JK: Who's Fault Is it?

[AirP.]

Do any of you really think Kerr hasn't told Kuminga what he needs to do to get on the court? I have to think Kuminga didn't want to change his way of playing, there are a lot of high picks that refuse to change because they want to play a certain way in their career because it could affect their money. You have Curry, the offense needs to be about this generational scorer yet when Kuminga's on the court he's more about himself than this generational scorer.

It can be that Kuminga is talented but he needs to play a certain way and if this is true it's on the FO not to know this or not to move him for the right type of player, then again there's the option of saying screw it and force the coach to say screw winning, develop this player but personally, I don't see enough talent to do that in Kuminga. He can be a scorer but it's probably not a guy you can have as a top 3 salary on your roster and compete for a championship.

Basically, it's partially on Kuminga for not conforming and also on the FO not to recognize this and get the most out of that asset by trading him. Now if they decided to trade him in the last year, you're probably getting more for him if you S&T him vs trading him at his low rookie salary (outside of getting a draft asset or 2 back for him). I do know Miami didn't want him in the Butler trade because they're trying to clear the books for 2026, not add to them.

I don't think it's JK refusing to change how he plays, rather he just doesn't process things as fast as he needs to in order to really succeed in the motion offense. He can try all he wants, but it's more about BBIQ than effort. Though the defense and rebounding part is effort, which he seems to be getting better at.

Nah, I've seen him get the ball 5 feet beyond the arc and just decides to call his number and 6-7 seconds later he's finally getting a shot off. I'm not saying he's not a slow processor, I'm saying sometimes he just decides not to process anything because it's Kuminga time.

[AirP.]

It is pretty nuts but take a look at our offense before jimmy got here and you'll find your answer. KD has book and beal to take shots and that's before you get to his supporting players. Prior to Jimmy, Hield was barely playable and went through long stretches of terrible shooting. Podz started off this year worse than he's playing now, if you can believe it. This team had no offensive options without steph on the floor and often struggled, especially late in games, even with Steph. It sounds insane but the Melton injury early in the season killed this pre-jimmy version.

JK's only real role this season, when he played, was as the secondary scoring option and primary when Steph was out. I get it, trust me, i do. 18 FGA/36 is a ton. It really is. I think his number should be closer to 15 (where he was last year w/ an eFG of 58%). It's been a struggle for him to play with Steph and find that balance; a struggle many players experience when coming here. I'm just saying there's a better balance than the one Kerr has struck.

I'm not sure the distinction between JK taking an ill-advised mid range or forcing stuff inside versus Podz or Buddy taking long 3s early in the clock. In fact, the latter often lead to long rebounds and dunks on the other end. You're saying one is 'breaking the offense' and the others "don't lock in on trying to score."

You shoot open 3s not just to try to make them, but make the defense have to worry about it so they can't cheat onto other players. It's called spacing.

I disagree on that. Podz and Buddy often make mistakes precisely when they "lock in on trying to score" as opposed to take what the offense is giving. Podz also has the problem of not taking what the offense is giving if what they're giving are floaters and contested layups. Buddy has no such issues. GP2, Dray, etc all have serious flaws and that's the major point. JK's flaws stand out to Kerr (and you) as fatal ones. I disagree and think it's on the coaching to help minimize those flaws while maximizing the talents.

Nearly the whole roster is flawed but Kuminga (unlike the other players) is wanting to be paid like a star without being anywhere near a good enough player to be paid that way, hell, he isn't even a regular starter. Demanding that much money without doing nearly anything in the NBA lets me know where his ego is and if he does get paid, he absolutely will play how he wants to play because it's gotten him paid. There will be no incentive for him to play any other way.

[KevinMcreynolds]

He has no feel for the game, it’s as simple as that.

[cpower]

He is bad.. even in these playoffs he is team low -11.6 Net Rating.

Its good that we boosted his value a little bit so that we can trade him for more.

[SpreeS]

He is bad.. even in these playoffs he is team low -11.6 Net Rating.

