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The new "second apron"

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The new "second apron" 

Post#1 » by xdrta+ » Tue Apr 25, 2023 5:07 pm

Excerpts from John Hollinger of The Athletic. on the new Second Apron.

The Athletic recently reviewed a copy of the term sheet of the new CBA, and spoke to multiple agents and executives about the league’s proposed changes.

The most notable change is that the new CBA contains a “second apron” set at $17.5 million above the luxury tax (with increases in future years commensurate with any salary cap rise) that places severe restrictions on any team that exceeds it. It also has harsher penalties even for teams that exceed the first apron that has already been in place at $7 million over the tax line, and comparatively lighter financial restrictions than currently in place for teams that merely exceed that tax line up until the apron.

The Clippers and Warriors, I’ll remind, you are both about $40 million above that line this season. More problematically, they are both locked into payrolls that soar just as high above the tax line for 2023-24. The Clippers, in fact, project to be the first team in in NBA history with a payroll above $200 million, while the Warriors could blow well past even that figure if Draymond Green doesn’t leave in free agency. Even in the years beyond, it will be difficult for either to lower payroll much without substantially degrading the roster.

The league is phasing in the new second apron over just a two-year period...

Teams above the second apron will have no midlevel exception, not even the taxpayer MLE of yore. They also may not use cash in trades, cannot trade for more money than is sent out, and will pay tax at a higher rate; for teams in the repeater penalty, that penalty also doubles to a $2-for-$1 additional tax.

... they may not aggregate contracts in trades. That aggregation rule is key, and not just for the Clippers and Warriors. Consider, for instance, that the Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving trades to Phoenix and Dallas, respectively, would have been virtually impossible with those rules … especially since Brooklyn was deep in the tax and was also blocked by the same rules.

....restriction on signing buyout players who had made more than the MLE

...teams will not be able to trade a first-round pick seven years in the future...if those teams stay above the tax apron in more than one of the next four years, the pick gets pushed to the end of the first round in the year in question … regardless of where the team might finish.

While the harshest penalties are reserved for those who exceed the second apron, the NBA’s fangs also came out a bit for teams above the first apron at $7 million above the tax. Those teams will have a more limited taxpayer MLE ($5 million, two-year maximum) than in the past agreement, will have a 100 percent multiplier for trade salaries (in other words, can’t take back more than they send out), and will face the same buyout restrictions as the second apron teams.

The new rules not only clip the wings of the league’s most profligate spenders in general, but also catch the Clippers and Warriors in particular at a time when they are already facing something of a crossroads for their current builds. As much as these teams are facing battles on the court this week, their biggest challenges may yet come off the floor this summer.

The league came after the big spenders with a vengeance.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#2 » by Old_Blue » Tue Apr 25, 2023 5:08 pm

This is relatively old news. It was first reported three weeks ago.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/04/running-list-of-changes-in-nbas-new-collective-bargaining-agreement.html

That said, yes, the "second tax apron" is going to absolutely crush the Warriors. Penciling in Draymond and Klay at $25 million each starting in the 2024-2025 season would already put the Dubs at almost $30 million over the luxury tax cap. And, that doesn't count three or four minimum level contracts and a contract extension for Looney and pay raise for Kuminga the following season. Something's gotta give.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#3 » by xdrta+ » Tue Apr 25, 2023 6:01 pm

Old_Blue wrote:This is relatively old news. It was first reported three weeks ago.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/04/running-list-of-changes-in-nbas-new-collective-bargaining-agreement.html

That said, yes, the "second tax apron" is going to absolutely crush the Warriors. Penciling in Draymond and Klay at $25 million each starting in the 2024-2025 season would already put the Dubs at almost $30 million over the luxury tax cap. And, that doesn't count three or four minimum level contracts and a contract extension for Looney and pay raise for Kuminga the following season. Something's gotta give.


