Timberwolves vs Warriors - Game 3

[SpreeS]

This tells everything how changed landscape with Green w/o Curry

Wide open and open shots from 3P

vs HOU 38.1 3PA (Curry 7.3 3PA)
vs MIN 27.0 3PA

Podz/Hield/Moody vs HOU 15.7 3PA (74min per game)
Podz/Hield/Moody vs MIN 11.0 3PA (76min per game)

Butler/Payton/Kuminga/Green vs HOU 9.6 3PA (82min per game)
Butler/Payton/Kuminga/Green vs MIN 14.0 3PA (116min per game)

This is how MIN limited our shooters (Podz/Moody/Hiled) compared with HOU

[Onus]

These takes on dray are hilarious. He’s the only reason we were able to keep ant in check. Once he went to the bench our defense fell apart. Dray is absolutely critical for us to win a game in 90s. Yes he had a terrible game offensively but he is our defense.

If the refs didn’t call this game like a regular season game, people were literally just falling down and Scott foster would call a foul, I think we win. This game didn’t resemble playoff basketball at all.

In the friendliest way possible I don’t see how you can watch the game and say this.

I love draymond, one of my favorite all time. But offensively he was an epic disaster.

Defensively he fouled out when we needed him. And while he was unlucky with the Randle charge, he left himself in a position to pick you his 6th, out of position and a hand on his hip. It was harsh for sure but he seemed really put out the whole game by the narrative leading in. And sadly this has happened before when Steph goes out.

I believe he can put in his best performance of the season tomorrow and that’s what I expect and hope.

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

[jozef]

The other starters are Butler, Podz, Hield, and Green. That foursome has had a positive plus minus against the Wolves' starting lineup when the fifth guy is GPII, Kuminga, or Santos. In other words the play so far indicates the Warriors best lineup is better than the Wolves best lineup. I presume the theory with playing TJD is that a big needs to be played to prevent the Wolves bigs like Gobert and Randle from abusing the smaller Warriors lineups but the data so far does not show that happening. Indeed it's when Post is played that they are the most negative. Until the Wolves can show that their bigs cannot be contained the Warriors should have an advantage here but Kerr is giving it away based on theory not actual practice.

Kerr seems to love giving up on lineups and conceding advantages to opponents based on theory and conventional wisdom despite a history of lineups that bucked theory having led to their dynasty. I can understand giving up on multiple guard lineups if they are losing the plus minus battle but not if they are winning. I also don't get the current allergy Kerr has with playing Draymond and Looney together. The main lineup in the 2022 championship season was Steph, Klay, Wiggins, Draymond and Looney—but now Draymond and Looney can never be played together?

The sample is so small that any plus minus are meaningless. Say Moody was -7 in Game 3 but he did no take any shot and he did not make any defensive mistake. We need to look at what's happening on the floor. Of course they can play small but TJD did not hurt them at all.
Looney can be useful with Curry gravitating two defenders. BUT NOW we need every player to be a threat. Post is one-dimensional and it's not enough in Curry-less team.

It may be a small sample size but it is the most relevant sample. We want to know what works against the Wolves. This was directly against the Wolves. Confidence in the results carrying forward maybe low as result but not meaningless and I think it would impart higher confidence than other rationalizations. For tactical and strategic reasons one might not do it but it's a defensible option to spam a winning lineup until the opposing team shows it can deal with it. The sample size will grow and you may be winning in the meantime. I think it's been great that Kerr has experimented with different lineups throughout the season but if you find winning lineups but don't go back to them what's the point of those experiments?

Moody was -7 in 3 minutes. Failed my quick rule of thumb for playable players but yes we need to look at what happens on the floor. Not shooting is possibly a problem. We've seen Moody be tentative these playoffs. This wasn't a one off. Maybe he should be doing something he wasn't doing. Or maybe as you say the -7 had nothing to do with Moody. But all else being equal I'd rather have a guy in there that went +7 with that lineup in 3 minutes rather than -7. I think your lineup idea with him might still be workable but it should probably be a starting lineup. Past experience shows results are better when Moody is starting and that -7 in 3 minutes had multiple lineup changes including getting paired with Kuminga which has been a mediocre pairing for a long time now.