Its good that we boosted his value a little bit so that we can trade him for more.

lets look at our leaders nrtg w/o Curry in these PO

Green -13.57nrtg
Butler -13.79nrtg
Podz -9.17nrtg
Hield -12.36nrtg

I know what you will say so I give next numbers w/o Curry and Kuminga

Green -18.47nrtg
Butler -12.11nrtg
Podz -14.69nrtg
Hield -15.66nrtg
Green/Butler -15.68nrtg
Green/Butler/Podz -13.41nrtg

So where are all these players w/o Curry?

[cpower]

He is bad.. even in these playoffs he is team low -11.6 Net Rating.

Its good that we boosted his value a little bit so that we can trade him for more.

lets look at our leaders nrtg w/o Curry in these PO

Green -13.57nrtg
Butler -13.79nrtg
Podz -9.17nrtg
Hield -12.36nrtg

I know what you will say so I give next numbers w/o Curry and Kuminga

Green -18.47nrtg
Butler -12.11nrtg
Podz -14.69nrtg
Hield -15.66nrtg
Green/Butler -15.68nrtg
Green/Butler/Podz -13.41nrtg

So where are all these players w/o Curry?

after last game:
Green +2.2
Butler -13
Podz +6.3
Hield +3.2
JK -13.8

Butler is playing on a bad hip and was sick. JK still the worst among all. as crazy as it may sound, we have a better chance winning 1 of the 4 games if JK not playing at all.

[SpreeS]

He is bad.. even in these playoffs he is team low -11.6 Net Rating.

Its good that we boosted his value a little bit so that we can trade him for more.

lets look at our leaders nrtg w/o Curry in these PO

Green -13.57nrtg
Butler -13.79nrtg
Podz -9.17nrtg
Hield -12.36nrtg

I know what you will say so I give next numbers w/o Curry and Kuminga

Green -18.47nrtg
Butler -12.11nrtg
Podz -14.69nrtg
Hield -15.66nrtg
Green/Butler -15.68nrtg
Green/Butler/Podz -13.41nrtg

So where are all these players w/o Curry?

after last game:
Green +2.2
Butler -13
Podz +6.3
Hield +3.2
JK -13.8

Butler is playing on a bad hip and was sick. JK still the worst among all

What are you show me? This is simple numbers w/o context. O/c these numbers will be better with Curry on the floor (Kuminga didnt play much with him). Lets look to these nrtg from last 4 games, where no one played with Curry and everybody were in equal conditions.

Podz -4.2nrtg
Kuminga -10.8nrtg
Payton -12.8nrtg
Green -13.6nrtg
Hield -15.0nrtg
Butler -16.9nrtg
Looney -24.4nrtg
Davis -35.1nrtg

[cpower]

lets look at our leaders nrtg w/o Curry in these PO

Green -13.57nrtg
Butler -13.79nrtg
Podz -9.17nrtg
Hield -12.36nrtg

I know what you will say so I give next numbers w/o Curry and Kuminga

Green -18.47nrtg
Butler -12.11nrtg
Podz -14.69nrtg
Hield -15.66nrtg
Green/Butler -15.68nrtg
Green/Butler/Podz -13.41nrtg

So where are all these players w/o Curry?

after last game:
Green +2.2
Butler -13
Podz +6.3
Hield +3.2
JK -13.8

Butler is playing on a bad hip and was sick. JK still the worst among all

What are you show me? This is simple numbers w/o context. O/c these numbers will be better with Curry on the floor (Kuminga didnt play much with him). Lets look to these nrtg from last 4 games, where no one played with Curry and everybody were in equal conditions.

Podz -4.2nrtg
Kuminga -10.8nrtg
Payton -12.8nrtg
Green -13.6nrtg
Hield -15.0nrtg
Butler -16.9nrtg
Looney -24.4nrtg
Davis -35.1nrtg

playoff on/off with 2 series. JK was not playing in the first so his number probably looks worse than it looks as i cant find single series data
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/GSW/2025/on-off/

[SpreeS]

after last game:
Green +2.2
Butler -13
Podz +6.3
Hield +3.2
JK -13.8

Butler is playing on a bad hip and was sick. JK still the worst among all

What are you show me? This is simple numbers w/o context. O/c these numbers will be better with Curry on the floor (Kuminga didnt play much with him). Lets look to these nrtg from last 4 games, where no one played with Curry and everybody were in equal conditions.

