Emery moving towards a 3-4?

blumeany · Post #1 » by **blumeany** » Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:33 pm

Despite his insistence that they have no plans to do so, let's look at some evidence:

1. Drafted McClellin, who many projected as a OLB.
2. Pass on bringing Urlacher back, replace him with a guy who has played both schemes.
3. Hired a DC who most recently used a 3-4, but also has done 4-3.
4. Franchised, but has yet to extend Melton, who is more if a 4-3 type.
5. Let Roach and Hayes walk, guys that were drafted for 4-3.
6. Most of the Lovie guys are all older- Briggs, Tillman, Peppers.
7. Have yet to re-sign Idonije, passed on Okoye.
8. Passed on DJ Moore as a nickel back.

Seems to me like 4-3 is a stop gap and they are rapidly moving towards replacing key personnel.

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heir_jordan22 · Post #2 » by **heir_jordan22** » Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:24 pm

1. McClellin is a pass rusher. The ability to play a little "joker" just means he transends systems, which is something Emery has said on many occasions is extremely important to him.
2. He offered Urlacher more than probably any other team is offering. DJ Williams played much b etter in 4-3 than he did in 3-4.
3. Mel Tucker had a top 10 defense when he ran 4-3. Bottom of the league defense when he ran 3-4.
4. Clearly he wants to keep Melton.
5. Hayes isn't good. Roach got a contract paying him $4M a year, which would have eaten all of our cap space.
6. Who cares if they're older? They take up a quarter of the teams salary and will still play at elite level for the Bears for a couple more years.
7. Both Okoye and Idonije are probably out of our price range. We don't need Idonije anyway because of Wootton and McClellin. This is a very good draft for DTs so Emery probably decided to get one there for cheaper and more long term than Okoye.
8. DJ Moore is not that good and we can find a cheaper replacement.

Letting declining players walk in FA is not the same as "replacing key personnel." Emery has said many times that they will aim to acquire the most talented players regardless of scheme. That's why he he drafted McClellin, replaced Urlacher with the cheaper younger and currently better DJ Williams, why he may let Idonije walk if he ask for too much money. It is why he got a defensive coordinator who is willing to shape his scheme around his players amd not stick to one defense like Lovie would.

The Bears are no longer in the business of acquiring decent players because they fit the scheme. Emery will acquire the best players and expect the coaches to adjust. I really do not think he favors 3-4, he favors winning.

kozelkid · Post #3 » by **kozelkid** » Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:59 pm

There is a MUCH better chance that we're moving to a hybrid defense (see: Baltimore or NE- especially given Emery's roots) than to a traditional 3-4.

In fact, I think Emery envisioned Shea potentially filling that Terrell Suggs role of switching between OLB and DE.

organix85 · Post #4 » by **organix85** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 2:46 am

Melton would actually be a pretty damn good DE in a 3-4... I think Idonje would be as well. With that being said, I would've hoped he just went and transitioned if that's what he wanted. I actually don't like the DC hire. I preferred Horton.

heir_jordan22 wrote:3. Mel Tucker had a top 10 defense when he ran 4-3. Bottom of the league defense when he ran 3-4.

This is not true. He's also had bad years using the 4-3. As a matter of fact, he's been mostly bad as a DC. There is only 1 season out of 5 where his defense isn't in the bottom half.

heir_jordan22 · Post #5 » by **heir_jordan22** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:14 am

I'm pretty sure that defense ranked in the top 10 in one of his three years at DC, but that doesn't really make much of a difference.

I agree that Melton would be an excellent 3-4 DE.

organix85 · Post #6 » by **organix85** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:34 am

heir_jordan22 wrote:I'm pretty sure that defense ranked in the top 10 in one of his three years at DC, but that doesn't really make much of a difference.

I agree that Melton would be an excellent 3-4 DE.

It was top 10 in 1 of his 5 years as a DC... But it was also terrible in others, including years where he was running a 4-3. I'm actually not even sure why a guy with such a crappy track record was being looked at. His D's give up a bunch of yards and points... get no sacks... not a lot of ints. There must be something to it I guess. The only light at the end of the tunnel I see at this point is that his defenses sucked cause his teams sucked on offense. That's not a whole lot to hire a guy on though.

bearadonisdna · Post #7 » by **bearadonisdna** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:58 pm

organix85 wrote:
heir_jordan22 wrote:I'm pretty sure that defense ranked in the top 10 in one of his three years at DC, but that doesn't really make much of a difference.

