DRAFT THREAD part II: Come Together.... Right Now....

Left*My*Heart · Post #101 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:18 pm

Didn't say they were looking for a rookie to put them over the top next season.

What I am stating is not what I want to do, but what I think the Warriors are going to do. I don't agree with what I think the Warriors are going to do with their draft pick.

This team has numerous holes and is no way a playoff team. If they are keeping the pick, they want someone to contribute this season, not sit on the bench for three years learning the game. You can't pop off that you are going to be a playoff team next season and draft a long term project.

Having a long term plan is ideal, but don't you think it is hard to have a long term plan when you are in trade discussions with virtually every team in the league? It is like they are throwing crap against the wall and seeing what sticks...we will see.

I completely agree with the strategy to pick the BPA...potential. I would take Bismack if I believed 5 years down the road he would be the best player I could have drafted.

However, from the rumors I have been hearing, the Warriors want Klay. I am extremely disappointed that this is the route they have chosen and can only feel comfort in the fact that Riley has two fairly solid picks since running the draft. West is supposedly giddy about Klay and there are several teams/scouts that are very high on him as well. He has drastically shot up in the draft due to solid workouts. Yes, this might be a smoke screen to get some team to bite so the player they are after falls to them, but the past several drafts our pick wasn't a secret.

EvanZ · Post #102 » by **EvanZ** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:35 pm

I understand. Good news is Klay might not be there at 11.

old rem · Post #103 » by **old rem** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:43 pm

Bizzy_Bee wrote:Before Biyombo's workout people knew his game was all defense and little offense. After Biyombo's workout, people can see that he is all defense and little offense. Yet some people are acting like the workout should drop his stock. We didn't learn anything new and that workout, or at least the video of it, highlighted all of his weaknesses and none of his strengths. I hope it drops his stock so he does fall to us.

Seems like most of you are basing your judgment off of some reports and this workout video. Biyombo is exactly what the warriors need. He is a game changer. His biggest asset by far is his MOTOR. This kid does not stop moving. He hustles for everything and leaves it all on the floor every time he plays. He's also better on offense then he is given credit for. Horrible shooter and bad post moves but he is extremely active on the offensive glass and gets extra possessions and keeps balls alive. Plus he is athletic enough that he can finish the gimmes and would be a great alley oop recipient similar to tyson chandler.

Im definitely buying the ben wallace hype. I think Biyombo is easily a top 5 player in this draft. Please do not compare him to Thabeet, not even remotely close as players. Thabeet was horribly slow and unathletic, he just happened to be massive.

As far as Klay Thompson I watched him a ton in his college career. Great college scorer, and eventually could turn into a Chase Budinger type in the NBA. With that said i don't think this kid will do much at all in the league. Extremely streaker shooter and player, but not talented enough to be allowed to work through the cold streaks in the NBA if that makes sense. His ideal role would be on a good team that needs a scorer off the bench but I don't see him as starter material on a good team at any point. My biggest problem with Klay is that he is the last thing the warriors need. I would much rather have a Chris Singleton type than Klay.

Yes and no. One could compare Biyombo to Wallace or Foyle. Which it is in part depends on GSW doing right. Worried about Shaq....GSW had Foyle pack on pounds and while he could hold position better...he lost hops and quickness. The same may happen with Biyombo who,like Foyle out of college,has rare wingspan ,good hops,fast reflexes. Foyle actually had an inch and 10 lb on Biyumbo.
IF...coached just right. In any event, Biyombo is a bit of a wild card and project. If you can mess up Foyle and Diogu and POB and BeRight...nobody is safe if taller than 6-7. Granted, new coach etc. should help but screwing up the tall folks is a tradition spanning many coaches and GM's.

Probably a curse from trading Wilt.

EvanZ · Post #104 » by **EvanZ** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:48 pm

Didn't we also trade Parrish and a pick that became McHale for picks that became Rickey Brown and Joe Barry Carroll? The basketball gods are still laughing at us for that one, I guess.

old rem · Post #105 » by **old rem** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:54 pm

EvanZ wrote:
Left*My*Heart wrote:Too many holes to fill on a team that is supposed to make the playoffs this coming season.

Supposed to?

Memphis won 46 games. We won 36 and are behind 3 other teams, who are arguably much closer to "supposed to make the playoffs" next season. Very few rookies in the history of the league could come in a provide a 10 game turnaround (the Clips won 8 more games this season with Blake Griffin, Wizards actually lost 5 more games with Wall). I don't think there are any of those at 11. Do you?

It's a recipe for failure if you are expecting a rookie (especially the 11th pick in a weak draft) to put us over the top next season. Sorry, but that's just not realistic at all.

The smart thing to do is look long term, 3-4 years down the road. Pick the player who will contribute the most when we actually have a good team. If you think that's Klay or Marcus Morris, well, fine. But don't pick the guy just because he is the "most NBA ready". That's never a good draft strategy.

That kind of short-sighted fix-it-now philosophy has doomed this team for far, far too long.

