City of Brotherly Love vs the City. 7:30PT 2/29 Fri

[FNQ]

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You dont need a EC Reg...All we have to do is look for a lesser player with a shorter contract..

Al only runs through 09-10 though... I'd hope we could get an EC for him.We could break it down and save 5 mil or so and take a 2 year deal w/the balance. But even then, I'd target CLE right now. S&T Pietrus + Harrington for Joe Smith + Snow... 3rd string PG and backup PF, + no committments beyond the one season. CLE is desperately trying to keep LeBron... lets help

Before he comes out West too

[FNQ]

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WTF?? When did you say Al helps rebounding? I was banging that drum when you were still trying to trade Al for a ham sandwich?

I call bull s . There were not this many Al fans on the board before the Celtics game. In fact there were 2.

Me and maybe Floppy. He's ours and you can't have him.

Find some early year game threads... I was chiding everyone from Biedrins, Barnes, Mbenga... everyone cept Al as far as boxing out goes.

Now I did call him rock headed, a terrible help defender, a trainwreck, and even gave him his own statistic AHOR (Al Harrington Offensive Rebounds - getting your own rebound after missing a less than 2 ft shot)... but I did sing his praises about boxing out... I'm a sucker for the little things

[Sid the Squid]

I'm a sucker for BW-AB-Monta..Webber makes those guys better...Al does nothing for them..I like Al, but there's no place for him here anymore

[ILOVEIT]

GREAT game......defensively

I was LOVING watching the other team's players actually worried about getting THEIR shot blocked....

Not sure about a lineup of AB And BW...but....as long as BW is swatting shots....hopefully the Warriors are no longer a layup drill.

[Souvlaki]

Monta's defense is so horrible I don't know what to say. Him falling on his ass while his man makes a wide open jumper has to be a new low point. It's not just screens he's screwing up on. His man to man defense is atrocious. This wouldn't concern me so much, but what worries me is if he gets a huge contract this Summer. We are hitching our wagon to a guy who plays no defense and has no outside shot.

On the other hand, the I love his FG efficiency. But is it enough?

On another note, oh my. Wright is a player. Can you imagine him playing next to Beidrins? Awesome baby. His minutes will come along in time. I expect him to be playing 20+ a night before the season is out.

Webber had his best game yet. Can't wait till he's off the team.

Baron Von Brickmiester was on fire!

Pietrus used up one more of his four good games a year tonight. Prolly didn't need to.

Lets win 4 more now.

[Sleepy]

Just asking:
Would you guys have done this trade?

Code: Select all

Change in Team Outlook: +0.1 ppg, +1.3 rpg, and +1.6 apg.
Incoming Players
   Amir Johnson
6-9 SF / PF from Weschester (HS)
3.5 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.6 apg in 10.5 minutes
   Juan Dixon
6-3 PG from Maryland
1.5 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.8 minutes
   Lindsey Hunter
6-2 PG from Jackson State
2.1 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 1.6 apg in 8.3 minutes
   Walter Herrmann
6-10 PF from Argentina (Foreign)
2.4 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.4 apg in 6.4 minutes
   Jarvis Hayes
6-8 SF / SG from Georgia
6.8 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 0.7 apg in 16.0 minutes
Outgoing Players
   Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
14.6 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 1.5 apg in 28.0 minutes
   Patrick O'Bryant
7-0 C from Bradley
1.6 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.2 apg in 4.3 minutes
 
Detroit Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: -0.1 ppg, -1.3 rpg, and -1.6 apg.
Incoming Players
   Al Harrington
6-9 PF / SF from St. Patrick's (HS)
14.6 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 1.5 apg in 28.0 minutes
   Patrick O'Bryant
7-0 C from Bradley
1.6 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.2 apg in 4.3 minutes
Outgoing Players
   Amir Johnson
6-9 SF / PF from Weschester (HS)
3.5 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.6 apg in 10.5 minutes
   Juan Dixon
6-3 PG from Maryland
1.5 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.8 minutes
   Lindsey Hunter
6-2 PG from Jackson State
2.1 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 1.6 apg in 8.3 minutes
   Walter Herrmann
6-10 PF from Argentina (Foreign)
2.4 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.4 apg in 6.4 minutes
   Jarvis Hayes
6-8 SF / SG from Georgia
6.8 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 0.7 apg in 16.0 minutes

Deadline has passed, but whatever... would've been a nice little trade to reduce the payroll while getting an backup PG and a new Pietrus...

