Warriors exploring S&T for Kuminga

[vvoland]

Big question is if the statement attributed to Kuminga about preferring to take the QO is a bluff or negotiation tactic is true or not. If he really wants out and wants total freedom from the Warriors (or just wants to be vindictive because of burned bridges) then he might just take the hit. If not then he has to realize an offer in the $20M-$25M range is going to be as good as it gets for him, at least in the short term. There are not a bunch of teams out there just waiting to unload a lot of cash for him and he and his agent know it by now.

It seems the second year team option is a real sticking point, so call his bluff and either remove the option or make it a player option. If Kuminga isn't fuming sitting on the bench with the QO, it's better for everyone and I think without the current trade restrictions, it won't be that hard to move him later. Personally I'd rather see a deal done immediately so everyone can move on but the trade rules are making it almost impossible for everyone to be happy with a deal.

If the team option is removed it makes it basically impossible to trade him for anything. So that’s a dealbreaker as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

[Onus]

Maybe we should start a JK thread…


Edit: actually, why bother.

Should we put the over/under on the date he signs? I'll bet by 9/1 and it's 2/47 with a partial guarantee in year 2 (something around 10M).

Over and there's going to be no guarantee in year 2. JK has no incentive to sign until he absolutely must. Unless the warriors get fed up and threaten to pull their offer JK is just going to continue to wait. Probably signs closer to 10/1 but he will sign a 1+1.

[vvoland]

Maybe we should start a JK thread…


Edit: actually, why bother.

Should we put the over/under on the date he signs? I'll bet by 9/1 and it's 2/47 with a partial guarantee in year 2 (something around 10M).

Over and there's going to be no guarantee in year 2. JK has no incentive to sign until he absolutely must. Unless the warriors get fed up and threaten to pull their offer JK is just going to continue to wait. Probably signs closer to 10/1 but he will sign a 1+1.

I fully expect them to set an internal deadline of much earlier than 10/1 before they pull the 1+1. In the end, it just makes too much sense to partially guarantee year 2 (if that removes the NTC) and costs them very little. A full guarantee is (probably) still fine considering he had multiple teams claiming they'd pay him something in that ballpark for 3+ years. I doubt their first offer is the last offer and they'll up it just enough to get him to sign. It's been the MO of the front office since Lacob took over.

Edit: did you hear one of the lacobs left the org? Now there's 2 in the FO, not 3. I feel good about that, personally.

[Onus]

Should we put the over/under on the date he signs? I'll bet by 9/1 and it's 2/47 with a partial guarantee in year 2 (something around 10M).

Over and there's going to be no guarantee in year 2. JK has no incentive to sign until he absolutely must. Unless the warriors get fed up and threaten to pull their offer JK is just going to continue to wait. Probably signs closer to 10/1 but he will sign a 1+1.

I fully expect them to set an internal deadline of much earlier than 10/1 before they pull the 1+1. In the end, it just makes too much sense to partially guarantee year 2 (if that removes the NTC) and costs them very little. A full guarantee is (probably) still fine considering he had multiple teams claiming they'd pay him something in that ballpark for 3+ years. I doubt their first offer is the last offer and they'll up it just enough to get him to sign. It's been the MO of the front office since Lacob took over.

Edit: did you hear one of the lacobs left the org? Now there's 2 in the FO, not 3. I feel good about that, personally.

They should have an earlier deadline than 10/1 but I doubt it's 9/1.

The cost of partially guaranteeing year 2 is that it's no longer an expiring contract lowering the contract value. Those teams offering that weren't willing to give up anything of value for 3+ years of jk. Suns were unwilling to include Ryan Dunn. The Kings unwilling to include Keon Ellis. Literally we were only offered 2 2nds for JK on a long term contract.

That was Bob's MO. Bob always caved to the player. We'll see what MDJ does.

Yes good for Kent. I'm curious as to why he stepped down other than the I want to make my own way response that was given.

[vvoland]

Over and there's going to be no guarantee in year 2. JK has no incentive to sign until he absolutely must. Unless the warriors get fed up and threaten to pull their offer JK is just going to continue to wait. Probably signs closer to 10/1 but he will sign a 1+1.

I fully expect them to set an internal deadline of much earlier than 10/1 before they pull the 1+1. In the end, it just makes too much sense to partially guarantee year 2 (if that removes the NTC) and costs them very little. A full guarantee is (probably) still fine considering he had multiple teams claiming they'd pay him something in that ballpark for 3+ years. I doubt their first offer is the last offer and they'll up it just enough to get him to sign. It's been the MO of the front office since Lacob took over.

Edit: did you hear one of the lacobs left the org? Now there's 2 in the FO, not 3. I feel good about that, personally.

