POB working out with Clifford Ray

Twinkie defense · Post #301 » by **Twinkie defense** » Thu Sep 4, 2008 8:04 pm

Houston's brass has invited five big men to try out for the team, one of which is former LA Clipper Daniel Santiago. Santiago has just fulfilled a three-year contract with the Spanish ACB's CB Málaga, and is now hoping to resume his career in the NBA. If things don't work out for him to return to the NBA, he also says he'd be happy to return to Europe...

While playing for Spain, Santiago established himself as one of the best big men in Europe. He's not an overwhelmingly gifted physical specimen, but he does more than make up for any physical shortcomings with his wide array of skills. He can score from anywhere, even has legitimate NBA three-point range. He's a double-double waiting to happen, is a smart, savvy player. He was working out at IMG a couple of weeks ago where he completely dominated Boston Celtic Patrick O'Bryant in head-to-head competition. Not that it's hard to do that, but Santiago is certainly capable of competing at the NBA level.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9913

Post #302 » by **FNQ** » Thu Sep 4, 2008 9:56 pm

Its really, really hard to take hoopsworld seriously when they say Daniel Santiago is a double double waiting to happen because he dominated the green O'Bryant...

FWIW, it seems hoopsworld has an axe to grind with POB, as they can't let his name go w/o a shot at it. I think RO really got to that clown :lol:

St.Nick · Post #303 » by **St.Nick** » Thu Sep 4, 2008 10:27 pm

Yeah, but that last part is probably true, isn't it? Dominating POB one-on-one is probably not that hard to do for an NBA caliber center.

If Santiago, who looks like a poor man's Kurt Rambis, can have his way with Patrick...well then its not looking so hot for POB and his die-hard supporters here.

Twinkie defense · Post #304 » by **Twinkie defense** » Fri Sep 5, 2008 12:06 am

I don't know anything about Daniel Santiago but if Patrick is to prove himself this season I would hope he could do better against a guy who may be a long shot to get back into the NBA... that's a pretty low hurdle to cross.

Post #305 » by **FNQ** » Fri Sep 5, 2008 12:24 am

Daniel Santiago isn't a run of the mill guy trying to get back into the NBA... he's in a new class of athletes that go to Europe to refine their game... we've seen it a lot the past few years, with players like Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon making it back into the NBA as role players/token starters. I'm sure there's more, non-Raptor ones, but those two stick out the most at the moment... coming soon: Marcus Haislip + Shammond Williams (remember them?)

As far as I'm concerned, POB's a rookie... the things he needed to work on - positioning, rebounding, all the low post stuff - is usually glossed over by the W's... he's finally getting a legit chance, and there's no excuse for no improvements this time. I still can't get over that the Celts get a player like that for nothing... lowest risk there is for a potentially outstanding reward.

St.Nick · Post #306 » by **St.Nick** » Fri Sep 5, 2008 12:34 am

....as soon as he stops being dominated by 32 year old journeymen.

Twinkie defense · Post #307 » by **Twinkie defense** » Fri Sep 5, 2008 7:21 pm

Given all of the possible pitfalls, Danny Ainge's offseason moves have been seriously inept... The signing of Patrick O'Bryant to back up Kendrick Perkins provides little more than a sizeable warm body.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/8524 ... -own-fault

turk3d · Post #308 » by **turk3d** » Sat Sep 6, 2008 2:39 am

I bet he'd dominate Mbenga, Perovic, Foyle (and probably even Damp) and a host of others.

Athletic bigs with outside shots who are quick are a tough cover for most conventional type Centers. Plus he's playing to get back in the league (which means he's highly motivated).

POBs contract is guaranteed (at least the first year) isn't it? I don't think this proves anything yet.

Coxy · Post #309 » by **Coxy** » Sat Sep 6, 2008 4:21 am

How does POB working out with Clifford Ray get 31 pages of chat from this board? Dudes gone and will be playing in Serbia within 2 years. I hope he makes it and proves me wrong but I predict out of the league within 2.

old rem · Post #310 » by **old rem** » Sat Sep 6, 2008 7:38 am

A virtual pickup game matchup does not really say much about Santiago or POB,let's see what's happening around mid season. POB has the basic tools and the Celts are weak at C. He needs COACHING...and I mean that in the whole spectrum of what coaching means. Basic Carrot + stick motivation can be pretty effective if your carrot is several million dollars.

Boston has a legit Big's coach in Ray. I assume they are saying "If you CAN play you WILL play".
Here? The message was more like " You're a prisoner here until you can escape." there wasn't a sense that POB was gonna get ANY chance unless a stray asteroid took out half the roster.

old rem · Post #311 » by **old rem** » Sat Sep 6, 2008 8:01 am

apcoxy wrote:How does POB working out with Clifford Ray get 31 pages of chat from this board? Dudes gone and will be playing in Serbia within 2 years. I hope he makes it and proves me wrong but I predict out of the league within 2.

