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Draymond/Simmons frontcourt

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Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#1 » by Kuya » Thu Sep 2, 2021 3:34 am

We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#2 » by Coxy » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:01 am

I like Simmons at SG, move Klay to PF, Dray to SF, and fake em out with Steph guarding the bigs.

I hate this trade idea so very very much, make it stop.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#3 » by clyde21 » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:28 am

ffs
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#4 » by ChuckDurn » Thu Sep 2, 2021 5:17 am

Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.

I don’t think the trade’s getting a lot of steam.

But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Not saying it’s simple, but the whole “you can’t play 2 guys who don’t space the floor together” is proven inaccurate if it’s the right guys. They’d probably play together for about 16-18 minutes/game, and you could stagger them for the rest of the game.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#5 » by wco81 » Thu Sep 2, 2021 5:23 am

If they want to acquire Simmons, they'd have to ship out Draymond.

I'm not supporting that right now. Yes heart and soul of the team, great chemistry with Curry, can defend 4s and 5s, which probably isn't the case for Simmons.

But what if he had another meltdown, tried to beat up Kerr?

Wouldn't put it past him right?

Both of them are bad fits for each other so you have to trade one for the other.

If it came to that.

It would be a defensible trade, acquiring a young all-NBA player. But for the Warriors roster, it would be better to ship out Draymond to Philly than Wiggins.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#6 » by giberish » Thu Sep 2, 2021 5:32 am

ChuckDurn wrote:
Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.

I don’t think the trade’s getting a lot of steam.

But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Not saying it’s simple, but the whole “you can’t play 2 guys who don’t space the floor together” is proven inaccurate if it’s the right guys. They’d probably play together for about 16-18 minutes/game, and you could stagger them for the rest of the game.


Except you don't want Simmons or Draymond playing mostly at C. And you can't play Simmons/Draymond/Looney together (or Wiseman in place of Looney). If you're running Simmons/Draymond you need a good stretch 5 (and probably a mad bomber SF as a bench option). It would have been tough to rework the lineup around a Simmons/Draymond forward combo if it was done early in the offseason, now it would be impossible.

As I've stated otherwise, the talent upgrade from Wiggins to Simmons would be enough for me to make the trade despite the fit loss but the fit problem would keep me from adding value (I'd probably need to add value in other deals kludging a semi-workable rotation around them).
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#7 » by ILOVEIT » Thu Sep 2, 2021 5:38 am

Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.


Too funny...I just wrote a big post about just that...having Simmons play center and Draymond PF.

Again....Curry, Poole, Klay, Draymond, Simmons....or Curry, Klay, OPJ, Draymond, Simmons....

Watching Draymond, Klay and Simmons absolutely devour guys like Lebron would be sooooo much fun.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#8 » by Yoshi » Thu Sep 2, 2021 5:53 am

giberish wrote:
ChuckDurn wrote:
Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.

I don’t think the trade’s getting a lot of steam.

But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Not saying it’s simple, but the whole “you can’t play 2 guys who don’t space the floor together” is proven inaccurate if it’s the right guys. They’d probably play together for about 16-18 minutes/game, and you could stagger them for the rest of the game.


Except you don't want Simmons or Draymond playing mostly at C. And you can't play Simmons/Draymond/Looney together (or Wiseman in place of Looney). If you're running Simmons/Draymond you need a good stretch 5 (and probably a mad bomber SF as a bench option). It would have been tough to rework the lineup around a Simmons/Draymond forward combo if it was done early in the offseason, now it would be impossible.

As I've stated otherwise, the talent upgrade from Wiggins to Simmons would be enough for me to make the trade despite the fit loss but the fit problem would keep me from adding value (I'd probably need to add value in other deals kludging a semi-workable rotation around them).


Meh, I’m a Philadelphia native and I don’t think the difference between Simmons and Wiggins is all it’s made out to be - Simmons is the better overall player but this guy thinks he’s a super star when he has so many flaws as a player. This guy has been in the league for some time and still can’t shoot past 6 feet from the rim. Hard pass for me
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#9 » by weekend_warrior » Thu Sep 2, 2021 7:20 am

ChuckDurn wrote:
Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.

I don’t think the trade’s getting a lot of steam.

But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Not saying it’s simple, but the whole “you can’t play 2 guys who don’t space the floor together” is proven inaccurate if it’s the right guys. They’d probably play together for about 16-18 minutes/game, and you could stagger them for the rest of the game.


