2020 Draft Thread, Part 2

[northoakland510]

Funny that you bring up Thabeet was just talking to one of my boys about him today. I asked him what was his issue, he basically he just wasn't ready. His coach told him he wasn't ready, but he still left. What I found interesting was that they said his core was so weak he couldn't get up without using his hands.

He also didn't give a crap about the game of basketball.

I met him once, and he said as much.

Wow that is crazy. I remember seeing some video of him working to get back in the league, I guess a little too late.

[Scoots1994]

Bradley didn't have anywhere near the athleticism Wiseman has. We do not know if any of these draft picks will pan out, but I'll test the waters with a good big man before a good little man.

I didn't say he did, but "you can't teach 7 foot and 7-6 wing span" is put to rest by Bradley. Length alone is not enough.

This sizeist thinking is why Hasheem Thabeet was taken #2 in the same draft where Curry fell to #7, and how Sam Bowie was drafted before Michael Jordan. In both cases the teams were thinking "This guy is big and athletic and he's shown flashes of these valuable skills, how can we pass on that size for these smaller guys (or guys who play positions the team is already good at)"

Larger size is better ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL ... but with Wiseman (like with Thabeet) there is a lot of the data that is not available.

Funny that you bring up Thabeet was just talking to one of my boys about him today. I asked him what was his issue, he basically he just wasn't ready. His coach told him he wasn't ready, but he still left. What I found interesting was that they said his core was so weak he couldn't get up without using his hands.

Thabeet as not ready at any level, and apparently he was never going to be ready because his brain wasn't up to the task. A sports agent friend of mine (he had a client with the Grizzlies at the time) said the word he got was that Thabeet was lazy and a bit of a child.

But the point was that a cut up of his game tape looked like he had all the potential in the world.

[Scoots1994]

I didn't say he did, but "you can't teach 7 foot and 7-6 wing span" is put to rest by Bradley. Length alone is not enough.

This sizeist thinking is why Hasheem Thabeet was taken #2 in the same draft where Curry fell to #7, and how Sam Bowie was drafted before Michael Jordan. In both cases the teams were thinking "This guy is big and athletic and he's shown flashes of these valuable skills, how can we pass on that size for these smaller guys (or guys who play positions the team is already good at)"

Larger size is better ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL ... but with Wiseman (like with Thabeet) there is a lot of the data that is not available.

Funny that you bring up Thabeet was just talking to one of my boys about him today. I asked him what was his issue, he basically he just wasn't ready. His coach told him he wasn't ready, but he still left. What I found interesting was that they said his core was so weak he couldn't get up without using his hands.

He also didn't give a crap about the game of basketball.

Yep. And he kept it a secret through the entire pre-draft process.

[Mylie10]

He also didn't give a crap about the game of basketball.

I met him once, and he said as much.

Wow that is crazy. I remember seeing some video of him working to get back in the league, I guess a little too late.

He’s from Africa. And basically the only reason he played basketball was because he was so tall. Got talked into it.

[Little Digger]

POB is still hooping...I think in Canada

[SF_Warriors]

But I see a better shooter and also better passer in Wiseman year one and for sure many years after. Future All Star.

This is where I get off your bandwagon. How is he a better shooter when most of his shots are inside dunks? How is he a better paser when he isn't known for his passing?

He seems to have a inside fadeaway J, but I wouldn't call Wiseman a perimeter shooter. One of my knocks against him is he's sawft as hell and doesn't bang inside to get to the rim or on defense. Compare him to Okongwu in terms of banging. The comparison to David Robinson really turned me off and against him. He's just not a perimeter shooter nor perimeter passer.

Obviously the talent level he is facing in the clips is high school caliber, and of course its only highlights, but watch that and tell me the guy can't shoot or pass. Looks like he has no issue leading the break/ going coast to coast although obviously not something I hope he does often in the nba,

Passing:
Looks like he can be a good top of the key, elbow passer. Looks up for lead passes, can take a dribble or two before making the pass

0:37 - No look lob on a fast break (looks like an exhibition, so maybe take it with a grain of salt), but it was a nice one handed no look.
0:46 - Off the dribble forward pass on the break, gets it back for a dunk
1:26 - One dribble, one handed lead pass to open teammate on the break for a layup
2:04 - one dribble lead pass for layup
3:44 - top of the key, over the top pass to cutting teammate for layup
6:02 - Shovel pass from ft line to wide open teammate for layup (not that impressive)
7:51 - One dribble lead pass for open layup
7:58 - top of the key to open teammate under the hoop
8:15 - gets the block, gets the rebound, leads the break, passes to teammate, gets a wide open lob but misses : (
8:43 - over the top pass from top of the key to teammate for layup
9:28 - over the shoulder pass from baseline to wide open teammate for layup

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 12-15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7-8 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

[ILOVEIT]

Did people notice how Bam struggled to finish in the paint vs. the Lakers? He wasn't fully healthy but he was pump faking a few times and still didn't make shots.

