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We just finished a series where 3 of the 4 games we lost were ones where he was injured. We've played like crap during the regular season every time he's gone out. Even the people who were constantly shouting to trade him over the past 3 years climbed on his bandwagon during the streak.

Can we please, please, finally stop constantly moaning about him and admit that in spite of his flaws we're currently screwed without him and let the topic just die next year - just completely fall off the map. If he has three 1-14 games in a row, just shrug and accept that it's the way the puppy bounces.

(And yes, I'm still in favor of trading him from this point on, but for one of a small, small list of players only, and if we don't pull off anything it shouldn't be an immediate problem)

If you really want a player that's good to complain about, look toward Darius Miles, Tim Thomas, or Zack Randolph.

Yeah he was crucial to whatever team success we had this season. He's one of our better shooters (not saying much but nonetheless), an underrated defender, and drastically improved his finishing around the basket.

Saying that, I still think we have to look for an upgrade, he's just too streaky and erratic at times to really be a contender (unless we upgrade dramatically elsewhere).

his best year yet, no dobut about it

he improved a lot,

I am surprisingly shocked at how well he played this whole season

Moofs, why do I get the feeling that no matter how reasonable your argument is, we'll still see our fair share of "trade Rafer" threads this summer?

jove9 wrote:Moofs, why do I get the feeling that no matter how reasonable your argument is, we'll still see our fair share of "trade Rafer" threads this summer?

This isn't fair. I would have no problem trading Rafer if the opportunity came to get Hinrich or Miller. The issue to me was all these idiots acting like Francis and James should have gotten the lion's share of the minutes to start last season.

tha_rock220 wrote:This isn't fair. I would have no problem trading Rafer if the opportunity came to get Hinrich or Miller. The issue to me was all these idiots acting like Francis and James should have gotten the lion's share of the minutes to start last season.

You're right.

Oh, and don't forget about Brooks. How many times did you see someone clamoring that we should start Aaron Brooks?

There should be a Stop hating on T-Mac thread before this

He has improved greatly this season. Maybe it's the coaching, I don't know. However, I still find him playing inconsistently at times and shooting those brick 3s..

Lets hate on Steve Francis. Dude is useless.

He's been fantastic in Adelman's system, and was our second best player during the streak, but Having he and Shane as starters does not provide enough offense. If we could swing a Battier trade for Ron Artest, then I'd be fine having him, but he and Battier are way too streaky to be starting together.

Dinky Bits wrote:He's been fantastic in Adelman's system, and was our second best player during the streak, but Having he and Shane as starters does not provide enough offense. If we could swing a Battier trade for Ron Artest, then I'd be fine having him, but he and Battier are way too streaky to be starting together.

His defense is extremely valuable to this team. Trading him would me a horrible idea.

No coincidence that we lost the first 2 games against Utah without him, were super competitive in the next 3 games and the first half of game 6 and then got our butts handed to us in the second half when he went down with that injury and couldn't play. It would have been a different series had he not been injured for 2 and a half games.

Im surprised nobaoby made a Hate Battier thread.

Rudy Who?

We do play a lot better with him on the court, that much can't be denied. It's also true that's he's pretty much the only real PG we have on the roster, so that pretty much means we're stuck with him until we can find another true PG.

I was very surprised how much he has improved this year however. You usually don't see improvement from players his age.

People keep saying he improved soooo much. The stats don't say this at all. I don't know what people are looking at. He made a few more layups and a few less 3 pointers which probably balance out when you consider you're trading a 3 for a 2. I don't get it. The stats say there isn't much change at all. I think people seeing him in a different system must be part of it. He did seem to assume a more vocal leadership role this year which is surprising considering how the year began. The Rafer hate snowballed to ridiculous proportions and was apparently contagious as people called for John Lucas 3 and Luther Head to start over him. He was blamed for everything. I guess every team needs a scapegoat when a game is lost. Nevermind that nobody behind him has ever been even able to get close to his production. His performance in the playoffs this year was much better than last year though, but other than that...same old Rafer as far as I can tell.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/playerStats?statsId=3282

vator wrote:People keep saying he improved soooo much. The stats don't say this at all. I don't know what people are looking at. He made a few more layups and a few less 3 pointers which probably balance out when you consider you're trading a 3 for a 2. I don't get it. The stats say there isn't much change at all. I think people seeing him in a different system must be part of it. He did seem to assume a more vocal leadership role this year which is surprising considering how the year began. His performance in the playoffs this year was much better than last year though, but other than that...same old Rafer as far as I can tell.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/playerStats?statsId=3282

From what I see he has mixed his offense a bit more, had better chemistry with T-Mac, and his defense is still steady as it has always been. But what has always been Alston's knock is consistency, and I think he had his most consistent stretch toward the 2nd half of the season. His season stats might not reflect that however given his (and the entire team's) dismal first half. Take a closer look at his splits (i.e. month-to-month stats).

vator wrote:People keep saying he improved soooo much. The stats don't say this at all. I don't know what people are looking at. He made a few more layups and a few less 3 pointers which probably balance out when you consider you're trading a 3 for a 2. I don't get it. The stats say there isn't much change at all. I think people seeing him in a different system must be part of it. He did seem to assume a more vocal leadership role this year which is surprising considering how the year began. The Rafer hate snowballed to ridiculous proportions and was apparently contagious as people called for John Lucas 3 and Luther Head to start over him. He was blamed for everything. I guess every team needs a scapegoat when a game is lost. Nevermind that nobody behind him has ever been even able to get close to his production. His performance in the playoffs this year was much better than last year though, but other than that...same old Rafer as far as I can tell.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/playerStats?statsId=3282

check out his split season stat in feb

vator wrote:People keep saying he improved soooo much. The stats don't say this at all. I don't know what people are looking at. He made a few more layups and a few less 3 pointers which probably balance out when you consider you're trading a 3 for a 2. I don't get it. The stats say there isn't much change at all. I think people seeing him in a different system must be part of it. He did seem to assume a more vocal leadership role this year which is surprising considering how the year began. The Rafer hate snowballed to ridiculous proportions and was apparently contagious as people called for John Lucas 3 and Luther Head to start over him. He was blamed for everything. I guess every team needs a scapegoat when a game is lost. Nevermind that nobody behind him has ever been even able to get close to his production. His performance in the playoffs this year was much better than last year though, but other than that...same old Rafer as far as I can tell.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/playerStats?statsId=3282

Shhhh don't do that! WE might know that, but everyone else is high on him right now. We gotta get them to commit to this before they start realizing that sort of thing.

Too late. You can't take back a bulllet once it's been fired.

Summer is nearly upon us. Where's Otis Thorpe (the poster, not the player)?

I expect another "Rafer Sucks" thread any minute now...

You can if you're that frog guy from Kung Fu Hustle.