Podz -4.2nrtg
Kuminga -10.8nrtg
Payton -12.8nrtg
Green -13.6nrtg
Hield -15.0nrtg
Butler -16.9nrtg
Looney -24.4nrtg
Davis -35.1nrtg

playoff on/off with 2 series. JK was not playing in the first so his number probably looks worse than it looks as i cant find single series data
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/GSW/2025/on-off/

As I said these numbers w/o context. We lost last 4 games mostly b/c Kerr was headless with Davis

Davis w/o Kuminga 36min (Butler 34min Green/Hield 32min Podz 27min)

83.1ortg
119.7drtg
-36.6nrtg


2nd game

Starters (Post/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 5min -13

3rd game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) + Post eneters Davis first 6min -6
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 4min -1

4th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -2
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -14

5th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3

We have only one positive start (+5) in game 2 in second half where starters were Green/Kuminga/Butler/Podz/Hield.

Also we lost all minutes with centers (dont inculde trash min). Small ball was still positive

75min 108.6ortg 102.6drtg 6.0nrtg

Green 70min
Kuminga 63min
Podz 61min
Butler 60min
Hield 46min
Payton 28min
Moody 17min

Give more time to Moody and Santos over all centers and you could have series...

[cpower]

What are you show me? This is simple numbers w/o context. O/c these numbers will be better with Curry on the floor (Kuminga didnt play much with him). Lets look to these nrtg from last 4 games, where no one played with Curry and everybody were in equal conditions.

Podz -4.2nrtg
Kuminga -10.8nrtg
Payton -12.8nrtg
Green -13.6nrtg
Hield -15.0nrtg
Butler -16.9nrtg
Looney -24.4nrtg
Davis -35.1nrtg

playoff on/off with 2 series. JK was not playing in the first so his number probably looks worse than it looks as i cant find single series data
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/GSW/2025/on-off/

As I said these numbers w/o context. We lost last 4 games mostly b/c Kerr was headless with Davis

Davis w/o Kuminga 36min (Butler 34min Green/Hield 32min Podz 27min)

83.1ortg
119.7drtg
-36.6nrtg


2nd game

Starters (Post/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 5min -13

3rd game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) + Post eneters Davis first 6min -6
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 4min -1

4th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -2
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -14

5th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3

We have only one positive start (+5) in game 2 in second half where starters were Green/Kuminga/Butler/Podz/Hield.

Also we lost all minutes with centers (dont inculde trash min). Small ball was still positive

75min 108.6ortg 102.6drtg 6.0nrtg

Green 70min
Kuminga 63min
Podz 61min
Butler 60min
Hield 46min
Payton 28min
Moody 17min

the data set is too small to mean anything. What we know for sure is when we have Curry, team is better off not playing JK. It's good that he was able to put up some pts so maybe S/T is possible now

[bicycle]

Poll votes are close to the 60/40 split of his own fault vs Kerr **** it up that I was gonna say. Fancy that.

[SpreeS]

playoff on/off with 2 series. JK was not playing in the first so his number probably looks worse than it looks as i cant find single series data
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/GSW/2025/on-off/

As I said these numbers w/o context. We lost last 4 games mostly b/c Kerr was headless with Davis

Davis w/o Kuminga 36min (Butler 34min Green/Hield 32min Podz 27min)

83.1ortg
119.7drtg
-36.6nrtg


2nd game

Starters (Post/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 5min -13

3rd game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) + Post eneters Davis first 6min -6
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 4min -1

4th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -2
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -14

5th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3

We have only one positive start (+5) in game 2 in second half where starters were Green/Kuminga/Butler/Podz/Hield.

Also we lost all minutes with centers (dont inculde trash min). Small ball was still positive

75min 108.6ortg 102.6drtg 6.0nrtg

Green 70min
Kuminga 63min
Podz 61min
Butler 60min
Hield 46min
Payton 28min
Moody 17min

the data set is too small to mean anything. What we know for sure is when we have Curry, team is better off not playing JK. It's good that he was able to put up some pts so maybe S/T is possible now

Again and again… you said that we would win if not Kuminga and now this!!! Everyone knows thats Kuminga doesn’t fit not to Curry, but to Green/Butler. And I show that 4 loses in a row to Minny wasn’t Kuminga fault…

[cpower]

As I said these numbers w/o context. We lost last 4 games mostly b/c Kerr was headless with Davis

Davis w/o Kuminga 36min (Butler 34min Green/Hield 32min Podz 27min)

83.1ortg
119.7drtg
-36.6nrtg


2nd game

Starters (Post/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 5min -13

3rd game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) + Post eneters Davis first 6min -6
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) first 4min -1

4th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -2
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -14

5th game

Starters (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3
2nd half (Davis/Green/Butler/Hield/Podz) -3

We have only one positive start (+5) in game 2 in second half where starters were Green/Kuminga/Butler/Podz/Hield.

