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Among other things, something that connects Jonathan Kuminga, Moses Moody, Jalen Green and Alperen Sengun is that they were all picked in the same draft of 2021. Jalen Green was picked second, Kuminga seventh, Moody fourteenth, and Sengun sixteenth. As such they offer a pretty reasonable baseline for comparisons.

Green and Sengun have gone on to play starting roles on the Rockets while Kuminga and Moody are mainly playing supporting roles. A big part of this is the presence of Curry and Draymond and their desire as veterans to maintain competitiveness the past few years. That probably deprived Kuminga and Moody of playing time they might have otherwise gotten if the focus was more on development. Jalen and Alperen very likely benefited a lot from the Rockets having more reason to focus on their development.

But that doesn't explain all of it. We see Brandin Podziemski for example pretty quickly finding a starting role in just his first year. Trayce Jackson-Davis got about as many minutes as Moody last year and is not too far behind Kuminga in total minutes granting though Kuminga was out for a while. We also see Kuminga's efficiency numbers regressing markedly.

Something looks off. As much as some around here want to reflexively sweep things under the rug or blame the young players I don't think it is about ability.

I think Curry and Draymond also bear more responsibility. Green and Sengun may have gotten more playing minutes but Kuminga and Moody got more minutes with proven winners. That does not appear to have borne much fruit. I haven't heard about Curry and Draymond taking Kuminga and Moody under their wing as much as I did Curry and Draymond getting along with Ty Jerome. Maybe they saw and felt something? Whatever it was it did not translate to moves. If Kuminga and Moody are not ready now there has been a big strategic mistake because the importance they would have at this moment was foreseeable long long ago.

What I will say is this: with or without Butler, I expect the Warriors to win this series. There should be enough. If they do not, then they bungled it somewhere along the line. It is not because of lack of talent or opportunity.

Imo, green and sengun would both struggle to get minutes on this club. Sengun might grow into a role, but nothing like he is today. Green is a knucklehead that will have his fair share of fans, but he'd be spending more time with lacobs as the chosen one than actual minutes.

Wagner, trey Murphy, and maybe jalen Johnson were the misses. They would get minutes much like podz did.

We have no idea what kind of player JK would be today if he been given the runway his peers have received. He is a rhythm player whose numbers improve with a consistent roll and playing time.

Everyone’s darling, Wagner, is a sub 30% three point shooter that is hitting a scorching 15% from deep in the postseason…

Folks forget how highly Moody was rated in that 2021 draft. At the time, I remember reading that the Dubs gave some consideration to drafting Moody at #7 and were ecstatic when they ended up with him at #14. As for Wagner, I don't rue the Dubs for not drafting him - Since I think Trey Murphy would have been a better overall fit for the team.

Old_Blue wrote:Folks forget how highly Moody was rated in that 2021 draft. At the time, I remember reading that the Dubs gave some consideration to drafting Moody at #7 and were ecstatic when they ended up with him at #14. As for Wagner, I don't rue the Dubs for not drafting him - Since I think Trey Murphy would have been a better overall fit for the team.

yeah I'm all for dunking on the FO but JK/Moody was unanimously a good draft

whatisacenter wrote:We have no idea what kind of player JK would be today if he been given the runway his peers have received. He is a rhythm player whose numbers improve with a consistent roll and playing time.

Everyone’s darling, Wagner, is a sub 30% three point shooter that is hitting a scorching 15% from deep in the postseason…

The thing is Wagner does a lot more than just shoot ...

Onus wrote:

whatisacenter wrote:We have no idea what kind of player JK would be today if he been given the runway his peers have received. He is a rhythm player whose numbers improve with a consistent roll and playing time.

Everyone’s darling, Wagner, is a sub 30% three point shooter that is hitting a scorching 15% from deep in the postseason…

The thing is Wagner does a lot more than just shoot ...

Thank goodness because with all that extra time and roll he has been given he still can’t shoot.

Crazy-Canuck wrote:Imo, green and sengun would both struggle to get minutes on this club. Sengun might grow into a role, but nothing like he is today. Green is a knucklehead that will have his fair share of fans, but he'd be spending more time with lacobs as the chosen one than actual minutes.

Wagner, trey Murphy, and maybe jalen Johnson were the misses. They would get minutes much like podz did.

I disagree about Sengun and Green. We made it work with Poole who is tiers below Green.

We literally run a ton of post ups per game where Sengun can make reads or go and score.

