Was Troy Weaver low key a good GM?

[ComboGuardCity]

Outside of Tobias, Beasley, Holland, and THJ, this roster was cobbled together by Troy.

Major Blunders:
- drafting Killian - this was his only horrible mistake but I think he gets a covid draft pass

Good moves:
- signed Grant - I think this is the equivalent of the Tobias/Beasley signings.


Good Draft picks
- Drafted Cade
- Drafted Ivey
- Drafted Duren
- Drafted Ausar
- Drafted Stewart

Really nobody I would draft over those guys so I would say if you take out 2020, Weaver was an excellent scout.

Questionable Moves
- Random trade for and stretch provisioning guys
- trading Bey for Wiseman though I don’t think this changed our franchise for better or worse
- random connection signings/2nd round draft picks

Things outside of his control:
- he didn’t want Monty. Ownership did.
- Tellem clearly had pull on some of the connection transactions.


Taking those factors into consideration, Troy Weaver might’ve actually been a decent GM. What do you all think?

[GreekAlex]

His positives wouldn’t make him a good GM because the GMs job is to bring the pieces of the puzzle together.

He’s a decent scout/talent evaluator at best.

Many of his blunders may have stunted the development of his young talent.

[Invictus88]

Trading up for Sasser when we had needs for a 4 with young 4 talent on the board was a mistake.

Not being able to convince ownership away from Monty is still a failure for a GM (he needs to be able to do that).

Stewart in exchange for handicapping our franchise trade-wise for the next several years is debatable at best.

[chrbal]

Taking those factors into consideration, Troy Weaver might’ve actually been a decent GM. What do you all think?

He was good at the draft, for the most part. Everything else, no. So he was a good scout for us.

Absorbing Kemba Walker to get Jalen Duren was a good move.

He had a weird obsession with adding bigs, didn’t take enough advantage of where the Pistons were at when he started to add assets, and so many pointless moves.

It’s a weird obsession with me, but he traded Tony Snell and Khyri Thomas (?) to Atlanta for Dewayne Dedmon because he had a similar contract for that season with only $1 million guaranteed the next season and he could stretch the money further (Snell would’ve been 3, Dedmon was 5). All that to sign Mason Plumlee, who he would salary dump a year later??? He also acquired Tony Bradley to add Saben Lee, then traded Bradley to get Zhaire Smith to waive him.

We were in the FIRST YEAR of a rebuild, does anyone care if we’re running out Snells contract and using Bradley as one of our centers?? Instead we had 5 years of Dedmons dead money and Zhaires contract just ate up space.

And oh yeah, he gave away Bruce Brown who wanted to be part of those Pistons.

But congratulations on drafting well, let’s get ahold of the Lions former GM Quinn to give him a pat on the back as well

[MotownMadness]

I wouldn’t trust him to build on anything. He did what was needed bottoming out and collecting top 5 picks though.

[Billl]

No, he was a really bad GM.

For drafting, the GM doesn't get extra credit for drafting a consensus pick. Cade - clear #1. Ivey -clear pick in a 4 player draft that the kings punted on . Even ausar was widely considered BPA, he just was a really questionable fit given our lack of shooting.

The stew trade is still really messing with us. Trading up for sasser was a big miss.

The only one that would really be a big potential win for him is Duren, but the guy is still a question mark, so that one could go either way.

The only thing he did fairly well is just clean house. Unfortunately, he didn't any of the vets into draft capital and mostly squandered any cap space that resulted. He left us with a clean cap sheet but down a 1st rounder at the beginning of a rebuild

[Uncle Mxy]

Good moves:
- signed Grant - I think this is the equivalent of the Tobias/Beasley signings.

That makes up for losing Christian Wood, who did about as well for Houston as Jerami Grant did for us.

(Yes, we managed to structure it as a trade and got Stew out of the deal, but that was dumb luck IMO.)

[DetroitSho]

I want to address this draft pick that "handicapped us for years". I think that's being a little overplayed. I'm not confident, in the middle of a rebuild, that there were any moves we missed out on due to not being able trade a future 1st until 2029.

The way I look at it is when we lose the draft pick this year, instead of being able to get an impact player in the middle of the 1st, we just already have one of the best rim protectors on the roster.

Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

[DetroitSho]

Good moves:
- signed Grant - I think this is the equivalent of the Tobias/Beasley signings.

That makes up for losing Christian Wood, who did about as well for Houston as Jerami Grant did for us.

(Yes, we managed to structure it as a trade and got Stew out of the deal, but that was dumb luck IMO.)

Yeah naw Christian Wood absolutely didn't do as well for Houston as Grant did for the Pistons.

Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

[ComboGuardCity]

His positives wouldn’t make him a good GM because the GMs job is to bring the pieces of the puzzle together.

He’s a decent scout/talent evaluator at best.

Many of his blunders may have stunted the development of his young talent.

I guess I don’t see where he stunted the development of the roster other than not fighting harder to not sign Monty. Maybe we could’ve pushed to sign more vets in the summer of 2023 (Kuzma and Max Struss), but I still think last year was a wise year to hang on to cap space.

[ComboGuardCity]

No, he was a really bad GM.

For drafting, the GM doesn't get extra credit for drafting a consensus pick. Cade - clear #1. Ivey -clear pick in a 4 player draft that the kings punted on . Even ausar was widely considered BPA, he just was a really questionable fit given our lack of shooting.

The stew trade is still really messing with us. Trading up for sasser was a big miss.

The only one that would really be a big potential win for him is Duren, but the guy is still a question mark, so that one could go either way.

