Don't trade Baron - Make your case

[Sleepy]

Warriors with a good Baron-trade > Warriors with Baron > Warriors without Baron > Warriors without a good Baron-trade

It's simply the JRich situation all over again. Jason had his problems, he wasn't a winner (never will be?), the whole damn thing. But we would've been a better team this season with him and probably would've made the playoffs.

The Jason-trade helped the franchise. We got cap-room to resign the future and a promising player. If we can get the same for Baron, I say do it.
But that doesn't mean subtracting Baron will make the team better. 510 sometimes sounds like he's the devil himself and looses games just by chucking threes and taking games of partying. That's nonsense. Or is somebody really argueing that we would've been a better team this season if Baron had torn his ACL in a preseason game against the Lakers?

Same thing about this Monta-as-PG thing.
PG:Monta - SG:Allstar is better than PG:Allstar - SG:Monta... problem is, in our case that means: PG: Monta - SG:Azu or PG: Baron - SG: Monta...
Monta may be a good PG, but that doesn't mean that firing Baron into the sun will improve the team.

[Onus]

Baron Davis with his athletic gifts and his physical stature screams at worst top 5 pg. There's no other player with his size and athleticism at the pg position. Deron Williams is the same size but not quite as athletic, Chris Paul doesnt have the size. He just needs to mature, not settle for 3's as he does, he should be able to get into the paint against just about anybody as montae does and that is when the warriors are at their best.

Considering we were in the top of the league in points in the paint with a very limited post up game is quite amazing, just wish baron would take notice.

[djdamon]

Baron Davis is our best player, i don't know how you trade your best player and get better

[GSWhoopfan]

Yeah, Miami had a hurt Shaq, Ricky Davis, and Udonis Haslem.

Baron had Monta Ellis, Andris Biedrins, and Al Harrington...

Its funny how people just dont get that Baron's not a winner... he's not a player... he's a talent and has been for a decade. He suffers from the exact same mental block as Pietrus, yet because he's more talented than Trainwreck, that makes it OK for him to chuck a ton and not play D.

Both of them are gonna be all-stars in the future too. Just ask them.

Haslem, Ricky Davis, and Williams are respectable players for one thing.

In the East, you needed 38 wins to make the playoffs. In the freakin East. The Heat had enough talent to win 38 games. They gave up. Wade was injured, but then they started throwing in dleaguers and gave up. I think its what, 52 games you play against the Eastern teams...cmon man. Riley is who i blame for their failures. No intensity from his true players.

First lets get Toine for Baron...because you were certain Toine had 1 year, then you find out he doesnt....then you come back and say Toine is gonna settle for a buyout...

Now Pietrus and Baron have the same mental block...The only thing these guys have in common is that they both wear a Warriors jersey and want to play in Oakland.

You dont like Baron Davis as a person, as an athlete, as a person who gives back to the community. I think you are just a hater.

I mean thats cool...i hate Foyle no matter what good he does. The same goes for Fisher. Fcuk those guys.

[Sleepy]

slightly OT:

PJA has a thread on the trade forum where we get Rasheed for Al Harrington + #14. I'd kill for that trade and even expand it:

Baron Davis & Al Harrington & Perovic & #14 for Rasheed Wallace & Chauncy Billups & Jason Maxiell

I'd NEVER do this if I were Detroit, but the trade forum guys seem to like the idea of giving away Sheed and Billups.

PG: Billups
SG: Monta
SF: Jack
PF: Sheed
C: Biedrins
Bench: Wright, Max, Bellinelli (Cro/Azu/Barnes/Pietrus)

Not sure if Sheed is a good role-model for Wright off court, but playing with him will improve his game a lot. Sheed expires in a year, so there's not much money to take on. Only problem is Chauncy hefty four year deal, but I'd be willing to take that to get this done.

[St.Nick]

If we were going to do a trade involving Baron it would be for the future and not for two guys older than him and making a lot more money (Chauncey makes 35.3M over the next three years, Rasheed makes 14M next year).

That team makes the playoffs and then most likely loses by the 2nd round. Meanwhile, we are on the hook for a ton of money, Wright stays on the bench, and Monta gets ingrained as a SG.

[Chris Cohan]

Trading Baron is not in the cards this offseason so it's status quo to start the year. Better hope the Jackson career year and Davis contract push is still in effect.

The Warriors don't get to sneak up on teams anymore so Nelson is going to have to actually coach. If he's talking about NOT winning championships and building for the future in the paper, what's a poor (contract push wannabe championship leader) Baron to do?

[turk3d]

slightly OT:

PJA has a thread on the trade forum where we get Rasheed for Al Harrington + #14. I'd kill for that trade and even expand it:

Baron Davis & Al Harrington & Perovic & #14 for Rasheed Wallace & Chauncy Billups & Jason Maxiell

I'd NEVER do this if I were Detroit, but the trade forum guys seem to like the idea of giving away Sheed and Billups.