This comparison to Looney is a lazy one and it should honestly stop. Looney doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective. His role on offense is to rebound, set picks, do handoffs and finish the occasional lob. He doesn't cut into Draymond's or Steph's game at all. And he really shouldn't.

Could Simmons play like that and give the bench lineup some additional play making? Probably.

But Looney is paid 5 million for this role and Simmons makes 33.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#10 » by Mac1958 » Thu Sep 2, 2021 10:47 am

ChuckDurn wrote:But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Yeah, while I'm not into this idea overall, that's a fair point.

I see the positives here, but one potential negative I'm not seeing much is Simmons' character. That makes me a little nervous, especially on a team with a vibe like this one.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#11 » by lars_rosenberg » Thu Sep 2, 2021 12:06 pm

If Simmons plays center for us, who's guarding him? While he's not stretching the floor, he can't be guarded by a traditional big on the perimeter. He would be a mismatch all the times.
And we know Draymond is very effective against centers, it would be death lineup on offense without the defense liability because Simmons has the size of a center and doesn't force Dray to play the 5.
It may not work right away, but the more I think about it, the more it makes sense.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#12 » by clyde21 » Thu Sep 2, 2021 12:34 pm

ChuckDurn wrote:
Kuya wrote:We can't give up the heart and soul Draymond and it's risky starting for floor spacing if we start both of them together. In my opinion this only works if we start both Dray/Simmons at the 4 and 5 OR if we landed Simmons and a bought out Kevin Love or big floor spacer at the 5.

Otherwise I don't see this trade, that's been getting a lot of steam, working.

I don’t think the trade’s getting a lot of steam.

But a line-up with Draymond and Looney starting has worked just fine, and Looney isn’t exactly a floor-spacer.

Not saying it’s simple, but the whole “you can’t play 2 guys who don’t space the floor together” is proven inaccurate if it’s the right guys. They’d probably play together for about 16-18 minutes/game, and you could stagger them for the rest of the game.


Loon/Dray works offensively because Dray is effectively the PG
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#13 » by svart » Thu Sep 2, 2021 1:29 pm

How about we don't trade for him?

i hate the idea of dray-simmons together on the floor.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#14 » by cdubbz » Thu Sep 2, 2021 3:51 pm

Coxy wrote:I like Simmons at SG, move Klay to PF, Dray to SF, and fake em out with Steph guarding the bigs.

I hate this trade idea so very very much, make it stop.


You're overreacting. Ben Simmons starting as a big isn't that bad versus most lineups.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#15 » by a8bil » Thu Sep 2, 2021 3:59 pm

Under the theory that teams must evolve, why not Dray and Simmons? Everyone seems to want to re-create the old GSW lineup, but the league has adjusted to that lineup and its been replicated by a number of teams, successfully. Why not go to a new rotation that is a defense first squad that plays stellar defense in the paint and relies on some perimeter pressure? The Jazz have shown a defense first mentality can win in the RS, but Gobert gets exposed in the PS. A dray/simmons/looney rotation would not be exposed.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#16 » by parsnips33 » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:02 pm

Draymond can guard most 5s and Simmons can guard most 4s. A little undersize, but we've always been a team that excels playing small.

Is the concern that we'll have too much playmaking offensively?
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#17 » by Mob Byers » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:04 pm

Can't wait for the season to start so the offseason thread die
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#18 » by GunnerWRX » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:12 pm

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I wonder if people saying Draymond can't play with a non-shooter/scorer actually watched any Warriors game at all.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#19 » by xdrta+ » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:28 pm

According to Anthony Slater of the Athletic today, discussion about Simmons with the Warriors amounted to a single phone call before the draft. Morey asked for Andrew Wiggins, James Wiseman, Golden State’s two picks in this year’s lottery and a pair of future first-rounders. The Warriors declined and there has been no further contact about Simmons.

There sure has been a lot of off-season chatter by everyone else, though.
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Re: Draymond/Simmons frontcourt 

Post#20 » by ChuckDurn » Thu Sep 2, 2021 4:30 pm

parsnips33 wrote:Draymond can guard most 5s and Simmons can guard most 4s. A little undersize, but we've always been a team that excels playing small.

Is the concern that we'll have too much playmaking offensively?

While I disagree with some of your takes, this one is spot on.

It's hilarious to me to suggest that having 3 guys on the court together who can create for others (Draymond, Simmons, Curry) is anything other than terrific. We know Draymond is an excellent off-ball screener, I acknowledge that I don't know what skill Simmons may have in that area, but to suggest that our offense is going to suffer because some of the guys "can only work on the ball" is kind of myopic.
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