The only thing he did fairly well is just clean house. Unfortunately, he didn't any of the vets into draft capital and mostly squandered any cap space that resulted. He left us with a clean cap sheet but down a 1st rounder at the beginning of a rebuild

We gave up a pick 6 lower and a heavily protected 2nd. Not sure the Sasser trade was all that bad. He hasn’t been a game changer but we didn’t give much to get him. I also think you have to give credit for drafting the player you wanted. Yes Cade was consensus #1 but Ivey, Ausar, Stewart and Duren all were not.

[LaSheed]

His roster construction was awful. I defended that guy for wayyyy too long.

[GreekAlex]

His positives wouldn’t make him a good GM because the GMs job is to bring the pieces of the puzzle together.

He’s a decent scout/talent evaluator at best.

Many of his blunders may have stunted the development of his young talent.

I guess I don’t see where he stunted the development of the roster other than not fighting harder to not sign Monty. Maybe we could’ve pushed to sign more vets in the summer of 2023 (Kuzma and Max Struss), but I still think last year was a wise year to hang on to cap space.

Success as a GM is measured by the margins.

Look how much Malik Beasley has brought to the team as a 1 year $6M signing.

I wasn’t looking for Weaver to hit home runs or blow up the future cap space for marginal improvement but there were cases were the team would have benefited more from 1 year overpays than collecting 2nd round picks for unplayable corpses.

[Kalamazoo317]

Yes Cade was consensus #1 but Ivey, Ausar, Stewart and Duren all were not.

And still aren't. You could make arguments that better players were drafted after all of those guys. You could also argue that for Cade (that draft was *loaded*) but I think he was the right pick.

Weaver also drafted Bey.

He spent most of his career with really high draft picks. He botched one. He had one notable free agent signing (Grant) whom he decided to move on from even though we could've used his spacing and secondary scoring alongside Cade much longer. He had one fairly impressive trade (Bojan). Neither of those vets raised the collective team the way the three vets we brought in this year have. Locker room chemistry apparently wasn't something Weaver excelled at. Nor was roster fit. He attempted a million reclamation projects. I understand the philosophy, but zero of them panned out.

Bey and Sasser were poor picks for where he took them, imo, and I don't think Weaver ever hit on a second round pick, despite having some high ones.

And he was a terrible public speaker.

[chrbal]

https://www.basketball-reference.com/executives/weavetr99x.html

Maybe the move wasn’t completely his, but his only decision on a head coach was Monty Williams. He seemed to take the first salary dump that was offered to him as opposed to waiting for better offers. Thank god he did, but he hampered his own ability to make trades with the restrictions on the pick he sent to help get Stewart.

Did seemingly the bare minimum to help the rookies/younger players out.

One of his biggest issues was not really taking a risk and then allowing that to define his tenure.

His record as our GM was 74-244, we got worse the longer he was here. He gets fired, a new GM and head coach is brought in, and we literally just add competent shooting vets and suddenly we’re a playoff team. Mostly Troy’s guys minus Troy and suddenly we’re a good young team

That last part is my main argument against him, simple facts

[tmorgan]

B as a scout and drafter.
F for cap management.
C- for free agents.
C+ as a trader.
F for leadership / creating a culture/ public speaking.

He inherited a stinking pile of poo and left with a stinking pile of poo with more potential. He did some good stuff (smaller amount, larger impact) and a lot of bad stuff, most of which was pretty small in comparison.

His obsession with reclamation projects that filled our roster with utter crap was what bugged me the most. Kids can’t learn from guys that have nothing to teach or are kids themselves.

Give him credit for one thing — he didn’t make any monumental cap/spending blunders that left us crippled after his departure. His mistakes were smaller, but there were oh so many of them.

[Uncle Mxy]

Yeah naw Christian Wood absolutely didn't do as well for Houston as Grant did for the Pistons.

Wood played 109 games for Houston, averaging 19/10/2 on 51% shooting (38% from 3P)
Grant played 101 games for us, averaging 21/4/3 on 43% shooting (35% from 3P).
Grant was a better defender, but Wood was more efficient offensively at that point.
Both teams traded them after two seasons for a 1st round pick and assorted ballast.
Both wanted to be Pistons, but Weaver cheaped out to gamble $20 mil/year on Grant.
Losing Wood for Grant turned out to be a wash, but likely we could have had both.
What did we spend Wood's Houston pay onn? Mason Plumlee and Josh Jackson.
Oh, and giving up an asset in Bruce Brown for a 2nd round pick so Killian has a spot.

<bangs head>
<bangs head some more>

[bstein14]

Hard to say what moves we will make this summer and next deadline, but lets say this Pistons team continues to grow and in we win a playoff series in 2026 with these 5 guys in our 8 man playoff rotation... then you have to give Weaver some props for sure even though he deservedly was let go after a 14 win season in year four.

Cade + Ivey + Ausar + Stew + Duren .... If those 5 guys are part of the 8 man rotation that gets a a playoff series win in Cade's 5th season, I think you have to at least admit the fact he laid the groundwork.

2026 Playoffs series win and 50+ wins next year in the regular season with those 5 being in our top 8 players is at least very possible if not likely.

5th year Cade
6th year Stewart
4th year Ivey & Duren
3rd year Ausar

[theBigLip]

Hiring Monty was above his pay grade. You can tell your boss he’s wrong, but he’s the boss so at the end of the day, you do what he wants or you’re gone. I don’t blame him for that.

Duren trade was solid. Good cap management that were still benefiting from.

You can debate everything else, but we got totally f—ked by ping pong balls. If after Cade, if we just once drafted per our record, we’d have a stud AllStar PF. That would have changed the story significantly.

[MrBigShot]

Troy Weaver illustrated that a GM who is consistently a whopping F in free agency can derail any of the positive decisions he makes.

The impact Beasley, Harris and THJ have had on the culture/energy of our team has been massive. Weaver consistently outbid himself for non impact role players, and in some instances then later traded assets to get rid of them.