Jalen Green wasn't an option for the Warriors, so I don't know what he has to do with anything.

That said, it's getting tiresome hearing everyone but Kuminga blamed for his lack of development. The head coach isn’t the one working directly with him in practices, and there’s plenty in his game that doesn’t require playing time to improve. Nothing was stopping him from hiring a trainer and focusing on his ball handling, shooting, and other fundamentals during his personal time.

Blaming Draymond or Curry is laughable too. Kuminga isn’t playing because either he lacks the skill, or he hasn’t put in the effort to develop the skills needed to stay on the floor.

An iso player needs to be more efficient than Kuminga is. He's had 4 years to become a more efficient player and it hasn't stuck.by year 4 you'd expect more consistency on offense and defense at this point. Maybe he's a late bloomer, but his trajectory as a complete basketball player isn't looking good right now.

CS707 wrote:Jalen Green wasn't an option for the Warriors, so I don't know what he has to do with anything.

That said, it's getting tiresome hearing everyone but Kuminga blamed for his lack of development. The head coach isn’t the one working directly with him in practices, and there’s plenty in his game that doesn’t require playing time to improve. Nothing was stopping him from hiring a trainer and focusing on his ball handling, shooting, and other fundamentals during his personal time.

Blaming Draymond or Curry is laughable too. Kuminga isn’t playing because either he lacks the skill, or he hasn’t put in the effort to develop the skills needed to stay on the floor.

Jalen Green is mentioned as a comparison to show how far a draft pick from that class could be expected to go.

If it was only Kuminga that has seen stunted development that might indicate more of the blame should fall on Kuminga. But we also saw Moody being held out for equally mystifying reasons.

If Curry and Draymond exit earlier than they want then it will probably be largely because they would have reaped what they sowed. When the decision was made to keep Kuminga and Moody and it looked they'd be on the team for a while it was in Curry's and Draymond's interests to cultivate and develop them for this day. Curry and Draymond should have made it a priority to know how best to play with Kuminga and bring out his best. Did they? I guess we'll see. If the truth is that Curry and Draymond couldn't really have done anything more with them then it's still a management problem for choosing them in the first place.

Does Kuminga lack the skills? His numbers looked much better last year. Did he lose the skills that got him last year's numbers?

WarriorGM wrote:

CS707 wrote:Jalen Green wasn't an option for the Warriors, so I don't know what he has to do with anything.

That said, it's getting tiresome hearing everyone but Kuminga blamed for his lack of development. The head coach isn’t the one working directly with him in practices, and there’s plenty in his game that doesn’t require playing time to improve. Nothing was stopping him from hiring a trainer and focusing on his ball handling, shooting, and other fundamentals during his personal time.

Blaming Draymond or Curry is laughable too. Kuminga isn’t playing because either he lacks the skill, or he hasn’t put in the effort to develop the skills needed to stay on the floor.

Jalen Green is mentioned as a comparison to show how far a draft pick from that class could be expected to go.

If it was only Kuminga that has seen stunted development that might indicate more of the blame should fall on Kuminga. But we also saw Moody being held out for equally mystifying reasons.

If Curry and Draymond exit earlier than they want then it will probably be largely because they would have reaped what they sowed. When the decision was made to keep Kuminga and Moody and it looked they'd be on the team for a while it was in Curry's and Draymond's interests to cultivate and develop them for this day. Curry and Draymond should have made it a priority to know how best to play with Kuminga and bring out his best. Did they? I guess we'll see. If the truth is that Curry and Draymond couldn't really have done anything more with them then it's still a management problem for choosing them in the first place.

Does Kuminga lack the skills? His numbers looked much better last year. Did he lose the skills that got him last year's numbers?

Green and Kuminga’s ceilings have nothing to do with each other. I’m just not making the connection there at all.

Moody getting limited run isn’t really mystifying to me. He’s hadn’t really done anything that entitled him to more minutes. Even now, he’s hot and cold but he’s at least humble enough to try and play within the system and do what’s asked of him.

Kuminga’s issue has always been that he’s isn’t nearly as good as he thinks he is and is always playing like a max contract is on the line. And yes, he’s always been a limited skill player. Poor ball handler, poor shooter, poor rebounder, still doesn’t know the defensive scheme very well. Those are things within his own ability to improve. If he had and with his natural gifts, there’s nothing that would have kept him off the floor. It’s nobody’s fault but his own.

Not to mention, poor passer. His tunnel vision makes it hard to play him within a team concept.