They should have an earlier deadline than 10/1 but I doubt it's 9/1.

The cost of partially guaranteeing year 2 is that it's no longer an expiring contract lowering the contract value. Those teams offering that weren't willing to give up anything of value for 3+ years of jk. Suns were unwilling to include Ryan Dunn. The Kings unwilling to include Keon Ellis. Literally we were only offered 2 2nds for JK on a long term contract.

That was Bob's MO. Bob always caved to the player. We'll see what MDJ does.

Yes good for Kent. I'm curious as to why he stepped down other than the I want to make my own way response that was given.

Didn't MDJ give Dray and Jimmy their extensions? Didn't the FO try to match the contract Klay got and he's the one that didn't want it? Negotiating up from your 1st offer isn't caving to the player, btw. Making dray get an offer from the grizz and then not quite matching it isn't exactly caving, either.

[EvanZ]

Big question is if the statement attributed to Kuminga about preferring to take the QO is a bluff or negotiation tactic is true or not. If he really wants out and wants total freedom from the Warriors (or just wants to be vindictive because of burned bridges) then he might just take the hit. If not then he has to realize an offer in the $20M-$25M range is going to be as good as it gets for him, at least in the short term. There are not a bunch of teams out there just waiting to unload a lot of cash for him and he and his agent know it by now.

It seems the second year team option is a real sticking point, so call his bluff and either remove the option or make it a player option. If Kuminga isn't fuming sitting on the bench with the QO, it's better for everyone and I think without the current trade restrictions, it won't be that hard to move him later. Personally I'd rather see a deal done immediately so everyone can move on but the trade rules are making it almost impossible for everyone to be happy with a deal.

If the team option is removed it makes it basically impossible to trade him for anything. So that’s a dealbreaker as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

Two offers they didn't want that will get even worse. No thanks.

[vvoland]

If the team option is removed it makes it basically impossible to trade him for anything. So that’s a dealbreaker as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

Two offers they didn't want that will get even worse. No thanks.

True IF JK continues to play like he did to end the regular season.

OR, he might play well in the first 50 games and actually improve his stock. Crazier things have happened.

[Onus]

I fully expect them to set an internal deadline of much earlier than 10/1 before they pull the 1+1. In the end, it just makes too much sense to partially guarantee year 2 (if that removes the NTC) and costs them very little. A full guarantee is (probably) still fine considering he had multiple teams claiming they'd pay him something in that ballpark for 3+ years. I doubt their first offer is the last offer and they'll up it just enough to get him to sign. It's been the MO of the front office since Lacob took over.

Edit: did you hear one of the lacobs left the org? Now there's 2 in the FO, not 3. I feel good about that, personally.

They should have an earlier deadline than 10/1 but I doubt it's 9/1.

The cost of partially guaranteeing year 2 is that it's no longer an expiring contract lowering the contract value. Those teams offering that weren't willing to give up anything of value for 3+ years of jk. Suns were unwilling to include Ryan Dunn. The Kings unwilling to include Keon Ellis. Literally we were only offered 2 2nds for JK on a long term contract.

That was Bob's MO. Bob always caved to the player. We'll see what MDJ does.

Yes good for Kent. I'm curious as to why he stepped down other than the I want to make my own way response that was given.

Didn't MDJ give Dray and Jimmy their extensions? Didn't the FO try to match the contract Klay got and he's the one that didn't want it? Negotiating up from your 1st offer isn't caving to the player, btw. Making dray get an offer from the grizz and then not quite matching it isn't exactly caving, either.

Dray took less money to stay on the warriors and is on a good contract. A DPOY candidate for 25M/year is a good contract. Jimmy's extension was because we traded nothing for him. Jimmy's extension is probably the worst extension but other than that MDJ has been pretty good.

[vvoland]

They should have an earlier deadline than 10/1 but I doubt it's 9/1.

The cost of partially guaranteeing year 2 is that it's no longer an expiring contract lowering the contract value. Those teams offering that weren't willing to give up anything of value for 3+ years of jk. Suns were unwilling to include Ryan Dunn. The Kings unwilling to include Keon Ellis. Literally we were only offered 2 2nds for JK on a long term contract.

That was Bob's MO. Bob always caved to the player. We'll see what MDJ does.

Yes good for Kent. I'm curious as to why he stepped down other than the I want to make my own way response that was given.

Didn't MDJ give Dray and Jimmy their extensions? Didn't the FO try to match the contract Klay got and he's the one that didn't want it? Negotiating up from your 1st offer isn't caving to the player, btw. Making dray get an offer from the grizz and then not quite matching it isn't exactly caving, either.

