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Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back)

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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2041 » by tarantism » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:06 pm

ShayDee wrote:
tarantism wrote:This seems to me like moving a strong asset like next year's Minnesota first for pennies on the dollar. Delon Wright could barely get on the court during the playoffs this year. That Minnesota pick could definitely be very high in a stronger draft when our main guys are a year older and possibly coming off of another playoff run. We need to supplement this roster with young talent, I wouldn't just deal these good picks all willy nilly.

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I said our GS 2021 pick not the Minny pick
Oh my mistake. That makes way more sense.

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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2042 » by Warriors Analyst » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:21 pm

tarantism wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
tarantism wrote:Advanced defensive metrics have trouble discerning between individual impact and teammate impact. The Pacers usually had average to good defenders around him.

I'm not saying he's terrible, but he doesn't fit the Warriors need of size, athleticism and rim protection on the inside. A big who doesn't bring any of those qualities to the table and still carries a Sabonis-like price tag doesn't feel worth it right now.


He would be better than most of the centers he'd face and be a bigger positive to the Warriors over most centers. Would you be happier with Sabonis and McGee/Whiteside?
Meh. McGee maybe but I'll pass on Whiteside. As far as guys who might get something at or below MLE level, I wouldn't mind Biyombo, Favors or maybe Henson. Mason Plumlee doesn't do much to protect the rim but at least he hustles and tries to rebound, and can make some plays on offense.

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Henson is a twig that won't be of any use against bigger C's, but he's a solid shot blocker and in his 30 or so games he played under Bud, he showed a legitimate 3 point shot. I think he's probably the best C available amongst the vet min guys.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2043 » by Warriors Analyst » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:27 pm

zimpy27 wrote:
ShayDee wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:
Klay, Warren, Green
Where are your wing defenders prior to this trade?
You will also have an MLE for a guy like Jones Jr if you want. What was your plan for wing defenders?


The wing defender was Wiggins and the MLE target. Warren is a sever downgrade and he is not defending anyone


:-?
Ok well, our evaluation of players seems quite opposite. So I understand why you don't like the trade. I have Warren as quite a bit better than Wiggins.


Yeah I think a lot of people here have convinced themselves that our 12 game sample size of Wiggins holds more promise than it showed. In a vacuum, yes, Wiggins does have more potential than Warren, but I'm inclined to believe that Warren is a more consistent and valuable player over the next few years. We have two years of numbers that show he's a legitimate 40% three point shooter, he's big enough that he can moonlight at the 4 some, and he's probably a more useful defender than Wiggins against bigger guys.

The hope with Wiggins is that he play the role that Klay did for a long time on defense and chase around smaller wings, which is a good way to use his athleticism and minimize his sluggishness and inattentiveness as off-ball defender. I'm sympathetic to the argument that someone like Wiggins in his ideal form who can chase around the small guys is more valuable than a Warren type on defense, but yeah, I don't buy it. Warren is a legitimately good player, he'd fit really well here, and that's not even taking into account getting Turner back.

This deal is pretty great for the Warriors.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2044 » by zimpy27 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:52 pm

Warriors Analyst wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:
ShayDee wrote:
The wing defender was Wiggins and the MLE target. Warren is a sever downgrade and he is not defending anyone


:-?
Ok well, our evaluation of players seems quite opposite. So I understand why you don't like the trade. I have Warren as quite a bit better than Wiggins.


Yeah I think a lot of people here have convinced themselves that our 12 game sample size of Wiggins holds more promise than it showed. In a vacuum, yes, Wiggins does have more potential than Warren, but I'm inclined to believe that Warren is a more consistent and valuable player over the next few years. We have two years of numbers that show he's a legitimate 40% three point shooter, he's big enough that he can moonlight at the 4 some, and he's probably a more useful defender than Wiggins against bigger guys.

