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After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys.

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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#21 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 1:21 pm

and1GS wrote:I can't imagine any ring chasers would want to join a big question mark like the warriors. The only exception would be if they came in as a starter and could build their value for the following season.


I think that pushed a bunch of ring chasers away last year too. They look at the Warriors and see that they are not going to start at 1 or 4 and they had just used a top 3 pick on 5 and 2/3 was almost certainly filled by Wiggins. Not a lot of starting spots available. Now with Klay back hopefully there is even less space.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#22 » by EvanZ » Fri May 28, 2021 1:40 pm

The FO is very limited as to what they can do, whether they want to or not. We are over the cap, so obviously we can't sign any free agents other than vet min or maybe the MLE. The only way to bring back any sizable contracts is to trade Wiggins or S&T Oubre.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#23 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 2:03 pm

EvanZ wrote:The FO is very limited as to what they can do, whether they want to or not. We are over the cap, so obviously we can't sign any free agents other than vet min or maybe the MLE. The only way to bring back any sizable contracts is to trade Wiggins or S&T Oubre.


Strictly speaking they could trade other players out too not just Wiggins, but you are right. The Warriors have the TPMLE and essentially nothing more than vet min deals.

Oubre is expecting $20M for 4 years so I don't know who out there is looking for that, but my guess is the Warriors won't want to pay that much tax for any player they could get back so it ends up being a trade exception and maybe a pick for Oubre.

My guess is something like:

Curry
Klay
Wiggins
Green
Olynyk (TPMLE and playing 20ish minutes a night at 5 and some at 4)

Poole
Green (I'm holding out hope for #4, but put Moody in there if you are at #6)
Giddey/Jalen Johnson (#14)
JTA
Wiseman (assuming he develops he gets more run than as a rook)

Paschall
Vet PG/shooter
Loon
Lee
Baze

2-way
Mannion
<unknown>

With Bazemore being a late addition when nobody clearly better is found.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#24 » by Chupchup » Fri May 28, 2021 3:09 pm

Note one reporter said the Warriors will be in repeater tax near year and if they maintain the same payroll , we'll be paying around 400 mil in salary. I'm not a cap expert so I don't know if the 400 mil is accurate or not. This is from the Meyers interview a few threads down.

So which is pretty much why I think they'll trade Wiggins and/or Wiseman. For Wiseman trade, it likely depends if we hit on the Minny pick or not. I don't see how they can develop Wiseman AND 2 more 1st round picks on a roster expecting to contend. There are not enough development minutes on the court for that. I would love it if we can get Cade for Wiseman, Minny pick and our 14th pick. I would put in more assets if needed too.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#25 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 3:54 pm

Chupchup wrote:Note one reporter said the Warriors will be in repeater tax near year and if they maintain the same payroll , we'll be paying around 400 mil in salary. I'm not a cap expert so I don't know if the 400 mil is accurate or not. This is from the Meyers interview a few threads down.

So which is pretty much why I think they'll trade Wiggins and/or Wiseman. For Wiseman trade, it likely depends if we hit on the Minny pick or not. I don't see how they can develop Wiseman AND 2 more 1st round picks on a roster expecting to contend. There are not enough development minutes on the court for that. I would love it if we can get Cade for Wiseman, Minny pick and our 14th pick. I would put in more assets if needed too.


I don't think they are going to dump salary to make the team significantly worse. They are conscious of the extreme cost of contract dollars, but I still think they are going for wins over saving money.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#26 » by and1GS » Fri May 28, 2021 4:47 pm

weekend_warrior wrote:Myers said he will sit with Oubre and talk. To me it sounded like: if he accepts to come of the bench and be paid like a bench player, there is a chance that he could be back. To me that price tag should be around 10m. For this type of salary, we should think of bringing him back to fill 20-25 minutes of the 3 and 4 position. Because we will need a backup wing player of that price range if we have any ambitions. As a result, we might not fill all 3 more expensive salary slots of MLE and both 1st round picks.

But this really comes down to what options are available:
- Would Oubre accept?
- What other veterans could we get for MLE money?
- Where do the draft picks (realistically: The Wolves pick) fall, what can we draft there or what kind of trade would be possible?

