Who starts?

[DAWill1128]

I am cool with Moody starting at shooting guard. I am not saying that Moody will outperform Melton or be the better fit. But at this point you might as well give Moody a go and hope for the best, otherwise we are a play in caliber team.

Pros on going Moody:
A.) He takes a fourth year leap as a player and is better than the alternative options.
B.) He spikes his trade value by starting and doing well.
C.) We can determine to what extent are we paying to keep the guy.

Negatives on going Moody:
A.) Melton is just the better player and or fit.
B.) He plays so well we can't afford to keep him.

As constructed we've chosen to go on hopeful thinking that JK and or Podz will make a leap, that's our game plan. Podz is gonna get 30+ a night. JK is gonna start, if he doesn't then what was the point of bypassing on better players in trades for all these years? Give Moody a go, develop the asset and take another swing on a young guy taking the leap.

[TB]

Our best lineups are going to be the stretches with Dray at the 5, but as for starting I'm currently going with:

Steph / Podz
Melton / Buddy / GP2
Kuminga / Wiggins
Dray / Moody
Loon / Kyle / Trayce

12 man rotation with the centers splitting pretty evenly and GP2 as sort of a "fill in anywhere if needed" 12th man.

Now Moody is a 4? My god man.

nah just plugging in the names for the next 5 in. Moody is a 3/D wing that's versatile enough to be a plug and play 6th man type that can fit with any lineup. Unfortunately, it's pretty clear Kerr has him as 12th man and is going to give every other wing a chance first.

[EvanZ]

We have this weird dichotomy where it’s either “Moody has to start!” Or “Moody should be getting DNP’d”. The actual reasonable take is that Moody should be getting a consistent 20 minutes every game and that should come at the expense of someone else like GPII and **** Buddy Hield who we are all going to hate by December.

[CDM_Stats]

They are prioritizing jk over moody eventhough they play nothing alike. Even with wiggins out, moody is still a 11th man under kerr.

If jk flops this year or is traded, then maybe moody gets a real shot (if he's not on another team).

Actually disagree here. Moody is def underrated, but I dont know if you can play him and Wiggins together, at least until Moody is 1) more involved with the offense, especially C&S, and 2) more importantly, efficient at it. They don't play well together, while Wiggins/JK have the potential to play well together if JK's off-ball defense improves

Also just have to note.. Moody's middle name is Josiah. Moses Josiah Moody. MoJo Moody.. how is that not his nickname??

Have to disagree with your disagreement. Unless JK ever learns how to shoot he's a bad fit with everyone on this team. Moody is a seamless fit with Wiggins. They are both wings. Fact check: In 2024 you are allowed to play 2 or more wings at the same time. I know, it's a crazy concept for Warriors fans to learn (which is odd given how we literally won 4 titles doing it). As much as I love 4-guard lineups, no Moody and Wiggins playing together can work. I'm not sure how many minutes it's been given to even test, but far too few that's for sure.

Wiggins and JK is the tandem that doesn't work. Those two cannot be in the starting lineup together unless Draymond plays the 5.

Steph/Melton/Moody/Wiggins/Draymond... that should be the death lineup this season. Wiggins might be toast however.

Bolded lineup could work, but it would depend on Wiggins doing well at the 4 again, which he hasn't done in a while. But I think its one of the only Moody/Wiggins combos that could work. In roughly 600 minutes over 3 years, Wiggins and Moody have had negative effects on each other. Partly because of crazy lineups, but also because they are very similar archetypes that are SF heavy combo forwards, at least for the purposes of the Warriors offense historically. Either way though, one or both have to become a more reliable volume 3pt shooter for it to work, and in Moody's case, he needs to be fed on the perimeter when he's wide open, which doesnt happen often enough in games that matter. Except the playoffs once the team is already down double digit points, that is

But the SG slot has always been the issue when Moody/Wiggins play. Steph and Dray are mandatory.. last year Kuminga was paired with them most (not counting Steph), to poor results. Next behind Kuminga was Podz, to slightly better but still negative results. Melton offers a new option though

Lastly, and I cannot explain this, but Moody and Dray have not worked well together historically either. At least with Wiggins I can point to lineup and similar skillsets, but I cannot figure out why Dray/Wiggins works so well while Dray/Moody doesn't

[CDM_Stats]

We have this weird dichotomy where it’s either “Moody has to start!” Or “Moody should be getting DNP’d”. The actual reasonable take is that Moody should be getting a consistent 20 minutes every game and that should come at the expense of someone else like GPII and **** Buddy Hield who we are all going to hate by December.

A lot of you have been on this board long enough... do your work early. Prep your hate now, have it ready. We can do this by November

[DevinVassell]

[
Also just have to note.. Moody's middle name is Josiah. Moses Josiah Moody. MoJo Moody.. how is that not his nickname??

