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WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1

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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1721 » by and1GS » Wed Jun 9, 2021 7:51 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:The funny thing for me is that the issue was, in some part, the expectations unrealistic fans had that Wiseman would somehow be the INCREDIBLY rare teenage big who contributes as a rookie to a winning team.


If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1722 » by EvanZ » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:01 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:The funny thing for me is that the issue was, in some part, the expectations unrealistic fans had that Wiseman would somehow be the INCREDIBLY rare teenage big who contributes as a rookie to a winning team.


If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


LMAO exactly

We were told Wiseman was the better fit than Melo. Not only did he turn out to be a much much worse fit, he's not even ready to play.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1723 » by WarriorGM » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:01 pm

and1GS wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:The funny thing for me is that the issue was, in some part, the expectations unrealistic fans had that Wiseman would somehow be the INCREDIBLY rare teenage big who contributes as a rookie to a winning team.


If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?


The Bucks didn't have an all-time great in win now mode with a closing window at the time.

I do not fault picking Wiseman if it was thought there was a reasonable chance he could contribute in the first year. But if it was expected that he wouldn't then that is clearly a mistake that the front office should be excoriated for. If they thought someone like Haliburton was in a better position to contribute immediately and they didn't choose him because Wiseman would be better in the future, the entire front office needs to be replaced.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1724 » by EvanZ » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:19 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
and1GS wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?


The Bucks didn't have an all-time great in win now mode with a closing window at the time.

I do not fault picking Wiseman if it was thought there was a reasonable chance he could contribute in the first year. But if it was expected that he wouldn't then that is clearly a mistake that the front office should be excoriated for. If they thought someone like Haliburton was in a better position to contribute immediately and they didn't choose him because Wiseman would be better in the future, the entire front office needs to be replaced.


Even in that case you trade down and take Haliburton and pick up another asset. Easy peasy.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1725 » by whatisacenter » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:34 pm

EvanZ wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
and1GS wrote:
Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?


The Bucks didn't have an all-time great in win now mode with a closing window at the time.

I do not fault picking Wiseman if it was thought there was a reasonable chance he could contribute in the first year. But if it was expected that he wouldn't then that is clearly a mistake that the front office should be excoriated for. If they thought someone like Haliburton was in a better position to contribute immediately and they didn't choose him because Wiseman would be better in the future, the entire front office needs to be replaced.


Even in that case you trade down and take Haliburton and pick up another asset. Easy peasy.


the Warriors and the Wolves were on the record saying that they were open for business at the top of the draft and there were no takers so maybe not so easy peasy.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1726 » by ILOVEIT » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:43 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
and1GS wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?


The Bucks didn't have an all-time great in win now mode with a closing window at the time.

I do not fault picking Wiseman if it was thought there was a reasonable chance he could contribute in the first year. But if it was expected that he wouldn't then that is clearly a mistake that the front office should be excoriated for. If they thought someone like Haliburton was in a better position to contribute immediately and they didn't choose him because Wiseman would be better in the future, the entire front office needs to be replaced.


I don't regret the Warriors not drafting Ball. He represents the wrong attitude towards championship hoops.

Wiseman will be great in a few years...I have little doubt about that.

For me it's all about the time it takes for him to develop.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1727 » by Old_Blue » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:47 pm

We live in an era of rampant self-delusion. Before he was drafted, it was comical to read the justifications for drafting Wiseman. He's really tall! His hands are enormous! He's really smart - he even speaks Mandarin! That was all just so much schlock. What mattered more than anything else was that the kid had a college career that lasted three games. He's raw. He's immature. And, worst of all, his decision making leaves a great deal to be desired. As such, anyone who thought Wiseman was going to contribute immediately was drunk on Kool-Aid. That's in the past though. Going forward, what we're looking at is a long-term project that may or may not pan out. Expectations for 2022 should be set low so as to avoid further disappointment.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1728 » by shazam_guy » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:54 pm

Who thought Wiseman was going to contribute in a big way immediately? Seriously, just find me the people who said that and I'll join you in scoffing at them (now with added hindsight!) But I don't remember that being part of the discussion at all. It was always about drafting him for long-term upside versus drafting someone else with more immediate value, which usually involved trading down. But as someone else very usefully pointed out, nobody seemed to want the Warriors (or Minnesota's, or Charlotte's) draft choice.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1729 » by EvanZ » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:03 pm

ILOVEIT wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
and1GS wrote:
Why draft Giannis in the first place if he isn't a superstar in year one?