I think the first important information is actually where the picks fall and then go from there. I don't expect them to do all that much planning before.
Can we use the MLE if we sign Oubre? I forget how that works.

I agree with the poster who said Oubre as a backup 3/4 would be fine, IF he's signing for about $10m. Put all the hubris talk aside, it would be a massive ego hit for any 26 year old player if they re-signed for 15-20 fewer MPG to play out of position in a role that would likely never yield a bigger contract on the open market

I'm just not sure Oubre, or ANY player, would be ok with that in their prime. However, I saw a breakdown of teams with cap space this summer and there is 0% chance Oubre gets 15m+. There are a few playoff teams, but no way NYK or TOR waste so much on Kelly. That leaves the non contenders as options: OKC, MEM, CHA have enough cap space. OKC literally traded him and I don't see a world where Pop gives Kelly 20.

He will get less wherever he goes, so IMO it is a matter of rehabbing value. I don't think he can do that here.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#27 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 5:11 pm

and1GS wrote:
weekend_warrior wrote:Myers said he will sit with Oubre and talk. To me it sounded like: if he accepts to come of the bench and be paid like a bench player, there is a chance that he could be back. To me that price tag should be around 10m. For this type of salary, we should think of bringing him back to fill 20-25 minutes of the 3 and 4 position. Because we will need a backup wing player of that price range if we have any ambitions. As a result, we might not fill all 3 more expensive salary slots of MLE and both 1st round picks.

But this really comes down to what options are available:
- Would Oubre accept?
- What other veterans could we get for MLE money?
- Where do the draft picks (realistically: The Wolves pick) fall, what can we draft there or what kind of trade would be possible?

I think the first important information is actually where the picks fall and then go from there. I don't expect them to do all that much planning before.
Can we use the MLE if we sign Oubre? I forget how that works.

I agree with the poster who said Oubre as a backup 3/4 would be fine, IF he's signing for about $10m. Put all the hubris talk aside, it would be a massive ego hit for any 26 year old player if they re-signed for 15-20 fewer MPG to play out of position in a role that would likely never yield a bigger contract on the open market

I'm just not sure Oubre, or ANY player, would be ok with that in their prime. However, I saw a breakdown of teams with cap space this summer and there is 0% chance Oubre gets 15m+. There are a few playoff teams, but no way NYK or TOR waste so much on Kelly. That leaves the non contenders as options: OKC, MEM, CHA have enough cap space. OKC literally traded him and I don't see a world where Pop gives Kelly 20.

He will get less wherever he goes, so IMO it is a matter of rehabbing value. I don't think he can do that here.


The Warriors can use the TPMLE even if they sign Oubre. Oubre has already said he expects $20M a year for 4 years. That's more than the Warriors will go for and keep him.

What I don't know about is the rules for the trade value of draft picks. Can the Warriors S&T Oubre for just draft picks and TPE? I think that's what they will try for.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#28 » by azwfan » Fri May 28, 2021 5:40 pm

Scoots1994 wrote:
and1GS wrote:
weekend_warrior wrote:Myers said he will sit with Oubre and talk. To me it sounded like: if he accepts to come of the bench and be paid like a bench player, there is a chance that he could be back. To me that price tag should be around 10m. For this type of salary, we should think of bringing him back to fill 20-25 minutes of the 3 and 4 position. Because we will need a backup wing player of that price range if we have any ambitions. As a result, we might not fill all 3 more expensive salary slots of MLE and both 1st round picks.

But this really comes down to what options are available:
- Would Oubre accept?
- What other veterans could we get for MLE money?
- Where do the draft picks (realistically: The Wolves pick) fall, what can we draft there or what kind of trade would be possible?

I think the first important information is actually where the picks fall and then go from there. I don't expect them to do all that much planning before.
Can we use the MLE if we sign Oubre? I forget how that works.

I agree with the poster who said Oubre as a backup 3/4 would be fine, IF he's signing for about $10m. Put all the hubris talk aside, it would be a massive ego hit for any 26 year old player if they re-signed for 15-20 fewer MPG to play out of position in a role that would likely never yield a bigger contract on the open market

I'm just not sure Oubre, or ANY player, would be ok with that in their prime. However, I saw a breakdown of teams with cap space this summer and there is 0% chance Oubre gets 15m+. There are a few playoff teams, but no way NYK or TOR waste so much on Kelly. That leaves the non contenders as options: OKC, MEM, CHA have enough cap space. OKC literally traded him and I don't see a world where Pop gives Kelly 20.

