WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1

[510TWSS]

Why is wiseman talking to Durant and kyrie?

outside of Kyrie for spiritual advice - I got nothing for you

[Crazy-Canuck]

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Not looking good for wiseman.

[EvanZ]

On the topic of Wiseman's trade value it is **** right now.

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[East Bay Sports]

On the topic of Wiseman's trade value it is **** right now.

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Oh no ESPN analysts are bad at their job!!!

Wiseman undoubtedly will be on this list at some point, who gives a ****

[EvanZ]

Everyone gives a ****. That's a measure of his trade value. The fact that Wiseman did not appear on any of the 3 individual lists, including Schmitz (who seemed to like JW beofre the draft) is a complete indictment of his failure so far. Wiseman might turn it around but as of today his trade value is probably utter shite.

This will have real consequences going forward.

[sonnyhill]

Do the Warriors have the patience to work with Wiseman on his development (it will not be a one-season turn-around)? Take a look at Jermaine O'Neal (a pretty good comparison)'s statistics for his first 12 years in the league:

Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
1996–97 Portland 45 0 10.2 .451 .000 .603 2.8 .2 .0 .6 4.1
1997–98 Portland 60 9 13.5 .485 .000 .506 3.4 .3 .3 1.0 4.5
1998–99 Portland 36 1 8.6 .434 .000 .514 2.7 .4 .1 .4 2.5
1999–00 Portland 70 8 12.3 .486 .000 .582 3.3 .3 .2 .8 3.9
2000–01 Indiana 81 80 32.6 .465 .000 .601 9.8 1.2 .6 2.8 12.9
2001–02 Indiana 72 72 37.6 .479 .071 .688 10.5 1.6 .6 2.3 19.0
2002–03 Indiana 77 76 37.2 .484 .333 .731 10.3 2.0 .9 2.3 20.8
2003–04 Indiana 78 78 35.7 .434 .111 .757 10.0 2.1 .8 2.6 20.1
2004–05 Indiana 44 41 34.8 .452 .167 .754 8.8 1.9 .6 2.0 24.3
2005–06 Indiana 51 47 35.3 .472 .300 .709 9.3 2.6 .5 2.3 20.1
2006–07 Indiana 69 69 35.6 .436 .000 .767 9.6 2.4 .7 2.6 19.4
2007–08 Indiana 42 34 28.7 .439 .000 .742 6.7 2.2 .5 2.1 13.6

[Old_Blue]

Why is wiseman talking to Durant and kyrie?

Because he is free to talk to whomever he wants to learn lessons from on how to be a man?

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[EvanZ]

Do the Warriors have the patience to work with Wiseman on his development (it will not be a one-season turn-around)? Take a look at Jermaine O'Neal (a pretty good comparison)'s statistics for his first 12 years in the league:

Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
1996–97 Portland 45 0 10.2 .451 .000 .603 2.8 .2 .0 .6 4.1
1997–98 Portland 60 9 13.5 .485 .000 .506 3.4 .3 .3 1.0 4.5
1998–99 Portland 36 1 8.6 .434 .000 .514 2.7 .4 .1 .4 2.5
1999–00 Portland 70 8 12.3 .486 .000 .582 3.3 .3 .2 .8 3.9
2000–01 Indiana 81 80 32.6 .465 .000 .601 9.8 1.2 .6 2.8 12.9
2001–02 Indiana 72 72 37.6 .479 .071 .688 10.5 1.6 .6 2.3 19.0
2002–03 Indiana 77 76 37.2 .484 .333 .731 10.3 2.0 .9 2.3 20.8
2003–04 Indiana 78 78 35.7 .434 .111 .757 10.0 2.1 .8 2.6 20.1
2004–05 Indiana 44 41 34.8 .452 .167 .754 8.8 1.9 .6 2.0 24.3
2005–06 Indiana 51 47 35.3 .472 .300 .709 9.3 2.6 .5 2.3 20.1
2006–07 Indiana 69 69 35.6 .436 .000 .767 9.6 2.4 .7 2.6 19.4
2007–08 Indiana 42 34 28.7 .439 .000 .742 6.7 2.2 .5 2.1 13.6

Is it about patience or deciding we want to win with our 3 HOF players while they are still breathing?

[Onus]

Why is wiseman talking to Durant and kyrie?

Because he is free to talk to whomever he wants to learn lessons from on how to be a man?