The Bucks didn't have an all-time great in win now mode with a closing window at the time.

I do not fault picking Wiseman if it was thought there was a reasonable chance he could contribute in the first year. But if it was expected that he wouldn't then that is clearly a mistake that the front office should be excoriated for. If they thought someone like Haliburton was in a better position to contribute immediately and they didn't choose him because Wiseman would be better in the future, the entire front office needs to be replaced.


I don't regret the Warriors not drafting Ball. He represents the wrong attitude towards championship hoops.



LMAO :lol:
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1730 » by EvanZ » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:04 pm

ILOVEIT wrote:Wiseman will be great in a few years...I have little doubt about that.

For me it's all about the time it takes for him to develop.


THERE IS NO TIME
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1731 » by xdrta+ » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:00 pm

EvanZ wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:Wiseman will be great in a few years...I have little doubt about that.

For me it's all about the time it takes for him to develop.


THERE IS NO TIME


So many in panic mode.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1732 » by EvanZ » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:24 am

xdrta+ wrote:
EvanZ wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:Wiseman will be great in a few years...I have little doubt about that.

For me it's all about the time it takes for him to develop.


THERE IS NO TIME


So many in panic mode.



Dude, wtf. This *is* exactly the time to panic. :lol:

How many years do you think Steph has in him like last year? My god people, wisen up. Wiseman out.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1733 » by GSWFan1994 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:41 am

Old_Blue wrote:We live in an era of rampant self-delusion. Before he was drafted, it was comical to read the justifications for drafting Wiseman. He's really tall! His hands are enormous! He's really smart - he even speaks Mandarin! That was all just so much schlock. What mattered more than anything else was that the kid had a college career that lasted three games. He's raw. He's immature. And, worst of all, his decision making leaves a great deal to be desired. As such, anyone who thought Wiseman was going to contribute immediately was drunk on Kool-Aid. That's in the past though. Going forward, what we're looking at is a long-term project that may or may not pan out. Expectations for 2022 should be set low so as to avoid further disappointment.


Nice try, OB!

You've been really stepping your game up lately!
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1734 » by GSWFan1994 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:42 am

EvanZ wrote:
ILOVEIT wrote:Wiseman will be great in a few years...I have little doubt about that.

For me it's all about the time it takes for him to develop.


THERE IS NO TIME


Is there a 3rd person tweet by yourself who certifies this affirmation?
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1735 » by Scoots1994 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:10 am

WarriorGM wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:The funny thing for me is that the issue was, in some part, the expectations unrealistic fans had that Wiseman would somehow be the INCREDIBLY rare teenage big who contributes as a rookie to a winning team.


If that wasn't a possibility why draft him in the first place?


Because Warriors ownership, coaching, and the front office have all said they want the team to be good beyond this core groups time and they felt Wiseman was the best value for the long term.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1736 » by Scoots1994 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:15 am

shazam_guy wrote:Who thought Wiseman was going to contribute in a big way immediately? Seriously, just find me the people who said that and I'll join you in scoffing at them (now with added hindsight!) But I don't remember that being part of the discussion at all. It was always about drafting him for long-term upside versus drafting someone else with more immediate value, which usually involved trading down. But as someone else very usefully pointed out, nobody seemed to want the Warriors (or Minnesota's, or Charlotte's) draft choice.


Someone must be able to point to the long line of teenage bigs who were dominant as rookies. I mean, since everyone was SURE Wiseman was going to do it it MUST be common.

Myers and Kerr both said straight up that it was going to take him time to develop.

