Monta's a better PG than APG indicates...

[old rem]

Reggae are you still thinking Monta will be (or already is) a true PG... meaning QB of the squad, knows how to find guys in the right spot, great court vision, delivers the ball in the right position, strong assist/turnover ratio (and ideally, close to double-digit assists per game), knows when to push it and when to back off, etc?

I know a fair number of posters felt he was pretty much there this season, but lately I've been hearing a lot of people talk about Monta (like Steinmetz, Tolbert, Kawakami) as a 2 or combo guard, without real PG skills.

Like I've said many times, I think Monta was very good this season, has the potential to be great, my favorite Warrior, but that he's a natural combo guard and forcing him into a role that's not right for him is to diminish his impact.

So basically I'm wondering how high people still are on Monta the PG.

I expect Monta to BECOME a real solid PG..just not yet. As is...he's as good as a few starting PG's,with some regularity. Once in awhile looks like a Star PG...which is about all I'd expect at this time. thing is....he DID become a better SG/Combo than expected. Doing what he's doing--he's star grade quite often.

[Chris Cohan]

If Baron would give the ball up pre-crappy shot, you'd be close to on the way to an occasionally correct opinion on a handful of Warriors possessions in games that the static half court set with an actual play in place makes more than a few appearances with Ellis actually give the chance to do something. But then you'd need for Ellis to actually do what a hack who doesn't actually show up to all that many Warriors games in relative media attendance terms says he does although it's a ridiculously silly summary of how muthaf__king good Ellis actually is at setting up teammates in a motion half court he has to improvise in or in moving the ball to open men or running legitimate pick and roll when the chuckers move the hell out of the way for the high percentage kats to get it done right.

Other than that, you were really, really close. Keep it up!

[FNQ]

There's plenty to criticize about Monta and still be correct... TK's got zero analysis skills. He later goes on to describe how he'd trade Biedrins to get Love, fawning over his outlet passing. His outlet passing. Yes, he does it well, but he wants to sacrifice Beans or Wright for outlet passing.



Monta got slightly less assists than Baron despite significantly less touches.. he worked the pick and roll well, and became a very effective and efficient passer on the drive. Not just kicking it out for 3s either, as he often gave it to Beans, Al, and anyone else down low for an easy 2.

The reason why Monta gets praise while Baron gets villified is simple: use of talent. Monta uses his effectively and is a very smart player.. Baron uses his sparingly and is only a basketball talent. And that's why one is our top priority to lock up while the other can't get an extension offer that doesn't hurt.

[Twinkie defense]

Yeah I wouldn't trade Biedrins or Wright for a shot at Love (though I do think we overvalue both those guys). But Tim is spot-on that the lack of ball movement and good passing (good passers) was a huge problem. And a Vlade/Brad Miller/vintage Chris Webber type in the post would go a long way to address that.

[FNQ]

I think thats another spot of TK being half right and then assuming the rest... he's spot on about the passing of the rest of the team and then falls into the Monta generality... a generality that hasn't been true since December, and to be frank, a perception on the boards that hasn't changed because the people don't like the attitude of the people who said this was coming all along.

[Chris Cohan]

Yeah I wouldn't trade Biedrins or Wright for a shot at Love (though I do think we overvalue both those guys). But Tim is spot-on that the lack of ball movement and good passing (good passers) was a huge problem. And a Vlade/Brad Miller/vintage Chris Webber type in the post would go a long way to address that.

I agree with anyone who says Love has skill and a place in the NBA.
Where that place is is highly debatable but I think we'll just have to see what happens when he actually hits premier NBA speed, size, skill, and competition. I have my doubts and am positive he is not the NBA talent Horford and Wright are, not even close in the long run, but I'm happy to see some of his unique big man game translate to actual NBA productivity.
And he's incredibly smart, which goes a long way with me as a Dunleavy and Fisher apologist, and so on and so forth.

I do not agree that Biedrins is overrated anywhere. He has been very subtly kept under the general NBA radar but has also been one of the most effective and efficient players developing in the league. Run down some game matrices and he starts to show up as the Warriors' number one key to success in lots of important ways. He has obvious 15-10 stuff now that Love does not in the NBA and Love is likely not going to improve in enough ways to become a dominant scorer or rebounder. Biedrins has the complete NBA C package in terms of size, speed, athleticism, length, and quickness and he has learned the game at a phenomenal pace. The guy is already a top 10 C and there's simply no way to overrate that. None! He is not being offered a max deal, would not get one, but is an absolute game changer we all saw make the difference on numerous occasions.

[Subaculta]

-= original quote snipped =-



I agree with anyone who says Love has skill and a place in the NBA.
Where that place is is highly debatable but I think we'll just have to see what happens when he actually hits premier NBA speed, size, skill, and competition. I have my doubts and am positive he is not the NBA talent Horford and Wright are, not even close in the long run, but I'm happy to see some of his unique big man game translate to actual NBA productivity.
And he's incredibly smart, which goes a long way with me as a Dunleavy and Fisher apologist, and so on and so forth.

I do not agree that Biedrins is overrated anywhere. He has been very subtly kept under the general NBA radar but has also been one of the most effective and efficient players developing in the league. Run down some game matrices and he starts to show up as the Warriors' number one key to success in lots of important ways. He has obvious 15-10 stuff now that Love does not in the NBA and Love is likely not going to improve in enough ways to become a dominant scorer or rebounder. Biedrins has the complete NBA C package in terms of size, speed, athleticism, length, and quickness and he has learned the game at a phenomenal pace. The guy is already a top 10 C and there's simply no way to overrate that. None! He is not being offered a max deal, would not get one, but is an absolute game changer we all saw make the difference on numerous occasions.

+1

agree whole heartedly with everything you said here.

as for Love I think he has the ability to be a poor man's Brad Miller (which is nothing to be unhappy about), the problem with him might end up being on the man defense (not unlike Dunleavy) whereas team d will not be as big of a problem.

as for Beans, he's definitely a top 10 center... nothing better then having a player that seemingly gives and gives and rarely takes. Efficient with his touches, scores off of offensive rebounds, blocks a couple shots, makes the right pass and cut... hopefully we get to watch him continue to develop here in GS.

[St.Nick]

I agree that we need a guy that can draw the double team in the post and know how to kick it out to the perimeter for open looks.

Do you guys think that Wright has the potential to be our passing big man in the post? I think he has great vision, but until he establishes himself as a threat on the block and not just a skinny kid with potential I think we are going to see the same contested 3 pointers that we have been seeing for the last two years (and beyond, quite frankly).

Looking for a smart, bulky, post guy in this draft would be a great move for the franchise. Kevin Love gets my vote. The only question is, how do we get him?