[Sleepy51]

I'm a sucker for BW-AB-Monta..Webber makes those guys better...Al does nothing for them..I like Al, but there's no place for him here anymore

the jury's still WAAY out on Webber's impact. Logic says his passing will improve them as floorgame players, but there really isn't any evidence yet.

Al . . . no, Al is not a player who is going to make the game eaiser for everyone else. But he is a player who is going to help them win games.

Besides, there's no way Webber's body loosens up for another run next year. He's here to run a passing clinic through this year's playoffs and then he's back making chicken and waffles in sac.

I hope he helps, but he's not a long term piece of anything.

[turk3d]

The reason we wouldn't do that trade imo is because at the time, we hadn't really gotten much of glimpse of Wright as to how well he might fit in if he were playing on a regular basis. We also didn't know what Webber would bring to us either. Now that we have (to some degree) I think that trade would be more in the realm of possibility although I still think we don't do it because of the insurance factor which Al gives us, regardless of how well Wright pans out. We can't be sure about Webber lasting the rest of the season either due to potential health concerns.

[roleplay3r2]

But is it enough?

Enough for what, exactly?

Monta's not the only great scorer to play mediocre defense. At least he's young and could improve.

[Sid the Squid]

Monta and Baron's D was fine when Brandan was in the game..That's the way it's going to be from now on...You stick Webber-Harrington out there, and my one-legged nephew *Otis the PG* could score at the rim with the way the NBA rules are these days...

[FNQ]

LF has a messed up family of retards and gimps

[mistatwo mayn]

Nellie is playing a balancing act; bench Biedrins so Al doesn't get his feelings hurt.

Nellie obviously knew what he had in Wright, and I think Al mentioned something in the beginning of the year/early in the year that Brandan will be the team's PF.

Al wants to be one of the 5 names on the damm T-shirt. He's a vet, and doesn't wanna sit for Monta when his boys Jax and Baron are running the show.

It's nothing, and Nellie has tried to put Al on the floor.

[floppymoose]

However, somehow we're the second worst opponents' offensive rebounding team in the league?

Yes. But I think that has more to do with Al playing out of position, and Al playing with with undersized partners at the forward spots, than with him being horrid. I see him as a bit below average at rebounding for PF (and horrid for C) - speaking in a team rebounding sense.

[Mylie10]

If Nellie could promise me that Neither Barnes or Pietrus would see time at the 4 then I have no complaints to speak of.

Al and Wright balancing the 4 and then Webber and Beans holding down the 5, then that's a fine mix of talent.

Having Barnes play the 3 and Pietrus play the 2/3, then we will hold out own with most team in the rebound department.

The problem comes when Barnes/Pete play the 4.

Croshere's not a bad rebounder either.

Just keep playing Brandan and resist the Barnes / Pete being bigs and the rebounding will be fine.

The thing that makes the biggest difference to me is the shot blocking threat with both Beans and Wright. Barnes and Pete have always been decent shot blockers as 3's, and Baron's good as a one.

But having Wright included in the discussion means that other teams can't just waltz into the lane free reign when he's out there and Beans isn't.

12 blocked shots! Are you kidding me!

[Chris Cohan]

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Yes. But I think that has more to do with Al playing out of position, and Al playing with with undersized partners at the forward spots, than with him being horrid. I see him as a bit below average at rebounding for PF (and horrid for C) - speaking in a team rebounding sense.

Definitely out of position.

