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Major red flag about Trajan Langdon as our President of Basketball Operations is the fact he reportedly was going to keep Monty on board as head coach. It's a night and day difference this year and if he watched how last season went down and then talked about the importance of developing our young core, etc..... only to watch the games from last season and determine that Monty was worth giving another chance.

That's a massive red flag for TL's decision making, if it is indeed true as reported that he decided to keep Monty and then ownership came in and said lets just start fresh with a new coach for the team. The more I watch JB the more its clear that he is making great plays... he's actually challenging calls when players ask for it... he's got the trust of the team. He's doing game winning out of bounds plays, etc. He's doing 10X what Monty was doing last season for us.

Monty sucks. But I don't blame someone who doesn't come in right away and ask their boss to take a $65M loss on an investment after one year.

And Langdon chose Bickerstaff.

VicVinegar wrote:Monty sucks. But I don't blame someone who doesn't come in right away and ask their boss to take a $65M loss on an investment after one year.

And Langdon chose Bickerstaff.

This right here

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This won’t do.

Every decision TL makes is fair game for potential criticism. But I think it’s silly to criticize him for decisions it looks like he might have been close to making at one point.

And yeah, what VV said is also valid even if we’re going down that route.

There were reports at the time that the decision to fire Monty came at an ownership level, but it also wouldn't surprise me if that's the narrative that was released to the media to protect Langdon. It was the right call to fire Monty but at the time it was also going to lead to a lot of ridicule given the Pistons had signed him to a fat 6 year contract the off-season prior.

Also as mentioned above, Langdon was hardly going to come on board and demand Gores eat the remaining money straightaway. It's an easy way to immediately alienate yourself from your boss.

Ultimately we don't know if this decision was primarily Langdon or Gores (or both).

If this is one of the biggest red flags about our new GM, I'm happy.

It seems obvious that a new GM in his first GM job wouldn't push to fire the existing coach initially unless he was given that mandate.

Gores rightfully took the blame for his mistake and all is well.

Red flag or just pot stirring?

One of the biggest red flags about bstein14 on RealGM is how he manufactures drama.

Cowology wrote:One of the biggest red flags about bstein14 on RealGM is how he manufactures drama.

I'm not manufacturing anything. I'm ok with Holland as a draft pick. Beasley is looking like a very good signing. THJ I didn't think we got enough for taking on but even he has been pretty solid for us. Tobias's offense has been bad but I'm still hopeful he turns it around. I still am not sure another team in the league is giving Tobias $20 million but i understand we have to pay the Detroit tax coming off a 14 win season.

Bickerstaff hiring is looking really good so far. Our offense is still bad but he's gotten the team to buy into playing tough nose defense which is something we've been talking about here for a long time but hasn't happened.

That said, if there's one early red flag from TL its the fact that he "reportedly" was going to keep Monty to see how things went with him this season. As others have pointed out, its perhaps that he really did prefer to bring in his own guy but didn't want to ruffle feathers but the reality is if you watched the games, and talked to the players it should have been pretty clear that a coaching change was needed. It's also possible he did want Monty gone and Gores "took the heat" for him but overall its hard to see anyone with a really good basketball mind watching the film on our team last year and thinking that the coaching was good enough to bring back, if given the option to change.

You do realize this whole narrative that Langdon was keeping Monty was being put out there by Woj who shares an agent with Monty?

I think it's more likely the possibility Monty thought he was staying, but in reality Langdon was evaluating if Monty was going to work as the coacĥ.

bstein14 wrote:

Cowology wrote:One of the biggest red flags about bstein14 on RealGM is how he manufactures drama.

I'm not manufacturing anything. I'm ok with Holland as a draft pick. Beasley is looking like a very good signing. THJ I didn't think we got enough for taking on but even he has been pretty solid for us. Tobias's offense has been bad but I'm still hopeful he turns it around. I still am not sure another team in the league is giving Tobias $20 million but i understand we have to pay the Detroit tax coming off a 14 win season.

Bickerstaff hiring is looking really good so far. Our offense is still bad but he's gotten the team to buy into playing tough nose defense which is something we've been talking about here for a long time but hasn't happened.