True. Most likely #11 is not the big boost,but the W's CAN play the draft,several ways,and get a lift. Jackson, if a better coach,can add wins. Moves that may seem small but improve the OTHER 10 guys who tend to be overlooked..also can help. Some teams usually very good are now very old. The Suns could drop like a rock. The Jazz are in transition,Portland still needs a PG and C who are not old or damaged.

LAC, Sac and Minny should be improved though. The West does not have a lot of soft targets.
Too bad GSW is not an East team.

I DO believe you aim high, CONTENDER rather than 8 seed. That is a more long range target. However....Raw Projects...often fail badly.

Left*My*Heart · Post #106 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:56 pm

Adonal Foyle wo/shoes =6' 8.5" weight 263 wingspan = 7' 5.5"
Bismack Biyombo wo/shoes= 6' 8.31" weight=245 wingspan= 7' 6.16"

This is from Draftexpress pre-draft measurements. The Foyle measurements are reported measurements, while Biyombo's are actual.

Mylie10 · Post #107 » by **Mylie10** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:59 pm

I really want Kawhi......I hope that somehow he lands with us.

I'll be ok with whoever we take though, because they really seem to be doing their work, and there are multiple voices in the room.

The only thing that bugs me is this....Travis Shlenk early on in the process stated that the Warriors will add a defender or big man if possible......Now we here how giddy they are about the offensive only Klay Thompson....That ess bugs me......Also bugs when I hear Riley say crap like the draft is weak..blah blah blah....I hope they're smokescreening and have a real plan for a player.

Klay Thompson (smokescreen) might be gifted offensively, but he's also a streaky player, and doesn't play any D. This team needs a defender in the worst way, and it'd be nice to find a more well rounded player to bring in here. That speaks to need I know, but damn can we get it right please?

Daminger · Post #108 » by **Daminger** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:00 pm

I'm buying that the new staff/FO will help change the culture a bit regarding big men and defense. I'm a guard when I play and I love the uptempo, high-scoring style...but everyone knows we need a strong defensive presence, especially one that can be a game-changer like Biyombo.

Let's be clear again, we have the #11 pick. Whomever we choose, we'll hit the lotto if he becomes an all-star. But at least with Biyombo we get a package of the highest ceiling AND a glaring team need being filled. I think his floor is an Adonal Foyle type at worst and there's no guarantee he pans out. However, with the #11 pick in a **** draft, why not shoot for the upside while filling a need on the downside? What bodes well, like many have said, are his smarts, motor and freakish wingspan that cannot really be compared to others. Those we are comparing him to are taller stiffs who were less athletic. We've also seen him produce, albeit in limited minutes, in a highly respected league outside of the NBA (vs...college? HS?).

There will certainly be different schools of thought on who we should take but based on everything that I've read online and heard, it seems that its boiling down to: Klay Thompson vs. Biyombo. Guys like Morris and Singleton were either projected much earlier on or are what this board and fan base seem to want. However, I just dont hear their names too much in the same sentence with the Warriors.

So who do we think is a better prospect and fit for the dubs...Biyombo or Klay? I wouldnt mind Klay but I'm grabbing Biyombo if he's there.

Mylie10 · Post #109 » by **Mylie10** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:02 pm

Daminger wrote:I'm buying that the new staff/FO will help change the culture a bit regarding big men and defense. I'm a guard when I play and I love the uptempo, high-scoring style...but everyone knows we need a strong defensive presence, especially one that can be a game-changer like Biyombo.

Let's be clear again, we have the #11 pick. Whomever we choose, we'll hit the lotto if he becomes an all-star. But at least with Biyombo we get a package of the highest ceiling AND a glaring team need being filled. I think his floor is an Adonal Foyle type at worst and there's no guarantee he pans out. However, with the #11 pick in a **** draft, why not shoot for the upside while filling a need on the downside? What bodes well, like many have said, are his smarts, motor and freakish wingspan that cannot really be compared to others. Those we are comparing him to are taller stiffs who were less athletic. We've also seen him produce, albeit in limited minutes, in a highly respected league outside of the NBA (vs...college? HS?).

There will certainly be different schools of thought on who we should take but based on everything that I've read online and heard, it seems that its boiling down to: Klay Thompson vs. Biyombo. Guys like Morris and Singleton were either projected much earlier on or are what this board and fan base seem to want. However, I just dont hear their names too much in the same sentence with the Warriors.

So who do we think is a better prospect and fit for the dubs...Biyombo or Klay? I wouldnt mind Klay but I'm grabbing Biyombo if he's there.

Singleton

Left*My*Heart · Post #110 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:04 pm

Mylie10 wrote:I really want Kawhi......I hope that somehow he lands with us.

I'll be ok with whoever we take though, because they really seem to be doing their work, and there are multiple voices in the room.

The only thing that bugs me is this....Travis Shlenk early on in the process stated that the Warriors will add a defender or big man if possible......Now we here how giddy they are about the offensive only Klay Thompson....That ess bugs me......Also bugs when I hear Riley say crap like the draft is weak..blah blah blah....I hope they're smokescreening and have a real plan for a player.