The hope with Wiggins is that he play the role that Klay did for a long time on defense and chase around smaller wings, which is a good way to use his athleticism and minimize his sluggishness and inattentiveness as off-ball defender. I'm sympathetic to the argument that someone like Wiggins in his ideal form who can chase around the small guys is more valuable than a Warren type on defense, but yeah, I don't buy it. Warren is a legitimately good player, he'd fit really well here, and that's not even taking into account getting Turner back.

This deal is pretty great for the Warriors.


Yeah I think if LaMelo falls to pick 2 then this trade (or some similar iteration around Turner/Warren) will get done. It makes too much sense for both teams considering D'Antoni will likely coach Indy with LaMelo as his PG with Sabonis. I guess Brogdon could be a piece to be traded to GSW instead of Warren.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2045 » by TB » Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:49 pm

zimpy27 wrote:GSW gets: Turner, Warren, Lamb, McConnell

Indy gets: Wiggins, pick 2, 2021 MIN FRP, TPE 17m (used on Warren + McConnell)


PG: Curry | McConnell | Bowman
SG: Klay | Lee | Poole | Mulder
SF: Warren | Lamb | Toscano
PF: Green | Paschall | Smailagic
C : Turner | Looney


This definitely makes the Warriors better this year. And the MLE could still be used on a rotation player like Crowder, Harkless, Jones Jr, etc.

I have scenarios i'd prefer over this, and i'd be really worried about what the #2 and Minny pick turn into considering we are only getting 2 above average starters and a couple bench players in return.... but at least it's something I could talk myself into and there is no denying it locks in a roster that can compete for a title if healthy.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2046 » by Little Digger » Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:50 pm

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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2047 » by vagelis » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:14 pm

Every day there is a different trade suggestion for Wiggins. But he may stay with Warriors. He can contribute in offense and defense

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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2048 » by ILOVEIT » Thu Oct 15, 2020 12:14 am

vagelis wrote:Every day there is a different trade suggestion for Wiggins. But he may stay with Warriors. He can contribute in offense and defense



At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2049 » by Onus » Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:00 am

Little Digger wrote:
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WTF is this ****. They trade 2 2nds for Drummond and next they trade drummond for Wiggins and a 1st. This is hilariously bad
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2050 » by Onus » Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:09 am

ILOVEIT wrote:
vagelis wrote:Every day there is a different trade suggestion for Wiggins. But he may stay with Warriors. He can contribute in offense and defense



At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.


Wiggins is going to be our best on ball defender.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2051 » by Little Digger » Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:54 am

Don’t get me wrong..I love Wiggins on the warriors..just trying to keep this board hopping
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2052 » by ILOVEIT » Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:25 pm

Little Digger wrote:Don’t get me wrong..I love Wiggins on the warriors..just trying to keep this board hopping


LOL...I know...

Please...please...let it be draft day...please!
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2053 » by cpower » Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:05 am

Onus wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:
vagelis wrote:Every day there is a different trade suggestion for Wiggins. But he may stay with Warriors. He can contribute in offense and defense



At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.


Wiggins is going to be our best on ball defender.

if Wiggins is our best on ball defender we probably wont make PS.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2054 » by Mambomuziki » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:02 am

If we were to Trade down with SAS for #11 and some of their young and coming talents, who would you guys like?
1. Pick at #11
2. Young talent from SAS
3. SRP swaps #41 and #51?



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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2055 » by ShayDee » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:48 am

Mambomuziki wrote:If we were to Trade down with SAS for #11 and some of their young and coming talents, who would you guys like?
1. Pick at #11
2. Young talent from SAS
3. SRP swaps #41 and #51?



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I've been thinking about this. Murray sounds omehow appealing but. He cost too much for a backup and he wil lnot be in the death lineup. So it will be between Derrick White and Lonnie Walker.