He will get less wherever he goes, so IMO it is a matter of rehabbing value. I don't think he can do that here.


The Warriors can use the TPMLE even if they sign Oubre. Oubre has already said he expects $20M a year for 4 years. That's more than the Warriors will go for and keep him.

What I don't know about is the rules for the trade value of draft picks. Can the Warriors S&T Oubre for just draft picks and TPE? I think that's what they will try for.

Sure they can, but why would the other team do that? If they have the capspace, they can just sign him into capspace. If they don’t they need to send us some contracts.

I think the best we can hope for is a TPE or maybe some smaller vet contract(s) with future draft assets attached.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#29 » by xdrta+ » Fri May 28, 2021 5:42 pm

Scoots1994 wrote:
and1GS wrote:
weekend_warrior wrote:Myers said he will sit with Oubre and talk. To me it sounded like: if he accepts to come of the bench and be paid like a bench player, there is a chance that he could be back. To me that price tag should be around 10m. For this type of salary, we should think of bringing him back to fill 20-25 minutes of the 3 and 4 position. Because we will need a backup wing player of that price range if we have any ambitions. As a result, we might not fill all 3 more expensive salary slots of MLE and both 1st round picks.

But this really comes down to what options are available:
- Would Oubre accept?
- What other veterans could we get for MLE money?
- Where do the draft picks (realistically: The Wolves pick) fall, what can we draft there or what kind of trade would be possible?

I think the first important information is actually where the picks fall and then go from there. I don't expect them to do all that much planning before.
Can we use the MLE if we sign Oubre? I forget how that works.

I agree with the poster who said Oubre as a backup 3/4 would be fine, IF he's signing for about $10m. Put all the hubris talk aside, it would be a massive ego hit for any 26 year old player if they re-signed for 15-20 fewer MPG to play out of position in a role that would likely never yield a bigger contract on the open market

I'm just not sure Oubre, or ANY player, would be ok with that in their prime. However, I saw a breakdown of teams with cap space this summer and there is 0% chance Oubre gets 15m+. There are a few playoff teams, but no way NYK or TOR waste so much on Kelly. That leaves the non contenders as options: OKC, MEM, CHA have enough cap space. OKC literally traded him and I don't see a world where Pop gives Kelly 20.

He will get less wherever he goes, so IMO it is a matter of rehabbing value. I don't think he can do that here.


The Warriors can use the TPMLE even if they sign Oubre. Oubre has already said he expects $20M a year for 4 years. That's more than the Warriors will go for and keep him.

What I don't know about is the rules for the trade value of draft picks. Can the Warriors S&T Oubre for just draft picks and TPE? I think that's what they will try for.


They could if they could find a willing team and Oubre agreed. But a team would have to have cap space or an exception to fit his salary in, and if they have cap space they could simply sign him directly and keep their draft picks. IMO, converting his salary to a trade exception is highly unlikely.

Edit: You asked about draft picks, draft picks have $0 value for salary matching in a trade.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#30 » by wco81 » Fri May 28, 2021 6:17 pm

Even a 1-year prove-it deal for Oubre doesn't make sense.

Sure he could be an expiring asset for a team. But it doesn't appear like there was big demand for KO at the trade deadline this year so why would it be any different?

Team won more when he didn't play, other than a few games here and there where he got hot.

He wants to be a starter but the market will determine if any team is willing to commit starter money to him for long-term.

There's a good chance he's seen as a bench player around the league, maybe with the chance to become instant offense guy like Lou Williams or Clarkson, who are both better shooters and ball handlers than he is.

So other than a sign and trade for a big time player, I wouldn't re-sign KO.

Maybe the one opportunity is if some of these teams have huge disappointments and are looking to make big moves. For instance, the Clippers. Indy is a team in turmoil. They may fire their coach, who they hired just last year after firing McMillan, who's likely to get the Hawks job. But the Pacers may think they didn't have Warren or Turner or LeVert for the play-in game so they may run it back without making big roster changes but with a new coach.

Boston probably may be open to making moves but they're trying to dump Kemba or Smart, not really give up assets.

