General Discussion 2017-18

[patryk7754]

Pace's last two drafts have certainly been better then his first one. I think there are only 2 players left from that draft that can be considered even serviceable.

I think Pace has over all done a solid job with the draft at funding mostly serviceable players, but he hasn't drafted that one elite game changer just yet.

I've not been a fan of his free agency over all. A lot of wasted dollars spent.

I agree here. I come away with "he just hasn't done eenough" especially for having three years. I think thats what the different write ups are alluding to.

Pace has done plenty in three years. He took a bears defense that was one of the oldest in the league and worst in bears history to one f the youngest and made them a top 10 defense and that’s only going to get better

[Axxo]

Maybe I missed something? I see the BearsWire link going over the 2015 draft class and that's it?

The guy who wrote it has #DaBears in his twitter bio

Sent from my LG-H872 using RealGM mobile app

This one is bearswire thats correct. Hoge may be a bears fan. However, what I think you missed was I said "articles" plural and power rankings. The other article was on espn. Also you said blood thirsty fans. Do you know that Hoge, the article on espn and all of the power rankings that referred to the lack of talent on the bears roster are blood thirsty fans? Some of them could be actual fans, but do you know them to be blood thirsty. The point is there is a repeated reference from different unrelated sources about the scarcity or lack of talent under Pace over the rebuild period.

Yes I did miss the other articles you are referencing. To move along quickly without back and forth I will own the fan comment I made.

As for Hoge I have not read nor heard his comments on Pace, I was referencing the BearsWire writer Bryan Perez. No big deal.


What i would like to do is focus on the 2015 draft. Lets recap the top 10 so we can have perspective to the BearsWire link you posted:

#1 Bucs- 7 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 4 players considered building blocks (Winston, OT Smith, LB Kwon A., Marpet)
#2 Titans- 9 total picks. 2 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Mariota, Gallik)
#3 Jags- 8 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Fowler jr, Cann)
#4 Raiders- 8 total picks. 5 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Cooper, Edwards jr)
#5 Skins- 10 total picks. 5 players remain on roster. 3 players considered building blocks (Scherff, Smith, Crowder)
#6 Jets- 6 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 1 player considered building block (Williams)
#7 Bears- 6 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Goldman, Amos)
#8 Falcons- 7 total picks. 3 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Beasley, Coleman)
#9 Giants- 6 total picks. 2 players remain on roster. 1 player considered building block (Collins)
#10 Rams- 9 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 3 players considered building blocks (Gurley, Havenstein, J. Brown)


*I referenced NFL.com for current rosters and IR
**Building block title was based on Games started and production.

By my count there are four 2017 playoff teams. All of them missed on high round picks.

The one thing that does stand out here is Kevin White and Erek Flowers are the two players from the 1st round (top 10) not listed as building blocks going into 2018. Pace has to own that.

Overall I feel the Bears were middle of the pack.

Thanks for spending the time to highlight this. I think we need to clarify what the expectations are. The 2015 draft was bad for Pace. Esp since he came in with a rep for being a drafting wiz. This team is still feeling the effects of the misses from that draft most notably at the WR. The writeups i was referring to did usually say "lack" or something like that are over simplying. Of course he has done something here. Just no real impact players. I think thats where the word "lack" applies.

[patryk7754]

This one is bearswire thats correct. Hoge may be a bears fan. However, what I think you missed was I said "articles" plural and power rankings. The other article was on espn. Also you said blood thirsty fans. Do you know that Hoge, the article on espn and all of the power rankings that referred to the lack of talent on the bears roster are blood thirsty fans? Some of them could be actual fans, but do you know them to be blood thirsty. The point is there is a repeated reference from different unrelated sources about the scarcity or lack of talent under Pace over the rebuild period.

Yes I did miss the other articles you are referencing. To move along quickly without back and forth I will own the fan comment I made.

As for Hoge I have not read nor heard his comments on Pace, I was referencing the BearsWire writer Bryan Perez. No big deal.