That's what I said-- he needs to be a big SF, not an unorthodox PF. Al gets away with a lot of shoving, especially from his favorite position behind opposing rebounders, and he is decidedly and WELL below average as a rebounder from the PF position in the NBA.

Moving away from the raw rebound numbers and how rarely Perimeter Al is anywhere close to where he would need to be to make a real, NBA-caliber difference on the offensive glass for the high volume Warriors attack is one way to shift the focus to how poor the Warriors as a team are rebounding the ball. But when even Matt Barnes has a higher rebounding rate than Harrington and when Harrington can't at least pick up enough cheapies to bolster his weak raw numbers given that the Warriors miss the amount of shots they miss and their opponents often get caught in launching more shots than they normally would when they play the Warriors for more total rebounding opportunities, it becomes clear that Harrington is simply not a good rebounder as a PF in the NBA.

There's really only one NBA player with the 4 tag (so this won't count Kirilenko and Rashard Lewis) who plays as many as or more minutes than Al and gets fewer rebounds: Boris Diaw.

Not good company.

[Twinkie defense]

Nelson yells at Harrington all the time now. It's "Al's turn." Nelson was pretty assertive/abusive (depending upon your perspective) last night when Al was pulled after making a mistake on the floor.

Al's been getting it for a long time - he was getting it from Nellie last season, too.

In fact I think it's more the rule than the exception that players get yelled at by Nellie. Toughlove. Tom Tolbert (who loves Nellie) said he used to think Nellie thought his first name was Dammit... "Dammit Tolbert!" He's been hard on Monta, too, and was certainly tough on Webber his first time around... and that was a guy Nellie broke the bank to get.

We need to trade Al for a shorter length contract...You're not going to be able to trade him for = talent coming back.

That would really deflate my opinion of the Warriors motives. One can easily argue (and I often have) that every move the Warriors have made since Nellie came back have been about improving the talent level, not saving money (though the money savings have been a nice benefit, and were certainly a part of the equation)... Murphy, Dunleavy, and Ike for Jackson and Harrington: talent upgrade; J-Rich for B-Right: talent upgrade (getting bigger, though you lose the immediate impact factor in losing Rich while waiting for Brandan to do his thing); even buying out Runi and Foyle allowed them to get more servicable players.

The Warriors still have a razor-thin rotation. They can't take a step back in talent. I'm okay with moving Al, and think he has value around the League. But if you move him it has to be along with something else for a talent upgrade (we've got enough young guys, how about trading a first). Otherwise it's better to keep him here, ideally as 6th man as Brandan gets locked into the PF slot.

[turk3d]

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In fact I think it's more the rule than the exception that players get yelled at by Nellie. Toughlove. Tom Tolbert (who loves Nellie) said he used to think Nellie thought his first name was Dammit... "Dammit Tolbert!" He's been hard on Monta, too, and was certainly tough on Webber his first time around... and that was a guy Nellie broke the bank to get.

You (he) can get away with it with scrubs like Tolbert and maybe 20 year olds, but you don't do that with most veterans, particularly ones who give off the impression of being part-time gangsta. You might do it once and a while, but if it's on a regular basis you're asking for big trouble imo. There's much better ways to approach a veteran on an issue you might have with them, but you don't want to do it in front of other players and during a game, you do it in private. That's very dangerous, especially for a guy like Al, who's well liked in the locker room. Nellie better watch himself. The trade deadline's over (so he can't trade him anymore).

[Twinkie defense]

It certainly backfired with Webber the first time around. But a scorpion's gotta sting, right?

And if that's the case Turk, why is it that players seem to go out of their way to praise Nellie? I'm not saying Al won't blow up in Nellie's face, I'm just trying to reconcile two things: Nellie's hard on players; players love playing for Nellie.

I've heard it said before that players appreciate knowing where they stand. They don't want to hear "you're great, I love you" one day, then ride the pine or get sent to Minneapolis the next... which I think is the two-faced BS players get from a lot of coaches in the League.