Over 20% into Monty’s first year how do you rate his performance?

ComboGuardCity · Post #1 » by **ComboGuardCity** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:56 am

Well not the record we want, but how would you rate Monty’s tenor so far?

For me, I think it’s pretty close to worst case scenario, but I’m not ready to call him to be fired yet.

It feels like we hired a guy who wasn’t mentally ready to coach but loves money. His rotations have been awful, his in game adjustments have been non-exisistent, and most importantly, his player development has been absolutely abysmal. It really is making me wonder if CP3 was the real coach of that Sun’s team.

The way he has treated Jaden Ivey is straight up baffling. Everyone is missing rotations and yet it’s Jaden that has to work on his defense. From an outsider it looks like the dude just carries a grudge. Like he is envious of Jaden’s athleticism because he never had it during his playing career which is why he expects him to be Artest out there. I’m just playing arm chair psychologist, but there has to be more there. EDIT: and just now I see Monty’s presser he’s calling for defense and praises Sasser for being a fighter. He killed it on offense today, but got absolutely cooked due to his small size on defense. Monty’s favoritism is wild.

And I love Beef Stew, but the way we are playing and the personnel we have, he continuously allows him to have the most leeway. It’s almost feels like they’re afraid to give him less minutes. Hell I probably would be too lol.

Overall, 20% into year 1 of 6, I’m very underwhelmed. He’s getting paid elite coaching money, so I expect better. I really hope I’m just an impatient fan that doesn’t know what’s going on between games and between the lines. But damn, I’ve been watching a **** product for 15 years and I’m ready to see a turn.

Post #2 » by **theBigLip** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:09 am

It’s too early to know for sure.

vege · Post #3 » by **vege** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:25 am

Monty is not going to be fired anytime soon, but he is garbage. I have no issue on how he handled Ivey, Ivey should be in the GLeague. He is trash and does not deserve any playing time. He need to learn the basics about defense and he need to start giving a **** on defense.

Weaver and Tellem are the issue and they need to go.

Kalamazoo317 · Post #4 » by **Kalamazoo317** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:51 am

I really can't say with any certainty what is Monty, what is lack of talent, and what is a combination fo injuries and youth. But we're bad, so no one gets a passing grade, from Gores on through the custodial staff.

Chuck Everett · Post #5 » by **Chuck Everett** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:52 am

vege wrote:Monty is not going to be fired anytime soon, but he is garbage. I have no issue on how he handled Ivey, Ivey should be in the GLeague. He is trash and does not deserve any playing time. He need to learn the basics about defense and he need to start giving a **** on defense.

Weaver and Tellem are the issue and they need to go.

Ivey is a coach's son and played at defensive first Purdue. The fact that he isn't fundamentally sound defensively is kind of embarrassing. He's either hardheaded or has an undiagnosed learning disability.

vege · Post #6 » by **vege** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 7:02 am

Chuck Everett wrote:
vege wrote:Monty is not going to be fired anytime soon, but he is garbage. I have no issue on how he handled Ivey, Ivey should be in the GLeague. He is trash and does not deserve any playing time. He need to learn the basics about defense and he need to start giving a **** on defense.

Weaver and Tellem are the issue and they need to go.

Ivey is a coach's son and played at defensive first Purdue. The fact that he isn't fundamentally sound defensively is kind of embarrassing. He's either hardheaded or has an undiagnosed learning disability.

I was saying that last season, but I had people around here saying it doesn't matter :lol:

And it is more than that. He have all the phisical tools to be a top tier defender. And he is not just a coach's son, his mother is a great coach not just a random coach.

Neptune · Post #7 » by **Neptune** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 7:57 am

Terrible! Can't give a guy credit for starting Hayes and not even attempting to start a line up without Stewart.

Uncle Mxy · Post #8 » by **Uncle Mxy** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 11:53 am

Neptune wrote:Terrible! Can't give a guy credit for starting Hayes and not even attempting to start a line up without Stewart.

Monte Morris should have been our serviceable starting PG. Who else on this team is even close to a PF? Bagley? Ausar? Bojan? I'd peg that more on Troy Weaver, who's big on having wings where PGs and PFs should be. Positionless basketball only works when you have some unicorns in the mix, and we don't have that.

