Baller 24 wrote:No, Bosh is a significant upgrade over Scola. He's got a higher rebound rate, he scores more at just about the same efficiency, he's more clutch and an actual go-to 4th quarter option. His TS% is about 4% higher---that's a significant increase when talking about TS%. He attempts 8.5 FTs a game compared to a measly 3.1 FTs by Luis. He's got a 19.6 foul drawing percentage, compared to just 9.5% from Scola, and he shoots a slightly higher FT%.
He's significantly a better passer, he can operate at the high post (something Yao is absolutely horrible at doing, which forces Adelman to change his entire offensive philosophy when regarding this team). His passing is significantly greater--he's on Dirk's level as a passer, and from operating in a high-post standpoint, it's flat out better. He stretches the floor, he can handle the ball, he can slash to the rim, he's pretty much EASILY suited to play the C-Webb role on our team, there's no doubt about it. Maybe not at the same style or as good, but he's definitely good enough, and MUCH better than Luis Scola. Oh, and he's a flat out better defender, a great weak-side shot-blocker, with a fantastic face-up jumper, Luis doesn't have this, he can't handle the ball, he needs to be set up.
Let me put those stats in context for you:
Last year Bosh was put into a privilaged position in Toronto's offense more often than even Yao was in Houston's offense, but even being put into a privilaged position on offense
far more often than Scola was, Scola still had a higher TS% than Bosh did. This year Toronto went all-out and made everybody work their spacing around Bosh and his TS% shot above Scola's by 3.5%, and much of it was from the improved play of Toronto's guards.
You want to see the perfect example of TS% inflation, just look at Landry. Last season when he was playing a lot higher percentage of his time with the bench guys, a higher percentage of his shots were from a privilaged position on offense (in his case, mostly on low post isolation). Last season, Landry was a whopping 6.5% higher on TS% than Bosh was. This season Landry had a lot more minutes with the starters and a lower percentage of his shots were from a privilaged position on offense, and his TS% dropped like 3% (and Landry
still has a significantly higher TS% than Bosh does).
You want to play the Hollinger game? Do you know which of Bosh's stats got worse this season with Toronto going all-out on making everybody work their spacing around Bosh? His assist ratio and turnover ratio both got worse this year. And Bosh's "great" passing? Scola actually has a higher assist ratio than Bosh does. Apparently all those additional high post isolation and pick-n'-roll plays Toronto run specifically for Bosh this season aren't paying off all that well for his teammates. Considering how often Houston puts Scola in a bad position late in the shot clock and with Bosh it's the other way around, that is pretty telling.
Martin is so valuable because he is highly efficient without needing to be in a privilaged position on offense (actually Martin is an anomaly in that he is often less effective when put into what would normally be considered a privilaged position on offense). Scola is similarly valuable because he is efficient whatever kind of touches he gets. Anybody who has bothered to pay attention to some of the Olympic games (or some of the quarters in last year's playoffs) knows that Scola is a beast when he
is put in a privilaged position on offense. If in the 4th quarter Brooks decides to play one-man offense and nobody tells him to do otherwise, that is a problem with Adelman, not Scola.
Baller 24 wrote:Actually the month of January, which many predicted to be the easier month for the Rockets, we played absolutely horrible basketball, and everyone was playing on the team at the time. We were struggling well before the Lowry/Ariza injury.
Actually, when you take out the 11 or so games Lowry/Ariza missed, we were winning at sub-500 pace and below season average with Lowry/Ariza hobbled (not out), but the dropoff was not big enough to be irrecoverable. What killed us were the games Lowry/Ariza missed, where we were winning at the pace of a bottom-5 lottery team. In those games without Ariza, the defensive dropoff when Battier went to the bench was
horrifyingly steep, which, incidentally, did a whole lot to convince me that neither Ariza nor Battier is readily expendable unless the trade is for a wing with good defense.
Baller 24 wrote:Yes, but look at that organization, they fail miserably at putting efficient and effective players around Bosh. The garbage they have around him is laughable, their coach isn't known to be anywhere near as good or great as Adelman. This overall team is better than Toronto's team (especially if you take out Bosh), but a significant margin.