You can't teach 7 foot and 7-6 wing span.

I'm not against signing some minimum or low-salary deal for a vet C and just giving him a limited role. That is what Zaza was for the Warriors. But now that KD is gone, they need more than just clogging up space. Need more rebounding, shot blocking and maybe some upside.

Imagine deep in the playoffs, we have a vet C on a low contract. Is he going to get any respect from the refs? Does he have the upside to run the court in transition and get some big baskets or rebounds?

If nothing else, Wiseman would have young legs and more energy than an older vet center. Now we don't know if he'll have the motor or the competitiveness to play at 100 MPH. Damian Jones had youth, athletic ability but he didn't have the motor. He was poor at rebounding, didn't protect the rim and switched out onto a perimeter player, he didn't bear down and try to stay in front of him.

You'd expect Wiseman to be better than Jones in all areas but how much better?

Bam is almost as overrated as the push to try and find players like him.

I repeat. If he can't defend the three point line, if he can't shoot from three, if he will not be a reasonable contributor in the Warriors 2021 playoff run...I don't want him.

I keep hearing Wiseman is this and that yet I've watch the only three college games he's played and he's NOT this or that. He's slow...his hands appear average or below...he does not demonstrate in any of the games the desire to bang or push others out of the paint. Instead of spreading out and taking up room...he get's skinny and trys to reach over people for the ball.

He's mechanical and slow in getting shots off and making basketball moves.

He is a project.

So if you are okay waiting 3-4 years before he becomes a potentially dominate player while playing a lot of games down in Santa Cruz the first year....then you'll be happy Warriors draft him.

I won't be. Toppin is my guy. Deni is a close second.

[ILOVEIT]

But I see a better shooter and also better passer in Wiseman year one and for sure many years after. Future All Star.

This is where I get off your bandwagon. How is he a better shooter when most of his shots are inside dunks? How is he a better paser when he isn't known for his passing?

He seems to have a inside fadeaway J, but I wouldn't call Wiseman a perimeter shooter. One of my knocks against him is he's sawft as hell and doesn't bang inside to get to the rim or on defense. Compare him to Okongwu in terms of banging. The comparison to David Robinson really turned me off and against him. He's just not a perimeter shooter nor perimeter passer.

Obviously the talent level he is facing in the clips is high school caliber, and of course its only highlights, but watch that and tell me the guy can't shoot or pass. Looks like he has no issue leading the break/ going coast to coast although obviously not something I hope he does often in the nba,

Passing:
Looks like he can be a good top of the key, elbow passer. Looks up for lead passes, can take a dribble or two before making the pass

0:37 - No look lob on a fast break (looks like an exhibition, so maybe take it with a grain of salt)
0:46 - Off the dribble forward pass on the break, gets it back for a dunk
1:26 - One dribble, one handed lead pass to open teammate on the break for a layup
2:04 - one dribble lead pass for layup
3:44 - top of the key, over the top pass to cutting teammate for layup
6:02 - Shovel pass from ft line to wide open teammate for layup (not that impressive)
7:51 - One dribble lead pass for open layup
7:58 - top of the key to open teammate under the hoop
8:15 - gets the block, gets the rebound, leads the break, passes to teammate, gets a wide open lob but misses : (
8:43 - over the top pass from top of the key to teammate for layup
9:28 - over the shoulder pass from baseline to wide open teammate for layup

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

He looks great in this video...no doubt.

Funny how I get crap for posting the lowlight video ... but these highlight videos are awesome! lol

In the end...if he's for real...Warriors will draft him. If they don't take him then they clearly saw more of what many of us suspect.

[SF_Warriors]

This is where I get off your bandwagon. How is he a better shooter when most of his shots are inside dunks? How is he a better paser when he isn't known for his passing?

He seems to have a inside fadeaway J, but I wouldn't call Wiseman a perimeter shooter. One of my knocks against him is he's sawft as hell and doesn't bang inside to get to the rim or on defense. Compare him to Okongwu in terms of banging. The comparison to David Robinson really turned me off and against him. He's just not a perimeter shooter nor perimeter passer.