7r5ur · Post #9 » by **7r5ur** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 12:11 pm

vege wrote:Monty is not going to be fired anytime soon, but he is garbage. I have no issue on how he handled Ivey, Ivey should be in the GLeague. He is trash and does not deserve any playing time. He need to learn the basics about defense and he need to start giving a **** on defense.

Weaver and Tellem are the issue and they need to go.

I like how we say this only about Ivey when the entire team is trash on defense. They can’t stop anyone with or without Ivey. Cade gets lit up constantly, Killian gets lit up, Burks, etc. At least Ivey can put the ball in the hoop at an above league-worst rate unlike the other guards on this team. Yet somehow it’s only Ivey that gets singled out on defense. It wasn’t Ivey get lit up by Brunson last night. Dude had like 20 points before he ever got in the game.

And let’s be real, this coach doesn’t care about defense. He just benched the best defender on the team by a wide margin. The only guy who is truly a plus defender. Monty just likes being erratic and playing mind games. We saw it in Phoenix and we’re seeing it here.

Piston Pete · Post #10 » by **Piston Pete** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 1:28 pm

Wins-losses aside, I don’t like how he seems to be playing mind games with players. You see it on the court, the players have no faith in Monty and/or have their confidence shot.

Seems like a toxic environment already.

Billl · Post #11 » by **Billl** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 3:16 pm

Too early to tell. Obviously he's had a lot of success in the league, but he's going to have to adjust his offense to fit the players he actually has. Cade isn't chris paul, so you can't just pick and roll him to death and have him make every decision out there. He finally gave cade some plays off ball last night and the offense flowed so much better when we were mixing it up like that.

pistonsbball · Post #12 » by **pistonsbball** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:09 pm

The reality is he's been bought in on the biggest contract in league history and he's just completed a winless month. That's an unmitigated failure. If he's worth any fraction of those millions of dollars then there is enough talent to put it together on any given night, it's the NBA. Not being able to extract even one win in November is simply a huge red flag, it's the kind of stuff that only happens after the all-star break.

For the sake of the franchise I hope I'm overreacting and he can somehow turn this around. Last night's game was a positive step.

haulerch · Post #13 » by **haulerch** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:28 pm

Unmitigated disaster.

Gores needs to fire this entire front office, including Arn Tellem.

Bite the bullet and fire Monty. This is an expensive lesson of why you don’t throw bundles of cash to a guy who didn’t want to coach to begin with. Ollie wasn’t the answer either which is another reason why Troy should be gone.

Then go to the NBA and ask for help. Gores is literally William Clay Ford reincarnated where he can’t hire a solid executive to save his life.

Even though it’s been a complete disaster, you’ll have a new GM to hire a young coach, decent young players to trade or choose to build around, cap space and a high pick.

You just need some form of competency.

Post #14 » by **theBigLip** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:31 pm

There might be a little over reaction on this thread. Popovich is regarded as the best coach in the league, gets paid more than Monty, and his win/loss record isn’t much better. I guess he should get fired too?

There is a lot going on right now beyond the wins and losses. Monty getting to know his roster. Some coming back from injuries. Monty trying to figure out who needs to improve which areas of their game and the best way to accomplish that.

The wins/losses is embarrassing, but Weaver and Monty are not on the hot seat this year. The plan that was pitched to Gores is being executed. That being said, if there isn’t some signs of hope by the end of the season (Weaver -roster moves, Monty - coaching “up” the rookies), Gores should be putting some pressure on them.

Kalamazoo317 · Post #15 » by **Kalamazoo317** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:32 pm

Fwiw there are a lot of Spurs fans ready to move on from Pop. Remember when Phil Jackson was in NY? Even the greats lose it at some point.

Kalamazoo317 · Post #16 » by **Kalamazoo317** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:33 pm

If there's no hot seat on Weaver or Monty, then there should be a hot seat on Gores. Someone in this franchise needs to hate losing with a passion.

ComboGuardCity · Post #17 » by **ComboGuardCity** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:57 pm

theBigLip wrote:There might be a little over reaction on this thread. Popovich is regarded as the best coach in the league, gets paid more than Monty, and his win/loss record isn’t much better. I guess he should get fired too?