Klay Thompson (smokescreen) might be gifted offensively, but he's also a streaky player, and doesn't play any D. This team needs a defender in the worst way, and it'd be nice to find a more well rounded player to bring in here. That speaks to need I know, but damn can we get it right please?

What concerns me is West being quoted as staying that Klay is his guy... from a few weeks back. I thought surely he wouldn't tip our hand and I also thought Klay was a real reach at 11; now he has moved up and there are teams even ahead of us who want Klay. Was this a ploy by West to get our guy to slip to us?

Mylie10 · Post #111 » by **Mylie10** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:12 pm

Left*My*Heart wrote:
Mylie10 wrote:I really want Kawhi......I hope that somehow he lands with us.

I'll be ok with whoever we take though, because they really seem to be doing their work, and there are multiple voices in the room.

The only thing that bugs me is this....Travis Shlenk early on in the process stated that the Warriors will add a defender or big man if possible......Now we here how giddy they are about the offensive only Klay Thompson....That ess bugs me......Also bugs when I hear Riley say crap like the draft is weak..blah blah blah....I hope they're smokescreening and have a real plan for a player.

Klay Thompson (smokescreen) might be gifted offensively, but he's also a streaky player, and doesn't play any D. This team needs a defender in the worst way, and it'd be nice to find a more well rounded player to bring in here. That speaks to need I know, but damn can we get it right please?

What concerns me is West being quoted as staying that Klay is his guy... from a few weeks back. I thought surely he wouldn't tip our hand and I also thought Klay was a real reach at 11; now he has moved up and there are teams even ahead of us who want Klay. Was this a ploy by West to get our guy to slip to us?

I really hope so, because his voice has power. Team around the league who weren't paying much attention, certainly might want to look harder at him. Also doesn't hurt a smokescreen to let the world know that our whole staff was out to watch his workout.

Mark Jackson played with Reggie Miller, so he'd know if this kid is more Reggie, or Chase Buddinger.

EvanZ · Post #112 » by **EvanZ** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:19 pm

At this point, I don't think we can trust anything anyone says in the FO or from NBA "insiders". There's just too much smoke a few days out from the draft.

Left*My*Heart · Post #113 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:23 pm

This draft is crap-shoot

Left*My*Heart · Post #114 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:31 pm

This might already be posted, but supposedly shows our interest in Klay...

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... pers061911

Left*My*Heart · Post #115 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:32 pm

If Jonas is available at 11, do you pick him?

old rem · Post #116 » by **old rem** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:34 pm

Most NBA ready...can mean most skilled,can mean fast learner...note how Hibbert>>>>>>>>>Thabeet,yet the "experts" much preferred Thabeet. Chris Wahburn had the physical tools of Dwight Howard but his "intangibles' were "off the charts"..............in the worst possible ways.

CJ Watson had more success with GSW than POB,because CJW was ready and played. POB was seen as a project, put on a shelf in the garage and let go to rust. His game declined from the day he was drafted. Of players who might happen at 11....probably the best thing would be Fredette. He's more Steve Nash, really,than Curry is. The Coach was a top PG. Obviously....long term GSW does not keep both Curry and Fredette,but value can be a key to getting what you really do need. Curry now is probably GSW's #1 trade chip. Were Biyombo 6-11.....he'd be so "upside" he'd go #1. Even so....he's as raw as sushi. He does have the motor and ambition Thabeet is missing...big plus.

With some guys, Thompson, Moore, Singleton...you wonder if what you get is the W Ellington/B Rush type who is fairly good but never more than a borderline starter. Being GOOD at at least one thing can get a guy on the floor so he improves. The "jack of all trades" wings are plentiful and many get lost in the crowd.

Post #117 » by **gswhoops** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:36 pm

Left*My*Heart wrote:If Jonas is available at 11, do you pick him?

Hell yes.

That being said, I don't see any scenario really where he falls out of the top 5. Either Cleveland grabs him at #4 or Toronto picks him at #5.

old rem · Post #118 » by **old rem** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:40 pm

Left*My*Heart wrote:If Jonas is available at 11, do you pick him?

At 11? Probably. I think the guy is overrated but 11 is pretty safe.

I'm very interested in a few bigs expected to go 20-40, Keith Benson, Farieed,JaJuan Johnson, Jordan Williams,Vujacic. I think they stack up very well vs the tall Euros projected as lotto.

Good year for PG. Nolan Smith....not Irving...was Duke's ace PG. McCartney is solid. Norris Cole is a sleeper.

Left*My*Heart · Post #119 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:41 pm

Are we trading out?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?nam ... %3d6680436

Left*My*Heart · Post #120 » by **Left*My*Heart** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:42 pm

gswhoops wrote:
Left*My*Heart wrote:If Jonas is available at 11, do you pick him?

Hell yes.

That being said, I don't see any scenario really where he falls out of the top 5. Either Cleveland grabs him at #4 or Toronto picks him at #5.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?nam ... %3d6680436