Also we lost all minutes with centers (dont inculde trash min). Small ball was still positive

75min 108.6ortg 102.6drtg 6.0nrtg

Green 70min
Kuminga 63min
Podz 61min
Butler 60min
Hield 46min
Payton 28min
Moody 17min

the data set is too small to mean anything. What we know for sure is when we have Curry, team is better off not playing JK. It's good that he was able to put up some pts so maybe S/T is possible now

Again and again… you said that we would win if not Kuminga and now this!!! Everyone knows thats Kuminga doesn’t fit not to Curry, but to Green/Butler. And I show that 4 loses in a row to Minny wasn’t Kuminga fault…

JK does not fit modern basketball.. you cant play 1 on 1...look at AST% and AST/TO ratio he only cares about getting his not anyone else..I literally dont see him being a useful offensive player at all

[vvoland]

the data set is too small to mean anything. What we know for sure is when we have Curry, team is better off not playing JK. It's good that he was able to put up some pts so maybe S/T is possible now

Again and again… you said that we would win if not Kuminga and now this!!! Everyone knows thats Kuminga doesn’t fit not to Curry, but to Green/Butler. And I show that 4 loses in a row to Minny wasn’t Kuminga fault…

JK does not fit modern basketball.. you cant play 1 on 1...look at AST% and AST/TO ratio he only cares about getting his not anyone else..I literally dont see him being a useful offensive player at all

This year, where he clearly struggled to fit what Kerr wanted, when JK played with Steph and Dray, the team was a +9.1 nrtg. This is according the cleaning the glass so no garbage time to skew the data. For reference:

Steph + Dray w/o JK were +7.4. (2300 possessions)

Steph + Dray in all lineups were +7.8. (3000 possessions)
Steph + Dray WITH JK were +9.1 (600 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + JK were +10.9 (250 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + Podz + JK were + 17.9 (16 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Podz + Moody + JK were a +130.6 (8 possessions) YES, that's not at typo, ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY POINT SIX NET RATING. 170 ORTG and 40 DRTG.

What this tells me is despite the struggles buddy, moody, and podz went through before the JK injury the Steph/Dray/JK lineup should have played more, especially with buddy/moody and podz. What most frustrating is the two lineups they used the least, to me, should have been the lineups that played the most and started most of our games.

[vvoland]

Again and again… you said that we would win if not Kuminga and now this!!! Everyone knows thats Kuminga doesn’t fit not to Curry, but to Green/Butler. And I show that 4 loses in a row to Minny wasn’t Kuminga fault…

JK does not fit modern basketball.. you cant play 1 on 1...look at AST% and AST/TO ratio he only cares about getting his not anyone else..I literally dont see him being a useful offensive player at all

This year, where he clearly struggled to fit what Kerr wanted, when JK played with Steph and Dray, the team was a +9.1 nrtg. This is according the cleaning the glass so no garbage time to skew the data. For reference:

Steph + Dray w/o JK were +7.4. (2300 possessions)

Steph + Dray in all lineups were +7.8. (3000 possessions)
Steph + Dray WITH JK were +9.1 (600 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + JK were +10.9 (250 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + Podz + JK were + 17.9 (16 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Podz + Moody + JK were a +130.6 (8 possessions) YES, that's not at typo, ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY POINT SIX NET RATING. 170 ORTG and 40 DRTG.

What this tells me is despite the struggles buddy, moody, and podz went through before the JK injury the Steph/Dray/JK lineup should have played more, especially with buddy/moody and podz. What most frustrating is the two lineups they used the least, to me, should have been the lineups that played the most and started most of our games.