There is a lot going on right now beyond the wins and losses. Monty getting to know his roster. Some coming back from injuries. Monty trying to figure out who needs to improve which areas of their game and the best way to accomplish that.

The wins/losses is embarrassing, but Weaver and Monty are not on the hot seat this year. The plan that was pitched to Gores is being executed. That being said, if there isn’t some signs of hope by the end of the season (Weaver -roster moves, Monty - coaching “up” the rookies), Gores should be putting some pressure on them.

It probably is an overreaction, but then again I overreacted at the 2-1 mark too

I would be fine with the losses if it didn’t feel like Monty was trying to be younger slightly more successful Casey. He’s pretty much preaching Casey basketball along with a very poor rendition of Pop/Phil Jackson mind games.

Preach defense. Bench Ausar.

Preach no hesitation on open shots. Continue to play Beef Stew.

Ivey misses a rotation. Bench.

Duren, Cade, Sasser, Burks missing a rotation. Crickets.

Sure, there is probably more to it, but of the things that we fans are privy to, all I see is Hypocrisy and it doesn’t sit right with me.

King Bugs · Post #18 » by **King Bugs** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 4:59 pm

It is NOT "too early to tell". We just went winless in November, are in the midst of the longest losing streak in franchise history and are on pace to match the worst record in NBA history. The flags can't get any redder. The joy of basketball has been completely sapped from these kids, they have regressed and they look unhappy out there. This is a very expensive mess.

Monty's playing too many mind games, guys are in and out of the rotation, Jaden is out there playing scared, and Cade for whatever reason never gets punished for the same mistakes everyone else makes. This is how you lose a locker room, but Piston fans should be used to that because the majority of the flop coaches we hire completely lose the locker room by Christmas anyway. We're right on schedule.

Everyone knows we can't defend worth crap, but why do we compound the issue by playing slow and walking the ball up the floor so much? Our entire starting lineup is under 25 years old! At least a team like Indiana understands that they can't defend and play breakneck "first team to 120 wins" basketball. Will they win a championship or even a playoff game playing like that? Of course not but, Rick Carlisle understands his personnel and is getting the most out of the roster.

That's clearly not happening here. I'm all the way out on Monty.

vege · Post #19 » by **vege** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 5:31 pm

BDM22 wrote:
vege wrote:Monty is not going to be fired anytime soon, but he is garbage. I have no issue on how he handled Ivey, Ivey should be in the GLeague. He is trash and does not deserve any playing time. He need to learn the basics about defense and he need to start giving a **** on defense.

Weaver and Tellem are the issue and they need to go.

I like how we say this only about Ivey when the entire team is trash on defense. They can’t stop anyone with or without Ivey. Cade gets lit up constantly, Killian gets lit up, Burks, etc. At least Ivey can put the ball in the hoop at an above league-worst rate unlike the other guards on this team. Yet somehow it’s only Ivey that gets singled out on defense. It wasn’t Ivey get lit up by Brunson last night. Dude had like 20 points before he ever got in the game.

And let’s be real, this coach doesn’t care about defense. He just benched the best defender on the team by a wide margin. The only guy who is truly a plus defender. Monty just likes being erratic and playing mind games. We saw it in Phoenix and we’re seeing it here.

There are different levels of bad. Ivey is in the bottom 3% of the league as a defender. There is no defense to that. He is bad. He should be in the GLeague and watching film, not in a NBA court.

Drwho17 · Post #20 » by **Drwho17** » Fri Dec 1, 2023 5:48 pm

Uncle Mxy wrote:
Neptune wrote:Terrible! Can't give a guy credit for starting Hayes and not even attempting to start a line up without Stewart.

Monte Morris should have been our serviceable starting PG. Who else on this team is even close to a PF? Bagley? Ausar? Bojan? I'd peg that more on Troy Weaver, who's big on having wings where PGs and PFs should be. Positionless basketball only works when you have some unicorns in the mix, and we don't have that.

I think putting Livers in was a good move, but should have moved Ausar to PF until Bojan returns, Stewart to Backup C/PF, Bagley/Wiseman to inactive. Leave Ivey in over Hayes.

How would you rate Monty 20% into the season?