At retirement,Yao willrank where among alltime great centers

McGrady2Head · Post #1 » by **McGrady2Head** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:29 am

When we drafted Yao, he was from China, he was 7'5'', and he held the key to all of our championship dreams. Unfortunately, we overrated him BIG TIME. He isnt anything near what we hoped he would be. He is slow, dumb, and soft.

The question is, where will Yao Ming rank among all time great centers. Vote in the poll!

jzmagik · Post #2 » by **jzmagik** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:31 am

yao bashing yayy

Post #3 » by **TMACFORMVP** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:41 am

Poll option #3, really not debate-able. He's probably around/below Zo in his absolute prime and clearly below "prime" Bill Walton, but he'll be a 20/10 player with good defense, which is far ahead of anything Smits or Ilguaskas have achieved. Besides this is all speculation, anything can happen.

Post #4 » by **TMU** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:45 am

TMACFORMVP wrote:Poll option #3, really not debate-able. He's probably around/below Zo in his absolute prime and clearly below "prime" Bill Walton, but he'll be a 20/10 player with good defense, which is far ahead of anything Smits or Ilguaskas have achieved. Besides this is all speculation, anything can happen.

I second this... right now, he's somewhere between options 3 and 4.

T-Wack · Post #5 » by **T-Wack** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:55 am

He's a glorified Rik Smits.

Amel · Post #6 » by **Amel** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 2:57 am

Rik Smits with steroids

hehe

Baller 24 · Post #7 » by **Baller 24** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:09 am

Yao's reign as best center in the league lasted about a year and a half. In 2008, Dwight was clearly better, and its not even debatable as statistically Dwight has him in every route. Yao is basically a glorified Rik smits lol, and even McGrady himself a year or two ago said...Yao is very similar to a Rik Smits (in a good way, not bad).

abcdef · Post #8 » by **abcdef** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:13 am

Baller 24 wrote:Yao's reign as best center in the league lasted about a year and a half. In 2008, Dwight was clearly better, and its not even debatable as statistically Dwight has him in every route. Yao is basically a glorified Rik smits lol, and even McGrady himself a year or two ago said...Yao is very similar to a Rik Smits.

Smits has never averaged 20 ppg or 10 rpg, and has never made it onto any All-NBA Teams. Yao is simply far superior to Rik Smits.

For their careers, 19.1/9.2/1.6ast/1.9blk for Yao against 14.8/6.1/1.4ast/1.3blk for Smits. It isn't close.

hackle · Post #9 » by **hackle** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:14 am

He'll be forgotten the next day after he retired, so you will never find him in any rankings. he'll be gone.

Baller 24 · Post #10 » by **Baller 24** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:16 am

abcdef wrote:
Baller 24 wrote:Yao's reign as best center in the league lasted about a year and a half. In 2008, Dwight was clearly better, and its not even debatable as statistically Dwight has him in every route. Yao is basically a glorified Rik smits lol, and even McGrady himself a year or two ago said...Yao is very similar to a Rik Smits.

Smits has never averaged 20 ppg or 10 rpg, and has never made it onto any All-NBA Teams. Yao is simply far superior to Rik Smits.

For their careers, 19.1/9.2/1.6ast/1.9blk for Yao against 14.8/6.1/1.4ast/1.3blk for Smits. It isn't close.

Well I mean in style, not statistically...Yao > > > > > Rik. But In terms of style of play, I'd say Yao is most comparable to Rik Smits, can't think of any other player as tall as Yao, that had a touch so soft.

Iggyemu · Post #11 » by **Iggyemu** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:17 am

What kind of silly post is this.

Yao will rank nowhere among the great centers. Thats a slap in the face to the great centers. You guys have realized that McGrady has a lost a lot of what he was. Its time to realize that Yao is really not as good as you once thought.

And in that...realize that this team actually isn't very good.

hackle · Post #12 » by **hackle** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:19 am

Iggyemu wrote:What kind of silly post is this.