The team went -2 with that TJD starting lineup. If they had gone +4 as other versions of that lineup with other players in place of TJD have gone, that would have been enough to cover the 5 point difference seen in the final score.

Still small samples and impacted by many variables, say zone defense, opponent lineup etc.
What I propose is stable athleticism which could make opponent feel uncomfortable and Wolves had a lot of limited players.
PG Podziemski 34 Payton 14 - gritty guards with limited ability to create own shot
SG Hield 34 Moody 14 - can shoot
SF Moody 20 Butler 20 Kuminga 8 - athletic wings
PF Butler 16 Kuminga 24 Green 8 - mobile wings
C Green 28 Jackson-Davis 20 - vertical rim protectors

[SpreeS]

These takes on dray are hilarious. He’s the only reason we were able to keep ant in check. Once he went to the bench our defense fell apart. Dray is absolutely critical for us to win a game in 90s. Yes he had a terrible game offensively but he is our defense.

If the refs didn’t call this game like a regular season game, people were literally just falling down and Scott foster would call a foul, I think we win. This game didn’t resemble playoff basketball at all.

In the friendliest way possible I don’t see how you can watch the game and say this.

I love draymond, one of my favorite all time. But offensively he was an epic disaster.

Defensively he fouled out when we needed him. And while he was unlucky with the Randle charge, he left himself in a position to pick you his 6th, out of position and a hand on his hip. It was harsh for sure but he seemed really put out the whole game by the narrative leading in. And sadly this has happened before when Steph goes out.

I believe he can put in his best performance of the season tomorrow and that’s what I expect and hope.

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

And falsh about Edwards

3Q/4Q

Edwards 13pts with Green on
Edwards 13pts with Green off

[Onus]

In the friendliest way possible I don’t see how you can watch the game and say this.

I love draymond, one of my favorite all time. But offensively he was an epic disaster.

Defensively he fouled out when we needed him. And while he was unlucky with the Randle charge, he left himself in a position to pick you his 6th, out of position and a hand on his hip. It was harsh for sure but he seemed really put out the whole game by the narrative leading in. And sadly this has happened before when Steph goes out.

I believe he can put in his best performance of the season tomorrow and that’s what I expect and hope.

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

Calling touch fouls now going deeper in the playoffs is crazy. After what the NBA allowed in the Hou series, calling touch fouls now is crazy.

[Onus]

In the friendliest way possible I don’t see how you can watch the game and say this.

I love draymond, one of my favorite all time. But offensively he was an epic disaster.

Defensively he fouled out when we needed him. And while he was unlucky with the Randle charge, he left himself in a position to pick you his 6th, out of position and a hand on his hip. It was harsh for sure but he seemed really put out the whole game by the narrative leading in. And sadly this has happened before when Steph goes out.

I believe he can put in his best performance of the season tomorrow and that’s what I expect and hope.

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

And falsh about Edwards

3Q/4Q

Edwards 13pts with Green on
Edwards 13pts with Green off

ANT had 11 points total when Green went out in the 3rd quarter at 6:46 min. Ant finished that quarter with 23 points total. That means 12 points were scored when Green was out of the game.
https://www.nba.com/game/min-vs-gsw-0042400233/play-by-play?period=Q3

[SpreeS]

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

Calling touch fouls now going deeper in the playoffs is crazy. After what the NBA allowed in the Hou series, calling touch fouls now is crazy.

This is the point. Refs can call fauls whatever they want, b/c these are fouls... and if where is guy who shouts on every call, refs could "play" respectively

[Onus]

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

Calling touch fouls now going deeper in the playoffs is crazy. After what the NBA allowed in the Hou series, calling touch fouls now is crazy.

This is the point. Refs can call fauls whatever they want, b/c these are fouls... and if where is guy who shouts on every call, refs could "play" respectively

Feel like calls didn't go Dray's way and he started crashing out. That can be true, while also being true that his defense on Ant was keeping him in check and then once he went out Ant went off.

[SpreeS]

Look at the game flow. Edwards only went off when green was off the floor. Green is trying to guard Edwards and his man.

Green had 2 bad fouls called on him. The Randle charge and the McDaniels block.