Obviously the talent level he is facing in the clips is high school caliber, and of course its only highlights, but watch that and tell me the guy can't shoot or pass. Looks like he has no issue leading the break/ going coast to coast although obviously not something I hope he does often in the nba,

Passing:
Looks like he can be a good top of the key, elbow passer. Looks up for lead passes, can take a dribble or two before making the pass

0:37 - No look lob on a fast break (looks like an exhibition, so maybe take it with a grain of salt)
0:46 - Off the dribble forward pass on the break, gets it back for a dunk
1:26 - One dribble, one handed lead pass to open teammate on the break for a layup
2:04 - one dribble lead pass for layup
3:44 - top of the key, over the top pass to cutting teammate for layup
6:02 - Shovel pass from ft line to wide open teammate for layup (not that impressive)
7:51 - One dribble lead pass for open layup
7:58 - top of the key to open teammate under the hoop
8:15 - gets the block, gets the rebound, leads the break, passes to teammate, gets a wide open lob but misses : (
8:43 - over the top pass from top of the key to teammate for layup
9:28 - over the shoulder pass from baseline to wide open teammate for layup

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

He looks great in this video...no doubt.

Funny how I get crap for posting the lowlight video ... but these highlight videos are awesome! lol

In the end...if he's for real...Warriors will draft him. If they don't take him then they clearly saw more of what many of us suspect.

I analyzed the low lights video in a previous post as well. I think it is very important to look at a player's weaknesses as well as his strengths and to judge whether those weaknesses will be exploitable in the nba. Wiseman is a bit of a liability on the perimeter but not many 7 footers can defend out there. I think that is his biggest weakness from what I can gather and we will have moments where we might be wanting kerr to take him out because of it (if he is drafted).
I think what we can discern from the highlights is that he is not a below average jump shooter or passer, which some people were hinting at, and that they may actually be things that enhance his value in the league.

[ShayDee]

But I see a better shooter and also better passer in Wiseman year one and for sure many years after. Future All Star.

This is where I get off your bandwagon. How is he a better shooter when most of his shots are inside dunks? How is he a better paser when he isn't known for his passing?

He seems to have a inside fadeaway J, but I wouldn't call Wiseman a perimeter shooter. One of my knocks against him is he's sawft as hell and doesn't bang inside to get to the rim or on defense. Compare him to Okongwu in terms of banging. The comparison to David Robinson really turned me off and against him. He's just not a perimeter shooter nor perimeter passer.

Obviously the talent level he is facing in the clips is high school caliber, and of course its only highlights, but watch that and tell me the guy can't shoot or pass. Looks like he has no issue leading the break/ going coast to coast although obviously not something I hope he does often in the nba,

Passing:
Looks like he can be a good top of the key, elbow passer. Looks up for lead passes, can take a dribble or two before making the pass

0:37 - No look lob on a fast break (looks like an exhibition, so maybe take it with a grain of salt), but it was a nice one handed no look.
0:46 - Off the dribble forward pass on the break, gets it back for a dunk
1:26 - One dribble, one handed lead pass to open teammate on the break for a layup
2:04 - one dribble lead pass for layup
3:44 - top of the key, over the top pass to cutting teammate for layup
6:02 - Shovel pass from ft line to wide open teammate for layup (not that impressive)
7:51 - One dribble lead pass for open layup
7:58 - top of the key to open teammate under the hoop
8:15 - gets the block, gets the rebound, leads the break, passes to teammate, gets a wide open lob but misses : (
8:43 - over the top pass from top of the key to teammate for layup
9:28 - over the shoulder pass from baseline to wide open teammate for layup

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 12-15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7-8 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

Now imagine this extremely coachable and hardworking 7ft kid, 2 years later, with proper uninterrupted NBA training and dieting and continuous workouts for 9 months straight. Imagine what kind of monster is brewing with such potential and talent, especially in a system like GSW or Spurs giving him infinite spacing for him to work, find the open cutter or take open jumpers. Just imagine

Can anyone give me a 7fter, with such fluid ball handling and smooth stroke of a jumper? Just give me one, except KD. This kid in my opinion is a better ball handler than Towns

[SF_Warriors]

This is where I get off your bandwagon. How is he a better shooter when most of his shots are inside dunks? How is he a better paser when he isn't known for his passing?

