo, etc on that team. We had no one over 6'7" on the floor. We had better balance without Killian out there, but we need bigs in the worse way. This is a game KO would have opened things up.


Somehow, this is me alluding to Killian being the reason we lost, despite saying the lack of bigs was the reason we lost.
It's odd you bold every sentence around the actual sentence where you make an erroneous claim about Killian. Let me help you out, YOU STATED WE HAD BETTER BALANCE WITHOUT HIM. Just how?


Erroneous means wrong or incorrect. Stating we had better balance against the Lakers without Killian is neither. It was mentioned the team scored better and more efficiently. Maybe because we had less ball handlers and more spot up shooters. Josh Jackson, Hami Diallo, Frank Jackson all played well in significant minutes. We lacked size inside without Stewart and Olynyk. We scored 44% fg, 35% 3pt and got to the line 21 times. How would Killians defense, and minutes away from those shooters, make this team better tonight? The mysterious 4th quarter defense on Russ when the bench normally plays? Would Killian have stopped AD inside?

Reading something and comprehending something is not synonymous.
DetroitSho
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,070
And1: 1,750
Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#293 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:40 am

Liqourish wrote:
DetroitSho wrote:
Liqourish wrote:
Somehow, this is me alluding to Killian being the reason we lost, despite saying the lack of bigs was the reason we lost.
It's odd you bold every sentence around the actual sentence where you make an erroneous claim about Killian. Let me help you out, YOU STATED WE HAD BETTER BALANCE WITHOUT HIM. Just how?


Erroneous means wrong or incorrect. Stating we had better balance against the Lakers without Killian is neither. It was mentioned the team scored better and more efficiently. Maybe because we had less ball handlers and more spot up shooters. Josh Jackson, Hami Diallo, Frank Jackson all played well in significant minutes. We lacked size inside without Stewart and Olynyk. We scored 44% fg, 35% 3pt and got to the line 21 times. How would Killians defense, and minutes away from those shooters, make this team better tonight? The mysterious 4th quarter defense on Russ when the bench normally plays? Would Killian have stopped AD inside?

Reading something and comprehending something is not synonymous.
95% of your of post, I'm not even sure who it's directed towards. I've not once argued Killian would've been able to help with our lack of size so I'll just respond to the 5% that's actually relevant to what I said.

This game and last game against Golden State was almost identical as far as how we played and the results. Literally you swap out Josh Jackson who had a DNP last game for Killian and it's almost the same game. There was no better balance or marked difference between the two games other than guys were just flat out hitting shots.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
bstein14
RealGM
Posts: 24,293
And1: 3,773
Joined: Jun 22, 2001
Contact:

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#294 » by bstein14 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:46 am

After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.
DetroitSho
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,070
And1: 1,750
Joined: Sep 28, 2012

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#295 » by DetroitSho » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:51 am

bstein14 wrote:After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.
There's always the possibility that nobody saw it actually happen in real time.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app
chrbal
RealGM
Posts: 19,513
And1: 987
Joined: Mar 02, 2001
Contact:

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#296 » by chrbal » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:09 pm

bstein14 wrote:After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.


I’d be willing to bet money that Lebron gets a rest day the next time we play them
FloridaMan78
Pro Prospect
Posts: 825
And1: 193
Joined: Mar 24, 2021
 

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#297 » by FloridaMan78 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:56 pm

bstein14 wrote:After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.

They were all busy getting trucked by him lol.

I’m actually disappointed too. But it is tough since Beef Stew is our only enforcer. Josh Jackson maybe but that’s about it. They didn’t see it and the team knows Stew has a bit of a temper. And it is Lebron, he owns the league right now. Bunch of excuses, but in the end, wish someone stood up for him.
User avatar
bstein14
RealGM
Posts: 24,293
And1: 3,773
Joined: Jun 22, 2001
Contact:

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#298 » by bstein14 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:00 pm

FloridaMan78 wrote:
bstein14 wrote:After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.

They were all busy getting trucked by him lol.

I’m actually disappointed too. But it is tough since Beef Stew is our only enforcer. Josh Jackson maybe but that’s about it. They didn’t see it and the team knows Stew has a bit of a temper. And it is Lebron, he owns the league right now. Bunch of excuses, but in the end, wish someone stood up for him.


100% if Cade or Grant got opened up like that by anyone Stewart would be in there backing them up.
440BB
Pro Prospect
Posts: 924
And1: 498
Joined: Jul 13, 2017
     

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#299 » by 440BB » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:03 pm

DetroitSho wrote:
bstein14 wrote:After seeing the play a bunch of times, kind of bummed no one had Stewart's back to be honest. If LeBron got punched like that from anyone on our team you know his teammates would be over there in the scuffle. Stewart got punched right in the face and no other Pistons sad a word to LeBron and no one even mentioned post game about it being a cheap shot by LeBron. Kind of sucks for Beef Stew.
There's always the possibility that nobody saw it actually happen in real time.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

I didn't realize what actually happened until I saw a couple replays. James turning to look as he punched Stewart in the face after the elbow shows the intentional dirty play clearly, but when everybody's looking up at the ball it would be easy to go unnoticed.

Makes you wonder whether this is something James normally pulls off but gets overlooked as it doesn't draw blood. Elbows happen but the follow up punch was a cowardly act, period.
Moses ShamMoses
Veteran
Posts: 2,809
And1: 991
Joined: Nov 28, 2012
   

Re: Game 16: Lakers (8-9) @ Pistons (4-11) - Nov. 21 6:00 PM EST 

Post#300 » by Moses ShamMoses » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:08 pm

This game was bittersweet for me when it comes to Cade. I loved his rebounding and playmaking but boy was his shot off tonight. He also was anti-clutch down the stretch with the turnovers, blocked shots. In my eyes this was his "Welcome to the NBA moment" when he got sonned by AD in the final minutes. Everybody goes through it and he will grow from it.
Jeff Van Gundy on his brother's Pistons: 'He took over the Titanic and it's sinking even quicker'

Return to Detroit Pistons