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

And falsh about Edwards

3Q/4Q

Edwards 13pts with Green on
Edwards 13pts with Green off

ANT had 11 points total when Green went out in the 3rd quarter at 6:46 min. Ant finished that quarter with 23 points total. That means 12 points were scored when Green was out of the game.
https://www.nba.com/game/min-vs-gsw-0042400233/play-by-play?period=Q3

So scored 17pts (21min) w/o Green and 19pts (27min) with Green on floor...the same s...t

[Onus]

Green pushes over limits on defence and has a ton of non called fouls. So dont cry about these two. Also these were questionable atleast too and could go both ways... and if I would be a ref I would call every questionable foul on this angry black man, b/c he doesnt have rights to shout on refs every time.

And falsh about Edwards

3Q/4Q

Edwards 13pts with Green on
Edwards 13pts with Green off

ANT had 11 points total when Green went out in the 3rd quarter at 6:46 min. Ant finished that quarter with 23 points total. That means 12 points were scored when Green was out of the game.
https://www.nba.com/game/min-vs-gsw-0042400233/play-by-play?period=Q3

So scored 17pts (21min) w/o Green and 19pts (27min) with Green on floor...the same s...t

11 points on 17 off in the 2nd half alone.

Ant had 3 in the 3rd with 6:46 left then found his groove once Green was off the floor and closed with 12 points in the 3rd. That hot shooting continued in the 4th.

[SpreeS]

ANT had 11 points total when Green went out in the 3rd quarter at 6:46 min. Ant finished that quarter with 23 points total. That means 12 points were scored when Green was out of the game.
https://www.nba.com/game/min-vs-gsw-0042400233/play-by-play?period=Q3

So scored 17pts (21min) w/o Green and 19pts (27min) with Green on floor...the same s...t

11 points on 17 off in the 2nd half alone.

Ant had 3 in the 3rd with 6:46 left then found his groove once Green was off the floor and closed with 12 points in the 3rd. That hot shooting continued in the 4th.

Why are you kissing his ass everytime?

3Q Green foul 4 GSW 53-50 MIN
3Q end GSW GSW 73-69 MIN

4Q Green foul 6 GSW 82-86 MIN
4Q end GSW 97-102 MIN

The guy finished with 2pts 2reb 4ast 5tovs -5p/m and 6fouls. Randle made him his b.... second game in a row. Everywhere shouting/fouling/technicals, suspension incoming... no rebounds, no passing, no scoring, no space and a lot of turnovers for this production...Yes good, sometimes elite defender, but where are a lot of other aspects of game where he is hurting team

[Onus]

So scored 17pts (21min) w/o Green and 19pts (27min) with Green on floor...the same s...t

11 points on 17 off in the 2nd half alone.

Ant had 3 in the 3rd with 6:46 left then found his groove once Green was off the floor and closed with 12 points in the 3rd. That hot shooting continued in the 4th.

Why are you kissing his ass everytime?

3Q Green foul 4 GSW 53-50 MIN
3Q end GSW GSW 73-69 MIN

4Q Green foul 6 GSW 82-86 MIN
4Q end GSW 97-102 MIN

The guy finished with 2pts 2reb 4ast 5tovs -5p/m and 6fouls. Randle made him his b.... second game in a row. Everywhere shouting/fouling/technicals, suspension incoming... no rebounds, no passing, no scoring, no space and a lot of turnovers for this production...Yes good, sometimes elite defender, but where are a lot of other aspects of game where he is hurting team

Look at the scores. They scored 20 points in 6:46. They scored 53 in 29:14 min before that. The only way we win is if the game is in the 90s, Dray is the reason the game can be in the 90s.

Yes, Dray has a lot of issues, but for us to win a game without Steph we're going to need to win a game in the 90s and Dray will be part of the reason we will be able to hold them to 90. He's also a reason we only score 90 but we don't have enough scoring to out score the Wolves without Steph.

I would love to be able to reduce our reliance on Dray next year. To get some actual usable bigs that can play defense and score, but unfortunately we don't have the roster to not play Dray.

[AirP.]

This season is over….Kerr couldn’t incorporate Kuminga and burned out our veterans. That was so shortsighted.

To rush Curry back isn’t a smartest thing. We have a lot examples, the last one was Lillard. Another one Kobe…Durant could be added….this is the scariest thing for me at the moment.