This is more recent--early reports like that one don't mention the aggregation restriction which is crucial, that these restrictions will be eased in over two years, or that the draft pick drops to last if the team is over in one of four years, not two. Btw, another wrinkle to aggregation is that the teams won't be allowed to “aggregate down.” In other words, a team couldn’t trade two players who make $20 million each for one who makes $30 million and one who makes the minimum, even though the net effect would be to lower payroll for a high-spending team.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#4 » by Crazy-Canuck » Tue Apr 25, 2023 6:06 pm

So, to keep steph, klay, and dray together, lacob needs to salary dump poole and/or wiggs? Oof.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#5 » by Twinkie defense » Tue Apr 25, 2023 6:32 pm

Old_Blue wrote:This is relatively old news. It was first reported three weeks ago.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/04/running-list-of-changes-in-nbas-new-collective-bargaining-agreement.html

That said, yes, the "second tax apron" is going to absolutely crush the Warriors. Penciling in Draymond and Klay at $25 million each starting in the 2024-2025 season would already put the Dubs at almost $30 million over the luxury tax cap. And, that doesn't count three or four minimum level contracts and a contract extension for Looney and pay raise for Kuminga the following season. Something's gotta give.

I think this just locks in that next season will be the last dance for Steph, Klay and Dray - and then it's a teardown.

No reason to tear it down this summer though, and not much money for Lacob to save by doing so.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#6 » by Old_Blue » Tue Apr 25, 2023 7:56 pm

Does anyone else find it amusing that some of these draft picks (that are now practically guaranteed to be shoved to the back end of the draft) have already been traded? :D
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#7 » by HiRez » Tue Apr 25, 2023 8:26 pm

Crazy-Canuck wrote:So, to keep steph, klay, and dray together, lacob needs to salary dump poole and/or wiggs? Oof.

Salary-dumping Wiggins would be insane. He's on a very favorable new contract and is arguably the Warriors 2nd best player now. Poole, yeah, I could see it because of the restricted financial space. If every dollar counts that much you really need as many 2-way payers as possible.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#8 » by Coxy » Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:17 pm

HiRez wrote:
Crazy-Canuck wrote:So, to keep steph, klay, and dray together, lacob needs to salary dump poole and/or wiggs? Oof.

Salary-dumping Wiggins would be insane. He's on a very favorable new contract and is arguably the Warriors 2nd best player now. Poole, yeah, I could see it because of the restricted financial space. If every dollar counts that much you really need as many 2-way payers as possible.


Poole has to go.

The trick for Bob (Or new GM), will be trading him without any further assets attached. GM's in the know, will understand that they are receiving a call from our org offering Poole, because we are in financial hell. They'll be licking their lips at the other assets they can try to pry away from us so we don't go broke and have to sell the franchise to Bezos in Seattle.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#9 » by DonaldSanders » Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:27 pm

Coxy wrote:
Poole has to go.

The trick for Bob (Or new GM), will be trading him without any further assets attached. GM's in the know, will understand that they are receiving a call from our org offering Poole, because we are in financial hell. They'll be licking their lips at the other assets they can try to pry away from us so we don't go broke and have to sell the franchise to Bezos in Seattle.



Well it's being phased in over time, so it's possible we could pay a big tax one more year... but after Klay and Dray's contracts are up, we will really need to be somewhere else financially, it doesn't seem possible to keep all these guys. Either Klay and Dray sign team friendly deals, one or more leave, or Poole goes. It's possible we see big movement next year, but the year after certainly is a guarantee.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#10 » by whatisacenter » Tue Apr 25, 2023 10:18 pm

Coxy wrote:
HiRez wrote:
Crazy-Canuck wrote:So, to keep steph, klay, and dray together, lacob needs to salary dump poole and/or wiggs? Oof.

Salary-dumping Wiggins would be insane. He's on a very favorable new contract and is arguably the Warriors 2nd best player now. Poole, yeah, I could see it because of the restricted financial space. If every dollar counts that much you really need as many 2-way payers as possible.


Poole has to go.

The trick for Bob (Or new GM), will be trading him without any further assets attached
. GM's in the know, will understand that they are receiving a call from our org offering Poole, because we are in financial hell. They'll be licking their lips at the other assets they can try to pry away from us so we don't go broke and have to sell the franchise to Bezos in Seattle.


I find this notion to be ridiculous. Poole is 23yo who averaged 20 points while playing every game and having his role changed throughout the season filing in for others. He is an asset on his own if they decide to trade him.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#11 » by Coxy » Tue Apr 25, 2023 10:42 pm

whatisacenter wrote:
Coxy wrote:
HiRez wrote:Salary-dumping Wiggins would be insane. He's on a very favorable new contract and is arguably the Warriors 2nd best player now. Poole, yeah, I could see it because of the restricted financial space. If every dollar counts that much you really need as many 2-way payers as possible.


Poole has to go.