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Getting advice from kd about how to fit into the system? Kd didn’t fit into the system he just isolated. He also hated the system which is part of the reason he left. Yea our young impressionable rookie should be talking to him

[sonnyhill]

Do the Warriors have the patience to work with Wiseman on his development (it will not be a one-season turn-around)? Take a look at Jermaine O'Neal (a pretty good comparison)'s statistics for his first 12 years in the league:

Year Team GP GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG
1996–97 Portland 45 0 10.2 .451 .000 .603 2.8 .2 .0 .6 4.1
1997–98 Portland 60 9 13.5 .485 .000 .506 3.4 .3 .3 1.0 4.5
1998–99 Portland 36 1 8.6 .434 .000 .514 2.7 .4 .1 .4 2.5
1999–00 Portland 70 8 12.3 .486 .000 .582 3.3 .3 .2 .8 3.9
2000–01 Indiana 81 80 32.6 .465 .000 .601 9.8 1.2 .6 2.8 12.9
2001–02 Indiana 72 72 37.6 .479 .071 .688 10.5 1.6 .6 2.3 19.0
2002–03 Indiana 77 76 37.2 .484 .333 .731 10.3 2.0 .9 2.3 20.8
2003–04 Indiana 78 78 35.7 .434 .111 .757 10.0 2.1 .8 2.6 20.1
2004–05 Indiana 44 41 34.8 .452 .167 .754 8.8 1.9 .6 2.0 24.3
2005–06 Indiana 51 47 35.3 .472 .300 .709 9.3 2.6 .5 2.3 20.1
2006–07 Indiana 69 69 35.6 .436 .000 .767 9.6 2.4 .7 2.6 19.4
2007–08 Indiana 42 34 28.7 .439 .000 .742 6.7 2.2 .5 2.1 13.6

Is it about patience or deciding we want to win with our 3 HOF players while they are still breathing?

Your question is spot-on. Ownership-front office-coaching staff has to decide on one or the other and then execute on implementation. Straddling both appears doomed for mediocrity. Neither are guaranteed to produce a champion; however, a strategic direction needs to be chosen.

When Boston's Big 3 got older, Danny Ainge decided to go for a rebuild and their franchise chose a direction which brought in young talent, a coach who can develop talent, and they became competitive and relevant (no championship).

Kupchak chose to extend Kobe's time in LA and the Lakers were stuck in mediocrity, but kept their box office star.

I have no idea what direction the Warriors will decide to go. Joe Lacob cannot be happy with having the highest payroll in the league and a team barely able to make the play-in game. Also, the players may be tuning out Kerr, as evidenced by its inability to play both on-the-ball and help-team defense. This off season may also be a time for the organization to examine bringing in a coach like a Mark Few or even a John Calipari and either moving Kerr upstairs (to replace Myers) or giving him a gold watch and send him on his way.

Whatever route the franchise decides to go, including jettisoning Curry for a haul of future draft picks, I am thankful and appreciative of how the team went for it with its recent run of championships.

[sonnyhill]

Why is wiseman talking to Durant and kyrie?

Because he is free to talk to whomever he wants to learn lessons from on how to be a man?

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Getting advice from kd about how to fit into the system? Kd didn’t fit into the system he just isolated. He also hated the system which is part of the reason he left. Yea our young impressionable rookie should be talking to him

The optics of Wiseman getting advice from KD and Kyrie is about as bad as it can be.

The kid should be reaching out to Bogut, David West, Boogie Cousins (big men); Curry, Thompson, and Green for advice on how to better fit into Kerr's system.

KD left the Warriors because of Kerr and the kid goes to KD for advice? WTF?

[WarriorGM]

Because he is free to talk to whomever he wants to learn lessons from on how to be a man?

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Getting advice from kd about how to fit into the system? Kd didn’t fit into the system he just isolated. He also hated the system which is part of the reason he left. Yea our young impressionable rookie should be talking to him

The optics of Wiseman getting advice from KD and Kyrie is about as bad as it can be.

The kid should be reaching out to Bogut, David West, Boogie Cousins (big men); Curry, Thompson, and Green for advice on how to better fit into Kerr's system.

KD left the Warriors because of Kerr and the kid goes to KD for advice? WTF?

On one level the optics are bad.

But interestingly enough it probably does give significant insight into the relationships of the Warriors players with KD.

I find it hard to believe that these conversations would be happening without Steph, Draymond, and Klay knowing about it and without at least their tacit blessing. It's an indication that the Warriors players and KD remain close behind the scenes. It seems they have maintained a genuine friendship and it is not a case of a mercenary KD just coming in and going which is too easy a way to characterize things for outsiders who wish to fantasize about drama.

[FNQ]

Most NBA players are friends, or friendly, or whatever.. all these grayhairs bitching about how its ruined the game and all. Let's be clear - this is because of technology. In the 80s, or 60s, or whatever era you sitting-in-a-chair-going-up-stairs types hail from, you had one means of communication - a phone - locked to a landline. Communication is much easier, these guys all know each other from HS, traveling teams, showcases, etc.. They all talk.

Ideally would I want JW talking to KD? Probably not if it relates to how to fit in on the team. But if he's asking KD how to fit in with the Warriors brand, feeling like an outsider, etc.. sure, why not? Who would know that scenario better?

The one thing about this forum that drives me up a wall is that there's a huge assumption that the players, coaches, and front office can't wipe their own ass without starting a fire. ****, the kid learned Cantonese which probably puts him at an educational level miles ahead of the average poster (I also understand he can dress himself without assistance so he's also smarter than the average GB poster).. stop assuming the worst about every little scenario.