Kuminga doesn't fit how this roster plays even if he's one of the most talented players, I have to believe Kerr has asked him to play a different way but that doesn't seem to be part of Kuminga's agenda since GS is in year 4 of Kuminga but this year, while looking like a .500 team Kerr let Kuminga basically play how he wants and gave him minutes. He's a high-volume shooter on a team that usually needs to run the offense to generate shots for Curry who is by far much better than Kuminga. Butler isn't exactly the right type to play with Curry but he's made it a priority to generate looks for Curry which Kuminga really never did, in fact I watched game after game Kuminga would get the ball far from the basket and just ignore everyone else on the team while he tried to score which is the exact opposite you want from a player when Curry is on the court with that player.

A big reason why Kuminga wasn't moved at the deadline probably was his salary and what could be brought back in that salary slot vs what could possibly be brought back in a sign and trade situation this summer.

It seems really easy for me to understand why Kuminga wasn't playing and why he is now with Curry out. I think most are looking past the Curry era and if you think Kuminga as one of your top paid players is the way to go, you're not going to be happy with the results long term. Go for it now why you have a special player like Curry and also try to figure out a good balance of using a "few" assets to maximize Curry/GS shot at a championship (which should be the overall goal) while also not having the cupboard empty for the after Curry era.

[DB23]

ANT had 11 points total when Green went out in the 3rd quarter at 6:46 min. Ant finished that quarter with 23 points total. That means 12 points were scored when Green was out of the game.
https://www.nba.com/game/min-vs-gsw-0042400233/play-by-play?period=Q3

So scored 17pts (21min) w/o Green and 19pts (27min) with Green on floor...the same s...t

11 points on 17 off in the 2nd half alone.

Ant had 3 in the 3rd with 6:46 left then found his groove once Green was off the floor and closed with 12 points in the 3rd. That hot shooting continued in the 4th.

I’m happy to give him credit for the defense and Ant. He’s been amazing this playoffs so far.

But last game was not up to standard IMO and that had something to do with the narrative leading in I think. He looked in his own head

We need an a+ game on both sides to win game 4. Don’t see how we win without it from him

[Impuniti]

These takes on dray are hilarious. He’s the only reason we were able to keep ant in check. Once he went to the bench our defense fell apart. Dray is absolutely critical for us to win a game in 90s. Yes he had a terrible game offensively but he is our defense.

If the refs didn’t call this game like a regular season game, people were literally just falling down and Scott foster would call a foul, I think we win. This game didn’t resemble playoff basketball at all.

There needs to be a study at a university with the level of blind homerism Dray attains from the fanbase.

Why did Draymond go to the bench and only play 29 minutes in a must win pivotal game with Steph out? Couldn't be because, unsurprisingly, he was in foul trouble much of the game and then inevitably fouled out? Dray didn't just have a "terrible offensive game", he was terrible.

He had more fouls and turn overs than points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks put together. That's role player capability. On top of that, the guy who he defended was the best player of the game. He had a triple double and had his best game.. of the tournament.. of his entire playoff career (granted he was a serial choker before this season). Dray did lock in for much of the game and was elite at getting stops for 2-3 quarters.

Why are we all of the suddent treating Dray like the game is from the 1970s? Where if you can just defend, that's all you need. Lets excuse how he offers zero spacing offensively, and he's a terrible shooter and scorer for a second.. 2 points, lets move on from. What happened to boxing out, or grabbing boards, or not being a mouth breather offensively? Why the **** are some fans accepting this guy grabbing two rebounds? Have we all forgotten this is the same guy that had elite box out capability beforehand and averaged 8-10 rebounds in pivotal games with regularity?

This is Draymond's play in the 4th quarter when the team was up 4 points and had a solid lead:
- Dray tries to go for a highlight reel play like a moron and gambles, Randle goes past him for an easy dunk
- Grabs the ball trying to make up for it and immediately gets easily blocked by McDaniels in the next play
- Causes offensive foul 2 points down
- Dray TO in the next play
- Dray foul out in the next play

All within a 3 minute timeline where the Warriors had a comfortable lead, and from this point on it was just about the Wolves holding after flipping the game and going on a 9-0 run. I don't know if it's more embarrassing or impressive the level of delusion some fans have when it comes to this guy. If Dray is even mediocre 2 nights ago, this team is easily leading 2-1. Granted he was the clear MVP of game 1, but he was pitiful in game 3.