POB is.....at least may be.....the canary in the coal mine. He's as relevant as ANY issue because the whole POB affair raises fundamental questions as to how this team does things. If you are scrambling to just be "average" and the FO/Coaching staff is wasting a LOT of opportunity, and doing so without any reason that's logically evident or is explained.....where's that headed?

We currently have 3 rookies from last year (or 4 counting Watson) M Williams...another recent rookie, 2 new draft picks and a possible rook in Morrow. We have a coach who seemed to be training most of the young guys to be spectators. The alternate theory is that the last 7-8 draft picks Mullin made were all horribly bad and we can't hardly give them away. That would not be a good sign either.

Twinkie defense · Post #312 » by **Twinkie defense** » Sat Sep 6, 2008 8:33 pm

Patrick is Lightening Rod.

Maple Green · Post #313 » by **Maple Green** » Mon Sep 8, 2008 3:52 am

Golden State wait until your own stone throw to you.

Twinkie defense · Post #314 » by **Twinkie defense** » Mon Sep 8, 2008 4:56 am

What does that even mean?

Is this a random quote generator?

Dogen · Post #315 » by **Dogen** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 2:12 am

No man is an island.

Not even the Great POB Who is Indomitable by Lesser Santiago.

Think that agin in you pipe and smoke that.

Twinkie defense · Post #316 » by **Twinkie defense** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:18 am

Our annoyance loses under a circular ax.

http://watchout4snakes.com/creativityto ... tence.aspx

turk3d · Post #317 » by **turk3d** » Wed Oct 1, 2008 9:37 pm

From Boston Forum;
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=841278

POB highlight
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WflY-rtJ ... re=related

His experience in running Nellie's drills should help him (he'll be used to running up and down the floor).

Oh, and BTW that was Josh Powell who made the block (pretty nasty) I believe.

old rem · Post #318 » by **old rem** » Thu Oct 2, 2008 3:28 pm

St.Nick wrote:The OP does not mean that POB will turn into anything. Clifford Ray is on the Celtics coaching staff so it is natural that POB would work out with him.

I highly doubt that POB becomes anything more than a bit player. He is too scatterbrained.

sorry Nick, but I'm still STILL awaiting sone bit of evidence that the guy we drafted #9 is too helpless to even make it as a backup C. P)ersonally, I agree that he may challenge Perkins for monutes rather soon.

I can see how maybe the W's decided it's not worth the minor hassle to polish up the skills of a kid we invested a precious pick on. Hey..I'm an old dumb bastard and lazy as a 20 yr old hound dog.
If I had a dime for every missed opportunity, I could buy a sixpack. Still....I just can't grasp why GSW was so comitted to POB being a nothing. We could not dare to play the guy another 60 min,say a few kind words and trade him for SOMETHIng?

I must have missed the part where the Warriors were an elite contender with no need to make every investment matter. Lucky Celtics. Some BOZO franchise steps up to give them
what they most need for free.

As I recall, Clifford Ray was a big help developing Biedrins,then we let him leave,naming Papa Smurf as the Big Man coach.....with instruction that any "big man" taller than 6-7 didn't count.

Mylie10 · Post #319 » by **Mylie10** » Thu Oct 2, 2008 4:16 pm

http://www.nba.com/celtics/news/blog/po ... 08-09.html

Stupid Doc Rivers said Patrick has had 2 strong days of practice so far. He's running with KG on the first team.

What's up Doc?

Rocky5000 · Post #320 » by **Rocky5000** » Thu Oct 2, 2008 4:20 pm

These are the guys I know of that Clifford Ray has worked 1 on 1 with in the NBA.
Biedrins
Dwight Howard
Al Jefferson
Perkins
Ryan Gomes
Powe
Big Baby
and now..
Patrick O'Bryant

Gomes, Powe, and Big Baby are all second round picks who are locks to stick in the league despite having height issues. Perkins was a late first round pick out of high school and and it took nearly 3 years before he was good enough to see the court, his sudden improvement coincided with the arrival of Clifford Ray.

I have a good amount of confidence that Cliff can work at least a little magic with O'Bryant and get him shaped up into a quality backup. Atm, he's the only 7 footer we have on the team and Perkins is recovering from shoulder surgery, so he might see a lot of minutes in preseason.
It's only the 2nd practice & this is what Doc had to say:

Rivers said he was impressed with Patrick O'Bryant's effort today, and for the second straight day while Kendrick Perkins is unavailable for contact, O'Bryant got the nod with the first unit.

"Patrick had a hell of a practice. He was great today," Rivers said, noting that if he figures out how to play alongside Garnett, "things could be pretty good for him."

He may be trying to boost POB's confidence a little bit as coaches often do, but KG also echoed Rivers sentiments in his own interview so it's not 100% fluff.