Mr Mojo Risin?

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=2108843&p=93350963&hilit=Mojo+devinvassell#p93350963

TM

[CDM_Stats]

[
Also just have to note.. Moody's middle name is Josiah. Moses Josiah Moody. MoJo Moody.. how is that not his nickname??

Mr Mojo Risin?

Limitless options

Showing my age a bit here but if we brought in Joe Johnson as a coach and had him work with Moody...

[CDM_Stats]

Numbers shows that our best unit is with Kuminga…

was

This team is unlike most before because we lost a rotation mainstay in Klay, who was killing us offensively and defensively. Kuminga's lineups were best on a team that wasn't good. Shouldnt fall into the trap that he has to be in the best lineups this year if we're trying to win. If we're not though, then sure

[SpreeS]

Numbers shows that our best unit is with Kuminga…

was

This team is unlike most before because we lost a rotation mainstay in Klay, who was killing us offensively and defensively. Kuminga's lineups were best on a team that wasn't good. Shouldnt fall into the trap that he has to be in the best lineups this year if we're trying to win. If we're not though, then sure

Really? Do you understand what are you talking?

[SpreeS]

Have to disagree with your disagreement. Unless JK ever learns how to shoot he's a bad fit with everyone on this team. Moody is a seamless fit with Wiggins. They are both wings. Fact check: In 2024 you are allowed to play 2 or more wings at the same time. I know, it's a crazy concept for Warriors fans to learn (which is odd given how we literally won 4 titles doing it). As much as I love 4-guard lineups, no Moody and Wiggins playing together can work. I'm not sure how many minutes it's been given to even test, but far too few that's for sure.

Wiggins and JK is the tandem that doesn't work. Those two cannot be in the starting lineup together unless Draymond plays the 5.

Steph/Melton/Moody/Wiggins/Draymond... that should be the death lineup this season. Wiggins might be toast however.

Numbers shows that our best unit is with Kuminga…

What numbers and specifically what lineup?

Why do you ask me? Don’t you know our best lineup from last year?

[Crazy-Canuck]

Numbers shows that our best unit is with Kuminga…

What numbers and specifically what lineup?

Why do you ask me? Don’t you know our best lineup from last year?

Yeah, it was steph klay, wiggins, dray, and tjd with a + 28.3 net rtg.

[SpreeS]

This forum is worthless.

[CDM_Stats]

Numbers shows that our best unit is with Kuminga…

was

This team is unlike most before because we lost a rotation mainstay in Klay, who was killing us offensively and defensively. Kuminga's lineups were best on a team that wasn't good. Shouldnt fall into the trap that he has to be in the best lineups this year if we're trying to win. If we're not though, then sure

Really? Do you understand what are you talking?

I understand that this was put into a translation thing, but still its kinda funny And I do understand what I am saying

Kuminga's skillset fit because we needed someone to run at the rim and the defense was already crap, so he didnt make much of a negative impact then. This year the team may have resolved those defensive issues, starting with Melton. So unless Kuminga's defense improves (or the team is still pretty poor overall), then there's absolutely reason to believe our best lineup might not be with JK in it

[Crazy-Canuck]

I'm guessing kerr rolls out the save starting unit or with podz minus melton vs the kings. And they will look good because the kings' halfcourt defense is g league like.

[SpreeS]

was

This team is unlike most before because we lost a rotation mainstay in Klay, who was killing us offensively and defensively. Kuminga's lineups were best on a team that wasn't good. Shouldnt fall into the trap that he has to be in the best lineups this year if we're trying to win. If we're not though, then sure

Really? Do you understand what are you talking?

I understand that this was put into a translation thing, but still its kinda funny And I do understand what I am saying

Kuminga's skillset fit because we needed someone to run at the rim and the defense was already crap, so he didnt make much of a negative impact then. This year the team may have resolved those defensive issues, starting with Melton. So unless Kuminga's defense improves (or the team is still pretty poor overall), then there's absolutely reason to believe our best lineup might not be with JK in it

Kuminga/Wiggs/Green 109.1 drtg
Kuminga/Green 108.3 drtg

Is it crap defence?

[CDM_Stats]

Really? Do you understand what are you talking?

I understand that this was put into a translation thing, but still its kinda funny And I do understand what I am saying

Kuminga's skillset fit because we needed someone to run at the rim and the defense was already crap, so he didnt make much of a negative impact then. This year the team may have resolved those defensive issues, starting with Melton. So unless Kuminga's defense improves (or the team is still pretty poor overall), then there's absolutely reason to believe our best lineup might not be with JK in it

Kuminga/Wiggs/Green 109.1 drtg
Kuminga/Green 108.3 drtg

Is it crap defence?