[vvoland]

These takes on dray are hilarious. He’s the only reason we were able to keep ant in check. Once he went to the bench our defense fell apart. Dray is absolutely critical for us to win a game in 90s. Yes he had a terrible game offensively but he is our defense.

If the refs didn’t call this game like a regular season game, people were literally just falling down and Scott foster would call a foul, I think we win. This game didn’t resemble playoff basketball at all.

There needs to be a study at a university with the level of blind homerism Dray attains from the fanbase.

Why did Draymond go to the bench and only play 29 minutes in a must win pivotal game with Steph out? Couldn't be because, unsurprisingly, he was in foul trouble much of the game and then inevitably fouled out? Dray didn't just have a "terrible offensive game", he was terrible.

He had more fouls and turn overs than points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks put together. That's role player capability. On top of that, the guy who he defended was the best player of the game. He had a triple double and had his best game.. of the tournament.. of his entire playoff career (granted he was a serial choker before this season). Dray did lock in for much of the game and was elite at getting stops for 2-3 quarters.

Why are we all of the suddent treating Dray like the game is from the 1970s? Where if you can just defend, that's all you need. Lets excuse how he offers zero spacing offensively, and he's a terrible shooter and scorer for a second.. 2 points, lets move on from. What happened to boxing out, or grabbing boards, or not being a mouth breather offensively? Why the **** are some fans accepting this guy grabbing two rebounds? Have we all forgotten this is the same guy that had elite box out capability beforehand and averaged 8-10 rebounds in pivotal games with regularity?

This is Draymond's play in the 4th quarter when the team was up 4 points and had a solid lead:
- Dray tries to go for a highlight reel play like a moron and gambles, Randle goes past him for an easy dunk
- Grabs the ball trying to make up for it and immediately gets easily blocked by McDaniels in the next play
- Causes offensive foul 2 points down
- Dray TO in the next play
- Dray foul out in the next play

All within a 3 minute timeline where the Warriors had a comfortable lead, and from this point on it was just about the Wolves holding after flipping the game and going on a 9-0 run. I don't know if it's more embarrassing or impressive the level of delusion some fans have when it comes to this guy. If Dray is even mediocre 2 nights ago, this team is easily leading 2-1. Granted he was the clear MVP of game 1, but he was pitiful in game 3.

Yes, those are all very fair points. He was terrible in game 3 but even with that being the case, if the challenge call goes our way and it's randle's foul, I think we win. By the way, i thought it was clearly a push off by randle, not a charge/block call but, foster is gonna foster. I don't really blame any 50/50 call going against dray, he's made his bed.

Do we really think Minny would have had no trouble scoring to end the 4th if dray was still in the game? Yes, he had a terrible game before fouling out but there's no one else I'd rather having quarterbacking my defense to end the game than dray. Minnesota scored 16 points in the last 4 minutes of the game after he fouled out (that's 4 points per minute). Before that, they scored 86 points in 44 minutes ( just under 2 points per minute). Yes, that is a very basic stat but it's also very telling. Considering the pace was likely much, much higher in the first 44 minutes than the last 4, on a PPP basis, those numbers are likely to be even more telling.

Yes, his poor play costs us games, including the last one. It is also true for Steph on offense and Kerr from the coaching bench. Remember when Steph shot a long jumper with like 12 seconds left in a game where we had the lead and could have ran the clock down to under 3 seconds? Maybe even 0 if he shot it real late and hit the rim? I can't think of a game, thi season, that Dray lost for us with such a huge mistake (the OKC game last year when he fouled Chet is the closest I can think of but we still had to lose in OT). Why isn't that game the reason we were in the play-in and had to fight our way through Hou instead of easily dispatching the lakers and being rested and at home for minny (assuming they beat hou)?

[ILOVEIT]

Podz will either be a winner or be the Harrison Barnes of this playoff.

ALL Warriors need is a decent (not chitty) game and they win game 3.....

IMO, one last chance to actually show up and score. If he doesn't, sit him for the rest of the series in favor of JK and Pat Spencer.