Blazers are likely to fall short but they may stubbornly stick with Dame and CJ.

Heat if they get swept will probably look to land a big free agent but unless Kawhi signs with them, they're kind of in the lower end of the EC.

Wizards were getting hopeful but if they get swept, maybe Beal will ask for trade.

Bulls made big moves at the trade deadline but they didn't even make the play in and now they're looking at having to max out Lavine.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#31 » by gst8 » Fri May 28, 2021 7:09 pm

Impuniti wrote:
gst8 wrote:Seemed to me like they are really counting on the ring chasers coming for cheap. I don’t know who those guys are but I think we’ll be a popular destination for whoever fits in that category.

Well it would have been nice if the team made the playoffs to actually attract the right players. That would have been a great enough incentive, even though 1/3rd of the people on here wanted a tank season.

Team needs 2 quality level vets, and 2 quality/reliable shooters along with Klay for next season. Even if that means 1 of the vets is a quality shooter. It's a bit scary, but lets see what Bob does this offseason.


I don't think FAs will draw much distinction between us and a first round and out team. My guess is we'll get looked at as a low seed playoff team that is a couple of key additions away from competing. After the backlash over ring chasing the past couple of years I actually think we'll be a more attractive option than a presumptive favorite. Again, I don't really know who these players are but I like our chances should they exist. Meyers was even low key flexing the "we do right by our players after they're done playing" card as well.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#32 » by weekend_warrior » Fri May 28, 2021 7:42 pm

One player that comes to mind when gauging the potential market value of Oubre could be Kuzma. Kuzma is the more polished offensive player, but worse defensively. They have quite comparable numbers, are at a similar age and (should be) play(ing) similar roles for competitive teams.

Kuzma will make 13m next season. I do think this is a realistic comparison and should serve as GSW's limit in any negotiation.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#33 » by cpower » Fri May 28, 2021 8:08 pm

weekend_warrior wrote:One player that comes to mind when gauging the potential market value of Oubre could be Kuzma. Kuzma is the more polished offensive player, but worse defensively. They have quite comparable numbers, are at a similar age and (should be) play(ing) similar roles for competitive teams.

Kuzma will make 13m next season. I do think this is a realistic comparison and should serve as GSW's limit in any negotiation.

come on now, neither of them is a good defender. Kuz actually played more defense in the PS and his height advantage cannot be ignored.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#34 » by weekend_warrior » Fri May 28, 2021 8:19 pm

Kuzma measured about 2" more in height at the combine while Oubre has 2" more of wingspan. I don't see this comparison in the advantage of Kuzma. Oubre is also more athletic and more active on the defensive end. He tends to lose focus from time to time, but Kuzma really doesn't play much defense at all.

There is really no argument here for me. And more generally, no reason to always throw the own players under the bus just for the sake of being a critic. Leave this to the pundits in the TV who have to earn money with it.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#35 » by jaymo123 » Fri May 28, 2021 9:38 pm

The 2 best playmaking point guards to back up Steph on the cheap are Ish Smith & TJ McConnell. Those two can run the second unit and playmake for others. Only problem is their lack of shooting.

The best big man that fits Myers talking points is Marc Gasol because he would be cheaper than Lopez and Theiss on the open market. Those 3 are the best options for guys who shoot well and play defense at an above average level.

Another option could be doing a sign-and-trade with Oubre and/or trade other players to get the pieces they need.

Players I would look at if I'm the Dubs are Myles Turner or Al Horford. Both are above average defenders who can shoot. If Horfort is bought out, he could be capable back up to Wiseman. If the dubs trade Wiseman, I believe the only trade that makes sense is for Myles Turner.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#36 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 9:53 pm

xdrta+ wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
and1GS wrote:Can we use the MLE if we sign Oubre? I forget how that works.

I agree with the poster who said Oubre as a backup 3/4 would be fine, IF he's signing for about $10m. Put all the hubris talk aside, it would be a massive ego hit for any 26 year old player if they re-signed for 15-20 fewer MPG to play out of position in a role that would likely never yield a bigger contract on the open market

I'm just not sure Oubre, or ANY player, would be ok with that in their prime. However, I saw a breakdown of teams with cap space this summer and there is 0% chance Oubre gets 15m+. There are a few playoff teams, but no way NYK or TOR waste so much on Kelly. That leaves the non contenders as options: OKC, MEM, CHA have enough cap space. OKC literally traded him and I don't see a world where Pop gives Kelly 20.