Not to quote my own post but those numbers were so striking and it's been a while since i looked at lineup data on CTG, I went back and isolated the Steph/Dray/JK lineups by excluding non-shooters (for obvious reasons) and Jimmy (post injury malaise). Here's some more data that JK should have played A LOT with Steph/Dray:

Steph + Dray + Wigs + JK = +19.6 (124.7 O vs 105.1 D) in 219 possessions
Steph + Dray + JK but without Jimmy and our non-shooters or 2 way guys (TJD, GP2, Loon, SloMo, Spencer, Post) = +23 (132 O vs 109D) in 311 possessions. Out of the 12 lineups that were tried with those 3 that exclude the players mentioned, only one was a net negative (with Buddy and Lindy; - 126.7 Nrtg in 5 possessions). Of the other 11 lineups, 2 were dead even (0.0 net rating) and 9 were highly positive (the smallest of those 9 being a +12).

All the BS we heard about JK and wigs can't play together, Steph and JK can't play together, JK, Dray, Wigs can't play together. It all seems to be completely wrong IF you surround those 3 with 2 shooters. Not even great shooters, streaky, inconsistent shooters seem to do just fine. Not even 2 way players that defend and shoot. Just a reasonable approximation of a shooter is enough.

Everyone that wants the team to trade JK for a bag of stale pretzels should take one last look at those lineup combinations and take a moment to think it through.

[SpreeS]

JK does not fit modern basketball.. you cant play 1 on 1...look at AST% and AST/TO ratio he only cares about getting his not anyone else..I literally dont see him being a useful offensive player at all

This year, where he clearly struggled to fit what Kerr wanted, when JK played with Steph and Dray, the team was a +9.1 nrtg. This is according the cleaning the glass so no garbage time to skew the data. For reference:

Steph + Dray w/o JK were +7.4. (2300 possessions)

Steph + Dray in all lineups were +7.8. (3000 possessions)
Steph + Dray WITH JK were +9.1 (600 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + JK were +10.9 (250 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + Podz + JK were + 17.9 (16 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Podz + Moody + JK were a +130.6 (8 possessions) YES, that's not at typo, ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY POINT SIX NET RATING. 170 ORTG and 40 DRTG.

What this tells me is despite the struggles buddy, moody, and podz went through before the JK injury the Steph/Dray/JK lineup should have played more, especially with buddy/moody and podz. What most frustrating is the two lineups they used the least, to me, should have been the lineups that played the most and started most of our games.

Not to quote my own post but those numbers were so striking and it's been a while since i looked at lineup data on CTG, I went back and isolated the Steph/Dray/JK lineups by excluding non-shooters (for obvious reasons) and Jimmy (post injury malaise). Here's some more data that JK should have played A LOT with Steph/Dray:

Steph + Dray + Wigs + JK = +19.6 (124.7 O vs 105.1 D) in 219 possessions
Steph + Dray + JK but without Jimmy and our non-shooters or 2 way guys (TJD, GP2, Loon, SloMo, Spencer, Post) = +23 (132 O vs 109D) in 311 possessions. Out of the 12 lineups that were tried with those 3 that exclude the players mentioned, only one was a net negative (with Buddy and Lindy; - 126.7 Nrtg in 5 possessions). Of the other 11 lineups, 2 were dead even (0.0 net rating) and 9 were highly positive (the smallest of those 9 being a +12).

All the BS we heard about JK and wigs can't play together, Steph and JK can't play together, JK, Dray, Wigs can't play together. It all seems to be completely wrong IF you surround those 3 with 2 shooters. Not even great shooters, streaky, inconsistent shooters seem to do just fine. Not even 2 way players that defend and shoot. Just a reasonable approximation of a shooter is enough.

Everyone that wants the team to trade JK for a bag of stale pretzels should take one last look at those lineup combinations and take a moment to think it through.

Kerr didnt like Kuminga all these years b/c he wasnt his style player and sometimes took shots from Curry or killed motion offense..but all numbers show that Kuminga didn't hurt team so much how everyone here suggest. Kerr panicked after Butler trade instead of using brains how to use Kuminga.