One wouldnt be able to tell good defense or bad defense from something as basic as DRtg. Especially one that is only showing percentages of the team - the DRtg thing on the lineups tab isnt very useful, and when it is useful its when its looking at 5 man units. I wasn't aware sites still put that data with pairings or incomplete lineups, its already shown to be highly suspect at an individual level already, as it weighs certain things equally across all 5 players despite the reality not being that

But if you're asking me if Kuminga's defense is below average and hurtful to the team, yes, it is. Actual advanced metrics have JK as below average across the board, though some may him close to neutral? Ones that tend to use DRtg in their formula, funny enough.. the ones that use situational stats and focus on individual defense do not, and the ones that do best at accounting for off-ball defense have him even lower

[GQ Hot Dog]

I understand that this was put into a translation thing, but still its kinda funny And I do understand what I am saying

Kuminga's skillset fit because we needed someone to run at the rim and the defense was already crap, so he didnt make much of a negative impact then. This year the team may have resolved those defensive issues, starting with Melton. So unless Kuminga's defense improves (or the team is still pretty poor overall), then there's absolutely reason to believe our best lineup might not be with JK in it

Kuminga/Wiggs/Green 109.1 drtg
Kuminga/Green 108.3 drtg

Is it crap defence?

One wouldnt be able to tell good defense or bad defense from something as basic as DRtg. Especially one that is only showing percentages of the team - the DRtg thing on the lineups tab isnt very useful, and when it is useful its when its looking at 5 man units. I wasn't aware sites still put that data with pairings or incomplete lineups, its already shown to be highly suspect at an individual level already, as it weighs certain things equally across all 5 players despite the reality not being that

But if you're asking me if Kuminga's defense is below average and hurtful to the team, yes, it is. Actual advanced metrics have JK as below average across the board, though some may him close to neutral? Ones that tend to use DRtg in their formula, funny enough.. the ones that use situational stats and focus on individual defense do not, and the ones that do best at accounting for off-ball defense have him even lower

I rewatched all the starters minutes, focusing on Kuminga's and TJD's defense while on the floor together. TJD was a much bigger problem having to deal with Zu.

Kuminga had one bad closeout that allowed a drive to the rim, but otherwise did his job. Powell had a wild one-handed push shot going to his right that went in in the 1st, but I don't consider that bad defense.

The theme seemed to be that Kuminga did well enough defending in the corners which allowed him to do a good job grabbing boards.

I suspect the starting 5 will be Curry/Melton/Wiggins/Kuminga/Dray to start the season, but Curry/Melton/Kuminga/Dray/Loon might work better.

[SpreeS]

I understand that this was put into a translation thing, but still its kinda funny And I do understand what I am saying

Kuminga's skillset fit because we needed someone to run at the rim and the defense was already crap, so he didnt make much of a negative impact then. This year the team may have resolved those defensive issues, starting with Melton. So unless Kuminga's defense improves (or the team is still pretty poor overall), then there's absolutely reason to believe our best lineup might not be with JK in it

Kuminga/Wiggs/Green 109.1 drtg
Kuminga/Green 108.3 drtg

Is it crap defence?

One wouldnt be able to tell good defense or bad defense from something as basic as DRtg. Especially one that is only showing percentages of the team - the DRtg thing on the lineups tab isnt very useful, and when it is useful its when its looking at 5 man units. I wasn't aware sites still put that data with pairings or incomplete lineups, its already shown to be highly suspect at an individual level already, as it weighs certain things equally across all 5 players despite the reality not being that

But if you're asking me if Kuminga's defense is below average and hurtful to the team, yes, it is. Actual advanced metrics have JK as below average across the board, though some may him close to neutral? Ones that tend to use DRtg in their formula, funny enough.. the ones that use situational stats and focus on individual defense do not, and the ones that do best at accounting for off-ball defense have him even lower

I dont argue that Kuminga is good or avg defender. Maybe is below avg and that is ok. I argue that Green with Kuminga on the floor with other 3 players have good defence and Kuminga was the part of the best units from last year. Drtg is usfull stat for units. The best unit from last year was

PG Curry
SG Klay or Podz (400min)
SF Wiggs
PF Kuminga
C Green

106.7 drtg and +15.3 nrtg

Also Davis started 16 time last year and 11 of them was negative. Kuminga started 46 time and was positive 26 time.

[EvanZ]

Drinking game:

Drink every time the Warriors have 3 non-shooters on the court this season. Not sure I'll make it past game 1 without acquiring liver cirrhosis.

[clyde21]

who starts and who i think should start are two different things

sometimes I don't understand Kerr at all