That said, if there's one early red flag from TL its the fact that he "reportedly" was going to keep Monty to see how things went with him this season. As others have pointed out, its perhaps that he really did prefer to bring in his own guy but didn't want to ruffle feathers but the reality is if you watched the games, and talked to the players it should have been pretty clear that a coaching change was needed. It's also possible he did want Monty gone and Gores "took the heat" for him but overall its hard to see anyone with a really good basketball mind watching the film on our team last year and thinking that the coaching was good enough to bring back, if given the option to change.

But you don't even know the exact circumstances in which he was making the "choice" to keep Monty. And yet you still started with this "Red Flag" stuff despite all of the other moves that have worked out so far.

The time for crappy unfounded speculation threads is over. The offseason is over.

bstein14 wrote:

Cowology wrote:One of the biggest red flags about bstein14 on RealGM is how he manufactures drama.

I'm not manufacturing anything. I'm ok with Holland as a draft pick. Beasley is looking like a very good signing. THJ I didn't think we got enough for taking on but even he has been pretty solid for us. Tobias's offense has been bad but I'm still hopeful he turns it around. I still am not sure another team in the league is giving Tobias $20 million but i understand we have to pay the Detroit tax coming off a 14 win season.

Bickerstaff hiring is looking really good so far. Our offense is still bad but he's gotten the team to buy into playing tough nose defense which is something we've been talking about here for a long time but hasn't happened.

That said, if there's one early red flag from TL its the fact that he "reportedly" was going to keep Monty to see how things went with him this season. As others have pointed out, its perhaps that he really did prefer to bring in his own guy but didn't want to ruffle feathers but the reality is if you watched the games, and talked to the players it should have been pretty clear that a coaching change was needed. It's also possible he did want Monty gone and Gores "took the heat" for him but overall its hard to see anyone with a really good basketball mind watching the film on our team last year and thinking that the coaching was good enough to bring back, if given the option to change.

I know my response was kinda douchey, but I just don't think there is any meat on that bone. You don't have enough information to go where you are trying to go and even if you did I'm not sure it's relevant.

This just kinda feels like tabloid nonsense. There will be plenty of opportunities to criticize Langdon later over more legitimate issues. This isn't it.

I don't know whether or not he was considering keeping Monty. All I know is that he fired him and replaced him with JB who has been infinitely better than Monty, and that's good enough for me.

Uncle Mxy wrote:One of the biggest red flags about Trajan Langdon as our PoBO is that he didn't run away screaming.

You greentext but I'm not sure that isn't a valid point, lol.

VicVinegar wrote:Monty sucks. But I don't blame someone who doesn't come in right away and ask their boss to take a $65M loss on an investment after one year.

And Langdon chose Bickerstaff.

It was Gores who ultimately fired the guy. It's been reported that Langdon may have kept him.

It's obvious from just about every move they've made.

Reaching for Holland in the draft
Absorbing THJ's deal for SRP's
Bidding against themselves to give Tobias Harris 2yr/52M
Giving Cade the full max while jury is still out

Crymson wrote:

VicVinegar wrote:Monty sucks. But I don't blame someone who doesn't come in right away and ask their boss to take a $65M loss on an investment after one year.

And Langdon chose Bickerstaff.

It was Gores who ultimately fired the guy. It's been reported that Langdon may have kept him.

By the same guy who shares the same agent as Monty.

It's obvious that report was coming from Monty’s side of things.

Wrong.

Fennis Dembo wrote:Wrong.

What are some bigger red flags?

The decision was made by Gores and that’s been a debate with me and my brother and we follow pistons news closely but I’m closer because I listened to Gores say that it was his decision and they wanted a fresh start. In my opinion it might show that Monty simply didn’t have the roster to complement the core and Trajan wanted to give him another chance to evaluate him. It also helps Trajan by buying him time to blame the coach in case he flunks the offseason so it makes sense not to fire the coach right away. It’s all about timing and for our organization it was a sensitive time, he didn’t want to come in and disturb the peace.