It was clear the Warriors were aiming to not be in the top 10 teams to keep their pick.

Had there been no Covid and had he been healthy the naysayers would still hate him even with much better numbers if the Warriors didn't make the playoffs.

The Warriors are not in win now mode. The delusional ones are the people thinking they are.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1737 » by Onus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:49 pm

Scoots1994 wrote:
shazam_guy wrote:Who thought Wiseman was going to contribute in a big way immediately? Seriously, just find me the people who said that and I'll join you in scoffing at them (now with added hindsight!) But I don't remember that being part of the discussion at all. It was always about drafting him for long-term upside versus drafting someone else with more immediate value, which usually involved trading down. But as someone else very usefully pointed out, nobody seemed to want the Warriors (or Minnesota's, or Charlotte's) draft choice.


Someone must be able to point to the long line of teenage bigs who were dominant as rookies. I mean, since everyone was SURE Wiseman was going to do it it MUST be common.

Myers and Kerr both said straight up that it was going to take him time to develop.

It was clear the Warriors were aiming to not be in the top 10 teams to keep their pick.

Had there been no Covid and had he been healthy the naysayers would still hate him even with much better numbers if the Warriors didn't make the playoffs.

The Warriors are not in win now mode. The delusional ones are the people thinking they are.

If we're not in win now mode with the highest ever payroll in league history, WTF are we doing?
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1738 » by EvanZ » Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:57 pm

Scoots1994 wrote:
The Warriors are not in win now mode. The delusional ones are the people thinking they are.


I mean...you are just trolling at this point buddy. :lol:
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1739 » by superunknown » Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:57 pm

Onus wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
shazam_guy wrote:Who thought Wiseman was going to contribute in a big way immediately? Seriously, just find me the people who said that and I'll join you in scoffing at them (now with added hindsight!) But I don't remember that being part of the discussion at all. It was always about drafting him for long-term upside versus drafting someone else with more immediate value, which usually involved trading down. But as someone else very usefully pointed out, nobody seemed to want the Warriors (or Minnesota's, or Charlotte's) draft choice.


Someone must be able to point to the long line of teenage bigs who were dominant as rookies. I mean, since everyone was SURE Wiseman was going to do it it MUST be common.

Myers and Kerr both said straight up that it was going to take him time to develop.

It was clear the Warriors were aiming to not be in the top 10 teams to keep their pick.

Had there been no Covid and had he been healthy the naysayers would still hate him even with much better numbers if the Warriors didn't make the playoffs.

The Warriors are not in win now mode. The delusional ones are the people thinking they are.

If we're not in win now mode with the highest ever payroll in league history, WTF are we doing?


that's a very good question.
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Re: WISEMAN EXPECTATIONS: Year 1 

Post#1740 » by FNQ » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:49 pm

superunknown wrote:
Onus wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
Someone must be able to point to the long line of teenage bigs who were dominant as rookies. I mean, since everyone was SURE Wiseman was going to do it it MUST be common.

Myers and Kerr both said straight up that it was going to take him time to develop.

It was clear the Warriors were aiming to not be in the top 10 teams to keep their pick.

Had there been no Covid and had he been healthy the naysayers would still hate him even with much better numbers if the Warriors didn't make the playoffs.

The Warriors are not in win now mode. The delusional ones are the people thinking they are.

If we're not in win now mode with the highest ever payroll in league history, WTF are we doing?


that's a very good question.


Its flat out not true. Trying to imply it is revisionist history, pretending that the FO knew exactly what Wiseman was and knowing it would take years for him to become a positive player. Meanwhile Kerr even said he wasnt as far along as they thought.

And you don't pay close to 70M in cash for one season of Kelly Oubre when you are playing both sides.

This is one person trying to pretend that their initial take of "you can win now and later" as legitimate, but its not. Or, if by some wacky reason they are correct, than Joey Lightyears/Bob Myers has created a vacuum of utter ignorance/conceit in thinking they can just run the NBA going forward. Whoops.

Either way the concept is barely worth the bytes it takes to type it out.

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