He seems to have a inside fadeaway J, but I wouldn't call Wiseman a perimeter shooter. One of my knocks against him is he's sawft as hell and doesn't bang inside to get to the rim or on defense. Compare him to Okongwu in terms of banging. The comparison to David Robinson really turned me off and against him. He's just not a perimeter shooter nor perimeter passer.

Obviously the talent level he is facing in the clips is high school caliber, and of course its only highlights, but watch that and tell me the guy can't shoot or pass. Looks like he has no issue leading the break/ going coast to coast although obviously not something I hope he does often in the nba,

Passing:
Looks like he can be a good top of the key, elbow passer. Looks up for lead passes, can take a dribble or two before making the pass

0:37 - No look lob on a fast break (looks like an exhibition, so maybe take it with a grain of salt), but it was a nice one handed no look.
0:46 - Off the dribble forward pass on the break, gets it back for a dunk
1:26 - One dribble, one handed lead pass to open teammate on the break for a layup
2:04 - one dribble lead pass for layup
3:44 - top of the key, over the top pass to cutting teammate for layup
6:02 - Shovel pass from ft line to wide open teammate for layup (not that impressive)
7:51 - One dribble lead pass for open layup
7:58 - top of the key to open teammate under the hoop
8:15 - gets the block, gets the rebound, leads the break, passes to teammate, gets a wide open lob but misses : (
8:43 - over the top pass from top of the key to teammate for layup
9:28 - over the shoulder pass from baseline to wide open teammate for layup

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 12-15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7-8 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

Now imagine this extremely coachable and hardworking 7ft kid, 2 years later, with proper uninterrupted NBA training and dieting and continuous workouts for 9 months straight. Imagine what kind of monster is brewing with such potential and talent, especially in a system like GSW or Spurs giving him infinite spacing for him to work, find the open cutter or take open jumpers. Just imagine

Can anyone give me a 7fter, with such fluid ball handling and smooth stroke of a jumper? Just give me one, except KD. This kid in my opinion is a better ball handler than Towns

I just want to add that the footwork and touch on those turnarounds/fadeaways are advanced even for nba standards. Looks like that can be a go to shot for him somewhere down the line. Also, his touch and range for hookshots is easily above average for nba standards.

[Onus]

Jumpshooting:
Wiseman is not an elite or even well above average shooter, but it is certainly not a weakness and I think eventually it will become a strength once he gets used to shooting over nba caliber defenders, almost none of which can realistically block that shot..Does not have nba 3 point range and not sure if he will ever be able to develop it, but absolutely needs to be checked around 15-18 feet. Looks like he can develop a proper turnaround ala lamarcus though.

0:07 - 3 point shot with guy contesting top of key
0:53 - One dribble long two with defender contesting top of key
0:57 - Spot up three with defender contesting top of key
1:02 - Post up fadeaway 10-12 footer or so over defender
1:05 - Three pointer top of key
1:16 - 12-15 foot fadeaway moving off the ball over contesting defender
1:59 - spot up three point top of the key semi contested
2:23 - Post up fadeaway in the paint
2:39 - 15 foot free throw line jumper
4:43 - contested 7-8 foot jumper
8:55 - inside key turnaround jumper
9:18 - baseline turnaround 10 foot
3:02 - off the dribble pull up long two or three over contesting defenders
6:09 - Long two over defender
6:32 - Face up free throw shot, nice footwork there for a quick, smooth shot

Watch on YouTube

You look at this mixtape and you see the shooting and you're like damn this guy has something he must've been a decent shooter. Then you look at the numbers and he shot 14% from 3 and 55% from the ft line and you think to yourself, wtf is he doing shooting these shots? How many of these shots did he brick for him to shoot 14%.

As for his passing. Most of the passes are fastbreak type passes, so maybe he becomes a good outlet passer. There's like 3 high low passes, 1 pass off a double team, and a shovel pass in the half court. In a 10 min video we're going to take 5 passes and claim he's a good passer? This really isn't what people are pointing to to claim he's a good passer is it? He averages like 1 assist for every 2 turnovers.

Like I get it he shows some flashes. He can improve on these things. But to say he's going to do these things at an nba level as a rookie is a huge reach. These skills aren't even refined enough for him to use in hs regularly. So can we stop with the hype. He's a good prospect, he has a ton of potential stemming from his physical attributes. But the skills posters are attributing to him are not based on facts, they're based on outliers from Wiseman.

Saying all this yes I would draft him #2 but it's not based on his unicorn skills of being a passer and a 3 point threat, it's based on his physical attributes and hopefully his ability to defend everywhere on the court.