2022-2025 (4 season)

Curry/Green/Wiggs 2758min +7.78nrtg
Curry/Green/Kuminga 1153min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Podz 991min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Butler 454min +6.31nrtg
Curry/Green/Klay 1820min +6.01nrtg
Curry/Green/Poole 1102min +5.57nrtg

2024-2025 (2 season)

Curry/Green/Kuminga 901min +11.12nrtg
Curry/Green/Podz 991min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Wiggs 1418min +7.16nrtg
Curry/Green/Butler 454min +6.31nrtg
Curry/Green/Klay 720min +2.99nrtg

Butler w/o Curry/Green 164min +7.64nrtg
Podz w/o Curry/Green 1595min +6.62nrtg
Kuminga w/o Curry/Green 1165min -0.78nrtg
Wiggs w/o Curry/Green 715min -7.56nrtg


Bolded part shows from where come all wins in RS after trade. But in Playoffs when Curry/Green/Butler minutes increase and they play more together, GSW doesnt look so dominant, b/c Curry/Butler/Green fit isn't best possible as big names suggest.

Wiggs was good fit to Curry/Green, but was so bad w/o them or one of them. The same story in MIAMI

2024-2025

Curry/Green/Wiggs 1418min +7.16nrtg
Curry/Green w/o Wiggs 1290min +4.86nrtg
Curry w/o Green/Wiggs 1044min +8.22nrtg
Green w/o Curry/Wiggs 605min +10.76nrtg
w/o Curry/Green/Wiggs 1757min +2.98nrtg

Wiggs/Curry w/o Green 923min -9.00nrtg
Wiggs/Green w/o Curry 161min -9.10nrtg
Wiggs w/o Green/Curry 715min -7.56nrtg

And Kerr (not only Kerr) loved Wiggs so much b/c of fit to Curry/Green. But team played +7.11nrtg better w/o him.

2024-2025 (2 seasons)

Wiggs in -1.39 out +5.37
Kuminga in +2.63 out +2.94

One was beloved and had warm place, other was the ugly duckling thrown from place to place.

[statsman]

If Kuminga were a game-changing player (for the better of the team), I would be blaming Kerr. I mainly blame Lacob for the drafting of Kuminga. Unfortunately, this wasn't an option.

[vvoland]

This year, where he clearly struggled to fit what Kerr wanted, when JK played with Steph and Dray, the team was a +9.1 nrtg. This is according the cleaning the glass so no garbage time to skew the data. For reference:

Steph + Dray w/o JK were +7.4. (2300 possessions)

Steph + Dray in all lineups were +7.8. (3000 possessions)
Steph + Dray WITH JK were +9.1 (600 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + JK were +10.9 (250 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Buddy + Podz + JK were + 17.9 (16 possessions)
Steph + Dray + Podz + Moody + JK were a +130.6 (8 possessions) YES, that's not at typo, ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY POINT SIX NET RATING. 170 ORTG and 40 DRTG.

What this tells me is despite the struggles buddy, moody, and podz went through before the JK injury the Steph/Dray/JK lineup should have played more, especially with buddy/moody and podz. What most frustrating is the two lineups they used the least, to me, should have been the lineups that played the most and started most of our games.

Not to quote my own post but those numbers were so striking and it's been a while since i looked at lineup data on CTG, I went back and isolated the Steph/Dray/JK lineups by excluding non-shooters (for obvious reasons) and Jimmy (post injury malaise). Here's some more data that JK should have played A LOT with Steph/Dray:

Steph + Dray + Wigs + JK = +19.6 (124.7 O vs 105.1 D) in 219 possessions
Steph + Dray + JK but without Jimmy and our non-shooters or 2 way guys (TJD, GP2, Loon, SloMo, Spencer, Post) = +23 (132 O vs 109D) in 311 possessions. Out of the 12 lineups that were tried with those 3 that exclude the players mentioned, only one was a net negative (with Buddy and Lindy; - 126.7 Nrtg in 5 possessions). Of the other 11 lineups, 2 were dead even (0.0 net rating) and 9 were highly positive (the smallest of those 9 being a +12).

All the BS we heard about JK and wigs can't play together, Steph and JK can't play together, JK, Dray, Wigs can't play together. It all seems to be completely wrong IF you surround those 3 with 2 shooters. Not even great shooters, streaky, inconsistent shooters seem to do just fine. Not even 2 way players that defend and shoot. Just a reasonable approximation of a shooter is enough.