He will get less wherever he goes, so IMO it is a matter of rehabbing value. I don't think he can do that here.


The Warriors can use the TPMLE even if they sign Oubre. Oubre has already said he expects $20M a year for 4 years. That's more than the Warriors will go for and keep him.

What I don't know about is the rules for the trade value of draft picks. Can the Warriors S&T Oubre for just draft picks and TPE? I think that's what they will try for.


They could if they could find a willing team and Oubre agreed. But a team would have to have cap space or an exception to fit his salary in, and if they have cap space they could simply sign him directly and keep their draft picks. IMO, converting his salary to a trade exception is highly unlikely.

Edit: You asked about draft picks, draft picks have $0 value for salary matching in a trade.


There is an advantage to the player in a sign and trade in year to year raises and length of contract though right?
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#37 » by xdrta+ » Fri May 28, 2021 10:00 pm

Scoots1994 wrote:
xdrta+ wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
The Warriors can use the TPMLE even if they sign Oubre. Oubre has already said he expects $20M a year for 4 years. That's more than the Warriors will go for and keep him.

What I don't know about is the rules for the trade value of draft picks. Can the Warriors S&T Oubre for just draft picks and TPE? I think that's what they will try for.


They could if they could find a willing team and Oubre agreed. But a team would have to have cap space or an exception to fit his salary in, and if they have cap space they could simply sign him directly and keep their draft picks. IMO, converting his salary to a trade exception is highly unlikely.

Edit: You asked about draft picks, draft picks have $0 value for salary matching in a trade.


There is an advantage to the player in a sign and trade in year to year raises and length of contract though right?


No, they can only get the same as if they sign directly with the team. Bird rights don't apply in a S&T, nor do they travel with the player.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#38 » by Scoots1994 » Fri May 28, 2021 11:03 pm

xdrta+ wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
xdrta+ wrote:
They could if they could find a willing team and Oubre agreed. But a team would have to have cap space or an exception to fit his salary in, and if they have cap space they could simply sign him directly and keep their draft picks. IMO, converting his salary to a trade exception is highly unlikely.

Edit: You asked about draft picks, draft picks have $0 value for salary matching in a trade.


There is an advantage to the player in a sign and trade in year to year raises and length of contract though right?


No, they can only get the same as if they sign directly with the team. Bird rights don't apply in a S&T, nor do they travel with the player.


I thought the "home" team could offer greater raises per year. Okay.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#39 » by xdrta+ » Sat May 29, 2021 12:14 am

Scoots1994 wrote:
xdrta+ wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
There is an advantage to the player in a sign and trade in year to year raises and length of contract though right?


No, they can only get the same as if they sign directly with the team. Bird rights don't apply in a S&T, nor do they travel with the player.


I thought the "home" team could offer greater raises per year. Okay.


There's logic behind this rule. A S&T is considered a single transaction (if the trade isn't completed within 48 hours, the contract is void) so the contract is actually with the new team. Since the new team could only sign a FA to a normal contract, up to 4 years, 5% raises, that's the limit on this contract.

If the FA signed with his original team, with Bird rights, they could offer up to 5 yrs, 8% raises.
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Re: After hearing Myers talk about the payroll, it's clear they're only spending for significant guys. 

Post#40 » by Scoots1994 » Sat May 29, 2021 1:50 am

xdrta+ wrote:
Scoots1994 wrote:
xdrta+ wrote:
No, they can only get the same as if they sign directly with the team. Bird rights don't apply in a S&T, nor do they travel with the player.


I thought the "home" team could offer greater raises per year. Okay.


There's logic behind this rule. A S&T is considered a single transaction (if the trade isn't completed within 48 hours, the contract is void) so the contract is actually with the new team. Since the new team could only sign a FA to a normal contract, up to 4 years, 5% raises, that's the limit on this contract.

If the FA signed with his original team, with Bird rights, they could offer up to 5 yrs, 8% raises.


Ahh, I thought the deal was 2 things ... a signing and a trade. That is interesting. Always good to learn something new.

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