I agree that Melton would be an excellent 3-4 DE.

It was top 10 in 1 of his 5 years as a DC... But it was also terrible in others, including years where he was running a 4-3. I'm actually not even sure why a guy with such a crappy track record was being looked at. His D's give up a bunch of yards and points... get no sacks... not a lot of ints. There must be something to it I guess. The only light at the end of the tunnel I see at this point is that his defenses sucked cause his teams sucked on offense. That's not a whole lot to hire a guy on though.

You make good points. Turners resume was underwhelming.

bearadonisdna · Post #8 » by **bearadonisdna** » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:04 pm

So far im undetwhelmed by our offseason. Melton isnt worth 8.4 mil and the money u save on not signing Urlacher they use it on bench riding scrubs.

blumeany · Post #9 » by **blumeany** » Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:23 pm

organix85 wrote:
heir_jordan22 wrote:I'm pretty sure that defense ranked in the top 10 in one of his three years at DC, but that doesn't really make much of a difference.

I agree that Melton would be an excellent 3-4 DE.

It was top 10 in 1 of his 5 years as a DC... But it was also terrible in others, including years where he was running a 4-3. I'm actually not even sure why a guy with such a crappy track record was being looked at. His D's give up a bunch of yards and points... get no sacks... not a lot of ints. There must be something to it I guess. The only light at the end of the tunnel I see at this point is that his defenses sucked cause his teams sucked on offense. That's not a whole lot to hire a guy on though.

The argument I heard shortly after they hired him was that it was more a case of the Jaguars' talent pool vs. his coaching. But then again, you can say that about any coach. It's the chicken vs. the egg.

heir_jordan22 · Post #10 » by **heir_jordan22** » Mon Mar 25, 2013 3:48 pm

The Jaguars had no pass rushers. They brought in a washed up Kampman and kept drafting run-stopping DEs. I would put it on that since qb pressure is so important. Everyone else on that defense perfored really well for him.

Cliff Levingston · Post #11 » by **Cliff Levingston** » Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:46 pm

blumeany wrote:Despite his insistence that they have no plans to do so, let's look at some evidence:

1. Drafted McClellin, who many projected as a OLB.
2. Pass on bringing Urlacher back, replace him with a guy who has played both schemes.
3. Hired a DC who most recently used a 3-4, but also has done 4-3.
4. Franchised, but has yet to extend Melton, who is more if a 4-3 type.
5. Let Roach and Hayes walk, guys that were drafted for 4-3.
6. Most of the Lovie guys are all older- Briggs, Tillman, Peppers.
7. Have yet to re-sign Idonije, passed on Okoye.
8. Passed on DJ Moore as a nickel back.

Seems to me like 4-3 is a stop gap and they are rapidly moving towards replacing key personnel.

Sent from my VS840 4G using Tapatalk 2

It's possible, but it's probably more about just getting the best players on the cheap that we can. Melton isn't a superstar but he's a really good player and the defense would take a major hit without him: we didn't really have a choice but to franchise him. Besides, he'd made quite a good 3-4 DE, Cliff Levingston thinks.

The only player on our team that fits substantially better in the 3-4 is McClellin, that's it. Urlacher wanted way too much money so he's gone, same with Roach. Wootton and Peppers are much better fits at 4-3 DE than 3-4 DE or OLB and we don't have anyone on the roster that comes very close to being a 3-4 NT which is arguably the most important position in the 3-4.

heir_jordan22 · Post #12 » by **heir_jordan22** » Sat Apr 27, 2013 9:02 pm

We a Pro Bowl/Hall of Fame caliber linebacker in Briggs. Two very high quality linebackers in Anderson and Williams.

We just draft two 3-4 ILB in Bostic and Greene. We also drafted a 3-4 OLB in Washington. We have McClellin, who can also be a 3-4 OLB.

We have Melton, Peppers and Wootton, who can all play 3-4 DE. If Paea puts on 10-20 pounds he can be our nose tackle.

I change my mind. It looks like we are definitely transitioning to 3-4 defense.

Post #13 » by **fleet** » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:18 pm

for the record, I had the O - riginal 3/4 speculation thread way back when. Let the record show. And I demand my cookie!

viewtopic.php?f=156&t=1180476

well, at the very least, they are not going to be caught with their shorts down the day Lance Briggs is no longer on the field. Or they are engineering that day.......maybe not today. Maybe not tomorrow. But that day will arrive, and when it does Emery will have 9 linebackers waiting in the wings