You talk about Wade as he's a difference maker, but look at his team they're struggling to hold onto a 7th seed, and guess who's team is behind them? Yup Mr Bosh. Please keep the double standard away, the team assembled around Bosh is in no way or form ready to be a championship contender, just like the team that's assembled around Wade isn't.
Are you ****ing ****ing me? Have you even watched a single Toronto game this season?
You cannot seriously have just compared Andrea Bargnani, Turkoglu, Calderon, and Jarret Jack to the no-talents who would barely make the bench on most teams and the washed-ups who have been on the steep decline for 3+ seasons overpaid bunch of scrubs that Wade has to work with.
You do realize that Jarrett Jack has a higher TS% than Bosh does, right? And Jack is humming along at 30.6 assist ratio to your "great passer" Bosh's 9.4? And Calderon is in the top ten in TS% for his position, and rocking a 35.0 assist ratio. That's higher than Deron Williams and almost as good as CP3.
Good god, man, half of Toronto's bench have more talent than Miami's starters. And Miami is currently
ahead of Toronto. OMFG. I don't know why I'm still bothering to reply to your posts!
Baller 24 wrote:So wait, let me grasp what you're saying....replace Bosh with Scola and we only have a 27 game? LOL Please, we'd be sitting in the western conference playoff picture right now, don't know what seed, but I guarantee you that we would be in it. A 24/11 player that scores at an effective rate can't change this team from a winning standpoint, but Luis Scola can, great, fantastic.
Yes, I'm saying that that is a possibility for the reasons I have already covered. Let's put it this way, if you transplanted the Raptors to the west, they may very well be sitting at 30 wins
right now. And when you take out Bosh, Yao, and Scola, Toronto is more talented than we are.
Baller 24 wrote:This makes no sense. Chris Bosh has been a fantastic player throughout his career, actually his statistics indicate he's gotten better every single year he's been in the league. He's only 25 years old, and for all we know, he's just now entering his prime/peak seasons as a basketball player, meaning he's going to be off the books at the age of 31--really, is it that big of a risk? Not really, considering Bosh is not an injury prone player, he's a player that produces and is good enough to rely on. Don't tell me Luis Scola is better insurance player than Bosh, that's just hyperbole.
Don't make strawman arguments. I never said Scola was better insurance than Bosh. I said Bosh is not good enough to be insurance. I don't think either player is good enough to be insurance if Yao goes down again. I think we are just plain screwed if Yao goes down again, regardless of whether we have Bosh or Scola.
The risk here is paying somebody the max and ending up in a half-ass situation we can't get out of for 5 or 6 years. If Yao is healthy, I think we are a far better team keeping Scola and trade for another great player for the salary we save as outlined than we are with Bosh. If Yao is not healthy, I ain't stuck with Bosh's overpaid max for 5-6 years for in all likelihood a barely 8th-seed team in the west.
Baller 24 wrote:Yao last season averaged 20/10, you're saying Bosh who's gotten better every single season, coming off of an Olympic gold medal while being a significant contributor to that, who's averaging 24/11 on almost 52% with a TS% of 59 isn't a difference maker? Ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous. Objective evidence obviously states otherwise.
Yao makes
much more of a difference on defense than Bosh does despite the occassional pretty defensive plays Bosh makes, and Yao gets his offense more efficiently and does so without depending on players to leave the paint for him to drive to boost his efficiency. Yao is a gamebreaker. Bosh is just a great player. Bosh is way overrated on defense anyway. He's not even half the difference-maker on defense Kirilenko is, let alone prime Duncan or Garnett.
Baller 24 wrote:We're not telling anyone to throw away Brooks and Battier in the deal, but the right deal can obviously be made, if you don't think having two efficient and effective star players operating on a team with a proficient scorer like Martin on the perimeter is better than keeping Luis Scola, I really don't know what to tell you. Objective evidence states helps out team more than he hurts it OVER Luis Scola, so I really don't understand what more there is to argue.
The concept is very simple, really: It is a bad idea to give up Scola, another great player, and probably additional assets just to have the "privilage" to
way overpay for an overrated player.
Baller 24 wrote:Than you haven't seen Bosh play at all except for watch ESPN highlights. His offensive game has all the qualities to work in the Princeton offense.
I don't know why people obssess over the Princeton offense. Our offense was better last year when we
weren't running "Adelman" offense as much.