The trick for Bob (Or new GM), will be trading him without any further assets attached
. GM's in the know, will understand that they are receiving a call from our org offering Poole, because we are in financial hell. They'll be licking their lips at the other assets they can try to pry away from us so we don't go broke and have to sell the franchise to Bezos in Seattle.


I find this notion to be ridiculous. Poole is 23yo who averaged 20 points while playing every game and having his role changed throughout the season filing in for others. He is an asset on his own if they decide to trade him.


Awesome, sounds good.

I have also created an elixer that reverses aging, and I'd like you to become my chief worldwide sales rep for it. I call it, "Pooleshine".
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#12 » by KevinMcreynolds » Tue Apr 25, 2023 10:45 pm

bunch of commie horse****
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#13 » by whatisacenter » Tue Apr 25, 2023 10:46 pm

Coxy wrote:
whatisacenter wrote:
Coxy wrote:
Poole has to go.

The trick for Bob (Or new GM), will be trading him without any further assets attached
. GM's in the know, will understand that they are receiving a call from our org offering Poole, because we are in financial hell. They'll be licking their lips at the other assets they can try to pry away from us so we don't go broke and have to sell the franchise to Bezos in Seattle.


I find this notion to be ridiculous. Poole is 23yo who averaged 20 points while playing every game and having his role changed throughout the season filing in for others. He is an asset on his own if they decide to trade him.


Awesome, sounds good.

I have also created an elixer that reverses aging, and I'd like you to become my chief worldwide sales rep for it. I call it, "Pooleshine".


time will tell....I bet if he gets moved that he Is considered a positive asset by the team acquiring him.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#14 » by Twinkie defense » Wed Apr 26, 2023 12:38 am

Poole definitely has value around the League. Question for the Warriors is, is he a guy you can build around? Does he have the right mindset? Can he become a decent defender? If not you probably want to move him.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#15 » by GQ Hot Dog » Wed Apr 26, 2023 1:13 am

KevinMcreynolds wrote:bunch of commie horse****


Lining the pockets of owners who refuse to spend what it takes to build a good product is not communist. Communist would be lowering ticket, concession and merch prices.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#16 » by azwfan » Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:51 am

i think Klay wants too much money for what he provides. Dray too. We need them for the playoffs, but they need everyone else to even get to the playoffs. I highly doubt we make the playoffs this season with no Poole (same record with and without Steph). I think we probably make the playoffs without Dray punching his teammate or Klay chucking for 2 months.

I dont have ill will towards those guys for wanting as much money as they can get, but Klay is already WAY overpaid and wants more. No thanks.

If we dump Poole for salary relief he needs to return someone Kerr is going to play that actually helps us on the court. I dont see that trade unless its for an immediate impact draft pick… all for the right to overpay Klay. Just let Klay expire if he’s not willing to pay according to his production.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#17 » by Dubs 707 » Wed Apr 26, 2023 4:41 am

azwfan wrote:i think Klay wants too much money for what he provides. Dray too. We need them for the playoffs, but they need everyone else to even get to the playoffs. I highly doubt we make the playoffs this season with no Poole (same record with and without Steph). I think we probably make the playoffs without Dray punching his teammate or Klay chucking for 2 months.

I dont have ill will towards those guys for wanting as much money as they can get, but Klay is already WAY overpaid and wants more. No thanks.

If we dump Poole for salary relief he needs to return someone Kerr is going to play that actually helps us on the court. I dont see that trade unless its for an immediate impact draft pick… all for the right to overpay Klay. Just let Klay expire if he’s not willing to pay according to his production.


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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#18 » by Dom801e » Wed Apr 26, 2023 5:42 am

Will be interesting to see how new media deal affects this.
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#19 » by KevinMcreynolds » Wed Apr 26, 2023 12:51 pm

GQ Hot Dog wrote:
KevinMcreynolds wrote:bunch of commie horse****


Lining the pockets of owners who refuse to spend what it takes to build a good product is not communist. Communist would be lowering ticket, concession and merch prices.


No, they’re penalizing successful teams
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Re: The new "second apron" 

Post#20 » by KevinMcreynolds » Wed Apr 26, 2023 12:57 pm

We’re basically being taxed to death because we’ve retained Steph, Klay, and Dray all these years and added JP to the fold. So essentially we’re being taxed and penalized because we’re successful at drafting players. Great system…
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