[and1GS]

Man, now James can't even talk to star level players? What do y'all want from the guy

If I was 19 (HE'S 20 STOP SAYING HE'S 19!!!) I'd definitely reach out to Kevin Durant for advice if someone introduced me.

[sonnyhill]

Most NBA players are friends, or friendly, or whatever.. all these grayhairs bitching about how its ruined the game and all. Let's be clear - this is because of technology. In the 80s, or 60s, or whatever era you sitting-in-a-chair-going-up-stairs types hail from, you had one means of communication - a phone - locked to a landline. Communication is much easier, these guys all know each other from HS, traveling teams, showcases, etc.. They all talk.

Ideally would I want JW talking to KD? Probably not if it relates to how to fit in on the team. But if he's asking KD how to fit in with the Warriors brand, feeling like an outsider, etc.. sure, why not? Who would know that scenario better?

The one thing about this forum that drives me up a wall is that there's a huge assumption that the players, coaches, and front office can't wipe their own ass without starting a fire. ****, the kid learned Cantonese which probably puts him at an educational level miles ahead of the average poster (I also understand he can dress himself without assistance so he's also smarter than the average GB poster).. stop assuming the worst about every little scenario.

Great post.

Perhaps many of us (myself included) are over-reacting to every little tidbit of information about Wiseman in a very disappointing Warrior season.

BTW, Wiseman studied Mandarin. However, if he can speak Cantonese, too, he would be able to communicate with a large segment of the SF Bay Area Chinese population (very cool).

[Old_Blue]

How long before Wiseman decides he'd be better off with the Nets?

[SAKURABA216]

KD has been giving Wiseman advice for at least the past 2 years:

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If you listen to what he says to him, KD actually sounds like a good dude and is like an older brother. Draymond on the other hand is like a teacher/uncle where the power distance between Dray and Wiseman seems a little wider, which actually makes it harder to communicate. While KD's advice might not be as technical as Dray's, sometimes you need to talk to someone that will be a bit more encouraging especially when you are being hard on yourself. I think its a good thing that he talks to KD. Sure Bogut might be better, but KD was also a highly touted #2 pick that played under a ton of scrutiny during his first year.

[Old_Blue]

KD has been giving Wiseman advice for at least the past 2 years:

If you listen to what he says to him, KD actually sounds like a good dude and is like an older brother. Draymond on the other hand is like a teacher/uncle where the power distance between Dray and Wiseman seems a little wider, which actually makes it harder to communicate. While KD's advice might not be as technical as Dray's, sometimes you need to talk to someone that will be a bit more encouraging especially when you are being hard on yourself. I think its a good thing that he talks to KD. Sure Bogut might be better, but KD was also a highly touted #2 pick that played under a ton of scrutiny during his first year.

I don't know. Somehow it just feels wrong. It feels like Wiseman is cheating on Steph and Klay and that he's doing it with KD and Kyrie.

[Sleepy51]

KD has been giving Wiseman advice for at least the past 2 years:

If you listen to what he says to him, KD actually sounds like a good dude and is like an older brother. Draymond on the other hand is like a teacher/uncle where the power distance between Dray and Wiseman seems a little wider, which actually makes it harder to communicate. While KD's advice might not be as technical as Dray's, sometimes you need to talk to someone that will be a bit more encouraging especially when you are being hard on yourself. I think its a good thing that he talks to KD. Sure Bogut might be better, but KD was also a highly touted #2 pick that played under a ton of scrutiny during his first year.

I don't know. Somehow it just feels wrong. It feels like Wiseman is cheating on Steph and Klay and that he's doing it with KD and Kyrie.

These guys are not actually enemies because of the employer that holds their contract rights. The league is a fraternity first and foremost. All of the players are pulling for one another's success and the great players do want to see other guys with the potential achieve greatness (just not at their expense.)

I think Durant is safe from Wiseman replacing his statue in front of the Chase center lol

[SAKURABA216]

KD has been giving Wiseman advice for at least the past 2 years:

If you listen to what he says to him, KD actually sounds like a good dude and is like an older brother. Draymond on the other hand is like a teacher/uncle where the power distance between Dray and Wiseman seems a little wider, which actually makes it harder to communicate. While KD's advice might not be as technical as Dray's, sometimes you need to talk to someone that will be a bit more encouraging especially when you are being hard on yourself. I think its a good thing that he talks to KD. Sure Bogut might be better, but KD was also a highly touted #2 pick that played under a ton of scrutiny during his first year.

I don't know. Somehow it just feels wrong. It feels like Wiseman is cheating on Steph and Klay and that he's doing it with KD and Kyrie.

Lol, there was a commercial for a drug addiction place back in the '90s that said "If you don't get help from Charter, please get help somewhere." If you think about it, KD has been giving Wiseman advice from when he was a senior in HS, this was before the Memphis controversy and before he was drafted to the Warriors. On the other hand, his relationship with Steph, Klay, and Draymond seemingly only started after the draft and they all either want him to: 1) help them win games or 2) get traded for someone else. In this situation, KD offers him a perspective that isn't conditioned on those 2 things.