Everyone that wants the team to trade JK for a bag of stale pretzels should take one last look at those lineup combinations and take a moment to think it through.

Kerr didnt like Kuminga all these years b/c he wasnt his style player and sometimes took shots from Curry or killed motion offense..but all numbers show that Kuminga didn't hurt team so much how everyone here suggest. Kerr panicked after Butler trade instead of using brains how to use Kuminga.

2022-2025 (4 season)

Curry/Green/Wiggs 2758min +7.78nrtg
Curry/Green/Kuminga 1153min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Podz 991min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Butler 454min +6.31nrtg
Curry/Green/Klay 1820min +6.01nrtg
Curry/Green/Poole 1102min +5.57nrtg

2024-2025 (2 season)

Curry/Green/Kuminga 901min +11.12nrtg
Curry/Green/Podz 991min +7.25nrtg
Curry/Green/Wiggs 1418min +7.16nrtg
Curry/Green/Butler 454min +6.31nrtg
Curry/Green/Klay 720min +2.99nrtg

Butler w/o Curry/Green 164min +7.64nrtg
Podz w/o Curry/Green 1595min +6.62nrtg
Kuminga w/o Curry/Green 1165min -0.78nrtg
Wiggs w/o Curry/Green 715min -7.56nrtg


Bolded part shows from where come all wins in RS after trade. But in Playoffs when Curry/Green/Butler minutes increase and they play more together, GSW doesnt look so dominant, b/c Curry/Butler/Green fit isn't best possible as big names suggest.

Wiggs was good fit to Curry/Green, but was so bad w/o them or one of them. The same story in MIAMI

2024-2025

Curry/Green/Wiggs 1418min +7.16nrtg
Curry/Green w/o Wiggs 1290min +4.86nrtg
Curry w/o Green/Wiggs 1044min +8.22nrtg
Green w/o Curry/Wiggs 605min +10.76nrtg
w/o Curry/Green/Wiggs 1757min +2.98nrtg

Wiggs/Curry w/o Green 923min -9.00nrtg
Wiggs/Green w/o Curry 161min -9.10nrtg
Wiggs w/o Green/Curry 715min -7.56nrtg

And Kerr (not only Kerr) loved Wiggs so much b/c of fit to Curry/Green. But team played +7.11nrtg better w/o him.

2024-2025 (2 seasons)

Wiggs in -1.39 out +5.37
Kuminga in +2.63 out +2.94

One was beloved and had warm place, other was the ugly duckling thrown from place to place.

Kerr is certainly convinced JK hurts the curry/dray combo, despite what the lineup data said. He tried it after the good start evaporated and the team was desperate. He didn't get it was necessary to find the right mix once he came back late in the season despite it being pretty obvious we'd need him. Seeing him being our best defensive option on both ant and randle while scoring effectively against elite defenders really makes you wonder if they could have beat hou (or lac) with him having any role at all.

All yours numbers would also suggest playing jk in the wigs role (or with Steph/Curry/wigs) + a shooter but Steve just refused to do it. It's beyond frustrating how little he played with Steph/dray/podz/ and buddy or moody. 24 total possessions is crazy low for a lineup that should have been a top 5 unit for this team, unless they proved they couldn't do it. But they were amazing in those 24 possessions (~12 mins), making such a low number even more frustrating.

+/- podcast guys certainly made it seem like there's a segment of the coaching staff that doesn't like jk. Resents him as he was never their pick and the fact he's still here instead of being moved for vet help. It's inarguable that his leash is non-existent while virtually everyone else gets away with murder. I realize I'm in the minority but I think he'll go to bkn or uta and really blossom

[Nvnervous45]

This is really about butler being better than Kuminga in every facet of the game, but you can't surround curry with with 3 non shooters (dray, Kuminga, and butler), even if the other guy is buddy heild.

[DB23]

It’s unreal how much people defend kuminga and refuse to hold him accountable for his play on the court.

The phantom upside is blinding people. He’s just not an additive basketball player.

Even in the wolves series where he shot the ball pretty well and made less dumb decisions, he still hardly impacted winning.

And we have a 4 year sample size.