[Onus]

Now imagine this extremely coachable and hardworking 7ft kid, 2 years later, with proper uninterrupted NBA training and dieting and continuous workouts for 9 months straight. Imagine what kind of monster is brewing with such potential and talent, especially in a system like GSW or Spurs giving him infinite spacing for him to work, find the open cutter or take open jumpers. Just imagine

Can anyone give me a 7fter, with such fluid ball handling and smooth stroke of a jumper? Just give me one, except KD. This kid in my opinion is a better ball handler than Towns

I just want to add that the footwork and touch on those turnarounds/fadeaways are advanced even for nba standards. Looks like that can be a go to shot for him somewhere down the line. Also, his touch and range for hookshots is easily above average for nba standards.

I will admit that the footwork and touch on the turnaround/fadeaways are really nice, that part of his game really reminds me of Bosh. But dude you're 7'1" and you're the biggest kid on the court can you play like it.

Like AD is a great jumpshooter, but every time he settles for a jumper in isolation that's a win for the defense. Which is why the Lakers stopped giving the ball to AD and let him be a finisher rather than a creator on offense.

[SF_Warriors]

Now imagine this extremely coachable and hardworking 7ft kid, 2 years later, with proper uninterrupted NBA training and dieting and continuous workouts for 9 months straight. Imagine what kind of monster is brewing with such potential and talent, especially in a system like GSW or Spurs giving him infinite spacing for him to work, find the open cutter or take open jumpers. Just imagine

Can anyone give me a 7fter, with such fluid ball handling and smooth stroke of a jumper? Just give me one, except KD. This kid in my opinion is a better ball handler than Towns

I just want to add that the footwork and touch on those turnarounds/fadeaways are advanced even for nba standards. Looks like that can be a go to shot for him somewhere down the line. Also, his touch and range for hookshots is easily above average for nba standards.

I will admit that the footwork and touch on the turnaround/fadeaways are really nice, that part of his game really reminds me of Bosh. But dude you're 7'1" and you're the biggest kid on the court can you play like it.

Like AD is a great jumpshooter, but every time he settles for a jumper in isolation that's a win for the defense. Which is why the Lakers stopped giving the ball to AD and let him be a finisher rather than a creator on offense.

Honest assessment of him, I dont see perennial all star. I see above average starter ala turner or nurkic where you know he is a key contributor to a winning situation with a diverse skillset. Or maybe more like a fringe all star potential if that makes sense. Now thats not something I personally want with the #2 but from what ive seen from other prospects..I just dont see any stars at the top, and that includes melo and edwards.

A 7 footer that can consistently get turnarounds in the nba is a serious asset. So I look at it as, hes not shaq, but he can get an advanced shot off against most defenders. So if you are 7 foot, developing a turnaround is not necessary? He shpuld just bully his way to the hoop every time? Not even guys like embiid and AD are able to do that.

As for the passing, those high lows and fast break actions look translatable to the nba. Will he do it many times a game? Prob not, but will that be part of his reportoire..yes.

I already said he isnt an above average shooter but guys cant just lay off of him like they would drummond for example.

[Onus]

I just want to add that the footwork and touch on those turnarounds/fadeaways are advanced even for nba standards. Looks like that can be a go to shot for him somewhere down the line. Also, his touch and range for hookshots is easily above average for nba standards.

I will admit that the footwork and touch on the turnaround/fadeaways are really nice, that part of his game really reminds me of Bosh. But dude you're 7'1" and you're the biggest kid on the court can you play like it.

Like AD is a great jumpshooter, but every time he settles for a jumper in isolation that's a win for the defense. Which is why the Lakers stopped giving the ball to AD and let him be a finisher rather than a creator on offense.

Honest assessment of him, I dont see perennial all star. I see above average starter ala turner or nurkic where you know he is a key contributor to a winning situation with a diverse skillset. Or maybe more like a fringe all star if that makes sense. Now thats not something I personally want with the #2 but from what ive seen from other prospects..I just dont see any stars at the top, and that includes melo and edwards.

A 7 footer that can consistently get turnarounds in the nba is a serious asset. So I look at it as, hes not shaq, but he can get an advanced shot off against most defenders.

If he can be gobert like on defense he's worth the #2. I keep saying this but what determines how good he can be is if he can defend on the perimeter. If he can be competent out there he's going to be a defensive force with his size and length. Anything he can do offensively other than rim running will be gravy. What makes AD so great is that defensively he can dominate the paint while being able to guard the best wing players. That's special. You can't small ball him because he can guard anyone.