Dray took less money to stay on the warriors and is on a good contract. A DPOY candidate for 25M/year is a good contract. Jimmy's extension was because we traded nothing for him. Jimmy's extension is probably the worst extension but other than that MDJ has been pretty good.

Agreed on both. I'm just saying we made Dray jump through hoops to get his money (and still didn't quite match). Gave JB the bag when, in theory, we could have played hardball. I'm happy we got both contracts done as I could care less about Lacob's money and I don't think we could have spent it better. I feel similarly about JK. 22M is a bargain contract, in my view, and had this been signed in July 1st (only 6 weeks ago, TK said something like "it's been 4 months of this sh!#"), we would all be thrilled.

[Twinkie defense]

Sending out Podz keeps US under the 1st apron? Really?

Huh?

JK may be a flawed defender but compared to Giddey, he's Kawhi MFing Leonard.

Kuminga was a good point of attack defender his rookie season but IDK what's happened to him since. He has a career 113.2 defensive rating while Giddey has a career 112.8 defensive rating. In comparison, GPII has a career defensive rating of 108.5. And Draymond has a career defensive rating of 104.0.

I would say Kuminga and Giddey are both average defenders. I don't think you want either of these guys for strictly defensive reasons, so the question is, what else do they give you that can help you win games?

[Twinkie defense]

We need at least 1, ideally 2 more guys who can score and shoot with steph, jimmy, and dray.

Horford and Melton, done...

[Twinkie defense]

It seems the second year team option is a real sticking point, so call his bluff and either remove the option or make it a player option.

In the first and second apron cap era, you can really kill your ability to build a team if you have bad contracts. What if Kuminga isn't worth $24 mil next season? Warriors are stuck with him? They have to attach assets to move his contract? If you're MDJ is that how you're gonna let Stephen Curry's last season under contract and with the Championship window closing play out?

[Twinkie defense]

If the team option is removed it makes it basically impossible to trade him for anything. So that’s a dealbreaker as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

But they were just offering garbage. And there are teams who would prefer to make $24 mil come off their roster than have Kuminga on their roster.

[vvoland]

If the team option is removed it makes it basically impossible to trade him for anything. So that’s a dealbreaker as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

But they were just offering garbage. And there are teams who would prefer to make $24 mil come off their roster than have Kuminga on their roster.

I meant the contract offers from those teams to JK. Both offered similar money at more years (3/63 or 4/90). I don't think either would balk at taking 2/45 back, midway through next season, unless JK completely craps the bed and is out of the rotation.

In your earlier post about trading JK for JG, you shipped out Podz to entice the bulls (or make the money work, I don't recall). Since we're taking a S&T player, we'd be hard capped at the 1st apron and I was surprised trading Podz' small salary was enough to do so.

[Senchu]

JK posted another IG post of his summer workouts.
No shooting insight

[EvanZ]

Unless you believe the offers from Sac or Phx

Two offers they didn't want that will get even worse. No thanks.

True IF JK continues to play like he did to end the regular season.

OR, he might play well in the first 50 games and actually improve his stock. Crazier things have happened.

To play well he has to completely change his game. That seems to be the entire crux of the problem imo.

[vvoland]

Two offers they didn't want that will get even worse. No thanks.

True IF JK continues to play like he did to end the regular season.

OR, he might play well in the first 50 games and actually improve his stock. Crazier things have happened.

To play well he has to completely change his game. That seems to be the entire crux of the problem imo.

Im not so sure. He needs better shot selection, an improved 3pt shot, and more faith from his coaching staff to play through mistakes. All three things can happen right around year 4/5. Not saying it will BUT we've seen JK excel in one specific role for long stretches (bench scorer getting 25+ mins) and the ideal role for like 5 games before his first serious injury (off-ball scorer, more Marion than tmac)

[cpower]

cant wait to see this guy getting benched and be out of the league in 2 years

[EvanZ]

cant wait to see this guy getting benched and be out of the league in 2 years

Imagine if this comes to pass how much time was wasted talking about this dude over the past few years.

[EvanZ]

True IF JK continues to play like he did to end the regular season.

OR, he might play well in the first 50 games and actually improve his stock. Crazier things have happened.

To play well he has to completely change his game. That seems to be the entire crux of the problem imo.

Im not so sure. He needs better shot selection, an improved 3pt shot, and more faith from his coaching staff to play through mistakes. All three things can happen right around year 4/5. Not saying it will BUT we've seen JK excel in one specific role for long stretches (bench scorer getting 25+ mins) and the ideal role for like 5 games before his first serious injury (off-ball scorer, more Marion than tmac)

You literally just described how he would have to completely change his game.