Honestly I don't know if I like moving to 11. We miss out on all the prospect and the trade doesn't really make us better. Lacob looking to cut cost is really turning me away and Wiggons contract being a huge poison pill is also making me more frustrated with the way Myers has been handling the team for 2 years

Only way it is worth trading down with spurs is if they give us a 2021 pick + Derrick White/Murray and we draft Desmond Bane at 11

Why do the Warriors FO not like Wiseman, I literally do not understand, this small ball/versatility stuff has ruined our team building for these year and now they want to continue with this philosophy. We do not have Durant and Iggy anymore. Small ball will not work against the lakers with any guy we bring in
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2056 » by whatisacenter » Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:00 am

Onus wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:
vagelis wrote:Every day there is a different trade suggestion for Wiggins. But he may stay with Warriors. He can contribute in offense and defense



At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.


Wiggins is going to be our best on ball defender.



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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2057 » by ChuckDurn » Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:07 am

ShayDee wrote:
Mambomuziki wrote:If we were to Trade down with SAS for #11 and some of their young and coming talents, who would you guys like?
1. Pick at #11
2. Young talent from SAS
3. SRP swaps #41 and #51?



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I've been thinking about this. Murray sounds omehow appealing but. He cost too much for a backup and he wil lnot be in the death lineup. So it will be between Derrick White and Lonnie Walker.

Honestly I don't know if I like moving to 11. We miss out on all the prospect and the trade doesn't really make us better. Lacob looking to cut cost is really turning me away and Wiggons contract being a huge poison pill is also making me more frustrated with the way Myers has been handling the team for 2 years

Only way it is worth trading down with spurs is if they give us a 2021 pick + Derrick White/Murray and we draft Desmond Bane at 11

Why do the Warriors FO not like Wiseman, I literally do not understand, this small ball/versatility stuff has ruined our team building for these year and now they want to continue with this philosophy. We do not have Durant and Iggy anymore. Small ball will not work against the lakers with any guy we bring in

Honestly, with the #2 pick, I fully expect the Warriors to be getting a guy - either the draft pick himself, or somebody coming back in a trade - who I think has All-NBA potential. Maybe they won’t realize that potential, but at least the upside is there. And I don’t see anybody on the San Antonio roster who even has that potential. So this would be a deal of trading quality for quantity, no matter how I look at it, so I don’t really see a way to do a direct trade with the Spurs that makes sense and includes the #2 pick.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2058 » by Warriorfan » Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:28 am

I think the GS deal will be lowest #2 pick for player TPE filler.

Trade down NY for #8, Mitchell Robinson future pick.

TPE say James Johnson ,Looney ,Poole ,Paschall Robinson #8 for a star like Embuid
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2059 » by Coxy » Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:37 am

whatisacenter wrote:
Onus wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:
At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.


Wiggins is going to be our best on ball defender.



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I think AW will be even better than Klay on ball. I’m stupidly optimistic about Andrews defensive ability. I actually believe it could end up his best asset as a player.
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Re: Trade Thread (TRADE WARS EPISODE V: The Empire Strikes Back) 

Post#2060 » by Onus » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:18 pm

whatisacenter wrote:
Onus wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:
At .27 into the video...IMHO...that is the entire game of the NBA right now.

Now imagine Wiggins and Draymond attacking those switches and turning over the opposition :)

Who can put their opponents big guy on an island in switching at the top of the key.

Wiggins is going to be a huge value at that switching defensive rotation. He, like Draymond, can hold his own against any big guy in the league.

On the other hand, that same big guy is going to get eaten alive on the other side of the floor.....Wiggins and Warriors small ball will destroy that action.

Warriors are going to keep Wiggins....they see it.


Wiggins is going to be our best on ball defender.



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Klay is a solid on ball defender but he doesn’t make any defensive plays on the ball. He doesn’t get steals he doesn’t block shots. AW does that, his length allows him to actually block shots and get steals while defending on the ball and that’s why I think he’ll be our best on ball defender.

Klay isn’t an elite defender, he tries hard and is able to stay in front of people and keep his body on them. He’s also strong enough to switch on to just about anyone, his versatility is special. He was really improving in 2019 and was probably our best defender on kawhi because he wasn’t getting pushed around. Which is good because he’s a solid defender.
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