PG: Billups
SG: Monta
SF: Jack
PF: Sheed
C: Biedrins
Bench: Wright, Max, Bellinelli (Cro/Azu/Barnes/Pietrus)

Not sure if Sheed is a good role-model for Wright off court, but playing with him will improve his game a lot. Sheed expires in a year, so there's not much money to take on. Only problem is Chauncy hefty four year deal, but I'd be willing to take that to get this done.

So would Nellie. So what, what's one more incorrigible for us?

Forget about the rest of the deal though.

[FNQ]

-= original quote snipped =-



Haslem, Ricky Davis, and Williams are respectable players for one thing.

In the East, you needed 38 wins to make the playoffs. In the freakin East. The Heat had enough talent to win 38 games. They gave up. Wade was injured, but then they started throwing in dleaguers and gave up. I think its what, 52 games you play against the Eastern teams...cmon man. Riley is who i blame for their failures. No intensity from his true players.

First lets get Toine for Baron...because you were certain Toine had 1 year, then you find out he doesnt....then you come back and say Toine is gonna settle for a buyout...

Now Pietrus and Baron have the same mental block...The only thing these guys have in common is that they both wear a Warriors jersey and want to play in Oakland.

You dont like Baron Davis as a person, as an athlete, as a person who gives back to the community. I think you are just a hater.

I mean thats cool...i hate Foyle no matter what good he does. The same goes for Fisher. Fcuk those guys.

Toine DOES have only one year. Unless of course, you think a team is going to pick up his option No wonder you're so anti-anythng good for us - you don't read/comprehend it when you see it!

Baron is a talent who doesn't know how to use it well for prolonged stretches. Pietrus is a minimal talent / athlete who doesn'y know how to use it well for prolonged stretches. Both are basketball dumb. But Baron has more talent, so he's obviously smarter

Who gives a about Baron Davis the person... I only care about the player, and he hasn't been one for his entire career. Now he's going to be gone in one year (if there is a basketball God) and I want to recoup an asset at what should be his peak value to us. What a terrible idea... I should sit on my thumbs and hope after a decade Baron finally turns on the light switch. Completely ignore the fact that this situation has happened twice before Baron and once with us.

Its the Nellie thing all over again... if ya'll want to be zombies, again, and ignore the past, again - that's your deal.. some of us just don't turn a blind eye to the fact that Baron's an inefficient leader and PG, and that the only way he'll ever succeed is to know he's not the #1, and to have someone better than him keeping him under control.

[FNQ]

If we were going to do a trade involving Baron it would be for the future and not for two guys older than him and making a lot more money (Chauncey makes 35.3M over the next three years, Rasheed makes 14M next year).

That team makes the playoffs and then most likely loses by the 2nd round. Meanwhile, we are on the hook for a ton of money, Wright stays on the bench, and Monta gets ingrained as a SG.

[kool-aid]

Well the 2nd round is better than the 1st round and being out of the playoffs, we win more = better so if we can trade Baron + Wright or Biedrins or Ellis I would do it.

Sure it hurts us long term but I really, really want my team to be in the playoffs after 1 in the past 13 years, and I like making scarecrow arguments to try and justify it, when the reason is just simply and purely that I want to be entertained. I have no place in a logical basketball argument!

[/kool-aid]

[St.Nick]

Reggae, are you (Please Use More Appropriate Word)?

[St.Nick]

Or is it just rabies?

[old rem]

Warriors with a good Baron-trade > Warriors with Baron > Warriors without Baron > Warriors without a good Baron-trade

It's simply the JRich situation all over again. Jason had his problems, he wasn't a winner (never will be?), the whole damn thing. But we would've been a better team this season with him and probably would've made the playoffs.

The Jason-trade helped the franchise. We got cap-room to resign the future and a promising player. If we can get the same for Baron, I say do it.
But that doesn't mean subtracting Baron will make the team better. 510 sometimes sounds like he's the devil himself and looses games just by chucking threes and taking games of partying. That's nonsense. Or is somebody really argueing that we would've been a better team this season if Baron had torn his ACL in a preseason game against the Lakers?

Same thing about this Monta-as-PG thing.
PG:Monta - SG:Allstar is better than PG:Allstar - SG:Monta... problem is, in our case that means: PG: Monta - SG:Azu or PG: Baron - SG: Monta...
Monta may be a good PG, but that doesn't mean that firing Baron into the sun will improve the team.

good perspective Sleepy.

Had we all watched the other top 5 PG's for 70-80 games we might fixate on their flaws. Baron ain't perfect--but he does not suck.

At some point Monta could be a top 5 PG...not yet. Meanwhile he is a damn good SG.

I've got the impression that "blow it up" done every 2 years generally amounts to running in circles. Next summer-a new guy probably replaces Nellie. Foyle's off the books and Baron's expired. jax and Harrington are expiring 1 year guys. Changes are likely-then.

Meanwhile....what we can get from the last year of Nellie (probably) is about fine tuning,a winning attitude, building a core. "Future Talent"? does not appear to be Nellie's thing. Nellie won't want to kiss off next season or re-invent his tactics,and so won't want Baron to go.