And thank you for a much more reasonable assessment.

[SF_Warriors]

I will admit that the footwork and touch on the turnaround/fadeaways are really nice, that part of his game really reminds me of Bosh. But dude you're 7'1" and you're the biggest kid on the court can you play like it.

Like AD is a great jumpshooter, but every time he settles for a jumper in isolation that's a win for the defense. Which is why the Lakers stopped giving the ball to AD and let him be a finisher rather than a creator on offense.

Honest assessment of him, I dont see perennial all star. I see above average starter ala turner or nurkic where you know he is a key contributor to a winning situation with a diverse skillset. Or maybe more like a fringe all star if that makes sense. Now thats not something I personally want with the #2 but from what ive seen from other prospects..I just dont see any stars at the top, and that includes melo and edwards.

A 7 footer that can consistently get turnarounds in the nba is a serious asset. So I look at it as, hes not shaq, but he can get an advanced shot off against most defenders.

If he can be gobert like on defense he's worth the #2. I keep saying this but what determines how good he can be is if he can defend on the perimeter. If he can be competent out there he's going to be a defensive force with his size and length. Anything he can do offensively other than rim running will be gravy. What makes AD so great is that defensively he can dominate the paint while being able to guard the best wing players. That's special. You can't small ball him because he can guard anyone.

And thank you for a much more reasonable assessment.

Im not sold on wisemans defense being elite. I see solid two way player. Im just even less sold on the other prospects but we will have to see how the draft goes.

[Onus]

I've got to say Deni really is super intriguing. He's 6'9'' barefoot meaning he's 6'10''-6'11''. He's 230 lbs and has a 8'10'' standing reach. That is massive for a 3. You see the tape of him guarding 1-5 in the euroleague and he is the one assigned to stop the euroleague mvp down the stretch in Shane Larkin, so he'll be able to switch 1-5 giving us the defensive versatility. He's also a good weakside shot blocker because of his length, knowing when to rotate. (This is something missing in Wiggins game currently, you see all his defensive highlights and it's all on ball, there's nothing showing him rotating over covering for others)

Offensively his shooting is spotty and his fts are horrendous. But he did shoot 40% from the corners and was the one taking most of the bail out shots for the team. He cuts well to the basket, seems like he has big hands as he palms the ball off the dribble for dunks. Can make the right pass. Can run a little pick and roll. Has a post up game against smaller players. Has great straight line speed and able to get low to get by defenders. He has the size that defenders bounce off of him when he drives (this is where his stardom can come from). He doesn't really have a lot of lateral movement offensively mostly a straight line driver, but I'm not sure how important that is. There's a lot of players that move in straight lines to get where they want but they're all superstars (kawhi, lebron, giannis) not a lot of side to side movement but they use their size and strength to create separation. This is where Deni's size comes in. He needs to learn to use his size more often and consistently to get where he wants and to create separation. If he's able to do that there's a shot he can become a star, because he does everything else really well. His major weakness is spotty shooting and weak left hand. Other than he has it all. If he's learns how to use his size to his advantage consistently he has a shot at becoming a star.

[Onus]

Honest assessment of him, I dont see perennial all star. I see above average starter ala turner or nurkic where you know he is a key contributor to a winning situation with a diverse skillset. Or maybe more like a fringe all star if that makes sense. Now thats not something I personally want with the #2 but from what ive seen from other prospects..I just dont see any stars at the top, and that includes melo and edwards.

A 7 footer that can consistently get turnarounds in the nba is a serious asset. So I look at it as, hes not shaq, but he can get an advanced shot off against most defenders.

If he can be gobert like on defense he's worth the #2. I keep saying this but what determines how good he can be is if he can defend on the perimeter. If he can be competent out there he's going to be a defensive force with his size and length. Anything he can do offensively other than rim running will be gravy. What makes AD so great is that defensively he can dominate the paint while being able to guard the best wing players. That's special. You can't small ball him because he can guard anyone.

And thank you for a much more reasonable assessment.

Im not sold on wisemans defense being elite. I see solid two way player. Im just even less sold on the other prospects but we will have to see how the draft goes.

I agree I'm not confident he'll be elite defensively but he does have a shot to become that.

[BW32]

Shane Larkin was MVP? Woof.

[Onus]

Shane Larkin was MVP? Woof.

He avg 22 over there on 53/51/90 shooting splits