What i would like to do is focus on the 2015 draft. Lets recap the top 10 so we can have perspective to the BearsWire link you posted:

#1 Bucs- 7 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 4 players considered building blocks (Winston, OT Smith, LB Kwon A., Marpet)
#2 Titans- 9 total picks. 2 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Mariota, Gallik)
#3 Jags- 8 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Fowler jr, Cann)
#4 Raiders- 8 total picks. 5 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Cooper, Edwards jr)
#5 Skins- 10 total picks. 5 players remain on roster. 3 players considered building blocks (Scherff, Smith, Crowder)
#6 Jets- 6 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 1 player considered building block (Williams)
#7 Bears- 6 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Goldman, Amos)
#8 Falcons- 7 total picks. 3 players remain on roster. 2 players considered building blocks (Beasley, Coleman)
#9 Giants- 6 total picks. 2 players remain on roster. 1 player considered building block (Collins)
#10 Rams- 9 total picks. 4 players remain on roster. 3 players considered building blocks (Gurley, Havenstein, J. Brown)


*I referenced NFL.com for current rosters and IR
**Building block title was based on Games started and production.

By my count there are four 2017 playoff teams. All of them missed on high round picks.

The one thing that does stand out here is Kevin White and Erek Flowers are the two players from the 1st round (top 10) not listed as building blocks going into 2018. Pace has to own that.

Overall I feel the Bears were middle of the pack.

Thanks for spending the time to highlight this. I think we need to clarify what the expectations are. The 2015 draft was bad for Pace. Esp since he came in with a rep for being a drafting wiz. This team is still feeling the effects of the misses from that draft most notably at the WR. The writeups i was referring to did usually say "lack" or something like that are over simplying. Of course he has done something here. Just no real impact players. I think thats where the word "lack" applies.

Outside of white, who else was a miss?

[City of Trees]

Thanks for spending the time to highlight this. I think we need to clarify what the expectations are. The 2015 draft was bad for Pace. Esp since he came in with a rep for being a drafting wiz. This team is still feeling the effects of the misses from that draft most notably at the WR. The writeups i was referring to did usually say "lack" or something like that are over simplying. Of course he has done something here. Just no real impact players. I think thats where the word "lack" applies.

Outside of white, who else was a miss?

6th rnd pick Tayo Fabuluje. He was an athletic T who had red flags. He failed drug tests. Pace went for a home run swing late in the draft. I can live with that.

4th rnd pick Jeremy Langford is also considered a miss. However he never had a chance the moment Howard showed up.



Sent from my LG-H872 using RealGM mobile app

[City of Trees]

Grassu is more than serviceable when he gets on the field. Not his fault he is buried behind three pro bowlers which has probably delayed his development but the tape doesnt lie.

Watch on YouTube

Sent from my LG-H872 using RealGM mobile app

[patryk7754]

Thanks for spending the time to highlight this. I think we need to clarify what the expectations are. The 2015 draft was bad for Pace. Esp since he came in with a rep for being a drafting wiz. This team is still feeling the effects of the misses from that draft most notably at the WR. The writeups i was referring to did usually say "lack" or something like that are over simplying. Of course he has done something here. Just no real impact players. I think thats where the word "lack" applies.

Outside of white, who else was a miss?

6th rnd pick Tayo Fabuluje. He was an athletic T who had red flags. He failed drug tests. Pace went for a home run swing late in the draft. I can live with that.

4th rnd pick Jeremy Langford is also considered a miss. However he never had a chance the moment Howard showed up.



Sent from my LG-H872 using RealGM mobile app

I would argue that, by default, a 6th round pick can’t be considered a miss.

The Langford pick is 50/50. He had a great rookie season, even being a big part in a few wins. Clearly his effectiveness dropped after that, but that was somewhat due to injury. And it’s not like Paces planned for him to be a starter. The plan was for him to be a good backup,which he was. The only reason he’s not on the team now is because Pace got three really good players to put ahead of him

[patryk7754]

Fun fact: I remember watching mike and mike a couple years ago and they were talking about 1st round picks. They said that around 33% of 1st rounders stay on their team after their rookie contract is up (implying that they’re a bust). This is why I never understood why draft picks are so coveted. It just really makes no sense to me. This past season, Marcel Darius, a pro bowler, was traded for a 6th rounder. A few seasons ago , Anquon Boldin was traded for a 5th rounder when he was one of the top receivers in the nfl.