Yao will rank nowhere among the great centers. Thats a slap in the face to the great centers. You guys have realized that McGrady has a lost a lot of what he was. Its time to realize that Yao is really not as good as you once thought.

And in that...realize that this team actually isn't very good.

to-ta-ly

McGrady2Head · Post #13 » by **McGrady2Head** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:45 am

i kind of agree with that. I dont think yao will ever be as good as Zo was. i think hes closer to smits and ilgauskas than anybody else.

bballmaniac27 · Post #14 » by **bballmaniac27** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 3:54 am

The best answer to the question would be option 3 although I would rank all 3 of those players above Yao as of today.LOL at the first two options... was it really necessary to put those up?

Yao is better than Rik Smits and Ilgaskus though so I wouldn't call him a glorified Rik Smits. More like a rich man's Rik Smits. LOL at the first two options... was it really necessary to put those up?

Baller 24 wrote:Yao's reign as best center in the league lasted about a year and a half. In 2008, Dwight was clearly better, and its not even debatable as statistically Dwight has him in every route. Yao is basically a glorified Rik smits lol, and even McGrady himself a year or two ago said...Yao is very similar to a Rik Smits (in a good way, not bad).

Being the best center in the NBA nowadays is really nothing to brag about. Dwight is the best center nowadays ( excluding duncan) but he gets overrated a lot by this board. He's definitely not a dominant offensive force and his defense isn't as good as people say. He's a good help defender but clearly isn't on the level of Duncan/Garnett and his man D is quite average.

2fast4u · Post #15 » by **2fast4u** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 4:16 am

as good as robert wadlow

Baller 24 · Post #16 » by **Baller 24** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 4:27 am

bballmaniac27 wrote:
Being the best center in the NBA nowadays is really nothing to brag about. Dwight is the best center nowadays ( excluding duncan) but he gets overrated a lot by this board. He's definitely not a dominant offensive force and his defense isn't as good as people say. He's a good help defender but clearly isn't on the level of Duncan/Garnett and his man D is quite average.

I'd say Duncan is the best center, but if we are talking about Dwight...well although currently the center position isn't the "strongest" Dwight has made big strides, and it shows on both ends of the floor statistically anyway.

bballmaniac27 · Post #17 » by **bballmaniac27** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 4:58 am

Baller 24 wrote:
bballmaniac27 wrote:
Being the best center in the NBA nowadays is really nothing to brag about. Dwight is the best center nowadays ( excluding duncan) but he gets overrated a lot by this board. He's definitely not a dominant offensive force and his defense isn't as good as people say. He's a good help defender but clearly isn't on the level of Duncan/Garnett and his man D is quite average.

I'd say Duncan is the best center, but if we are talking about Dwight...well although currently the center position isn't the "strongest" Dwight has made big strides, and it shows on both ends of the floor statistically anyway.

I'm not saying Dwight isn't a great player and I'm not saying he hasn't made strides in his game. But honestly, currently he isn't as good as people on this board would like to think. Notice I say currently because of course he's still young and has tons of room for growth.

I've been watching him closely ever since his 2nd season in the NBA and while his offensive game has made strides he's still far from being a great offensive player.

Dwight's team defense has improved considerably and I would say he's definitely a force in the middle. However, I still wouldn't put him in the category of players like Duncan/Garnett in that regard. Also I don't know what the stats say but IMO Dwight's man to man defense is only average ( maybe a little above average because of his freakish athleticism). Remember the game where we played the Magic earlier this season? Dwight couldn't guard Yao at all and in fact Adonal Foyle had much better success.

BaYBaller · Post #18 » by **BaYBaller** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 5:10 am

Option 3 obviously. Teams still build their defensive game plan vs Yao, he is a huge offensive threat there's no denying that. The only problem is teams have learned how to play good team defense vs Yao throughout the years, and Yao has not been able to adapt well enough - be that through rebounding, a better offensive skillset, or whatever.

The problem I always have had with Yao wasn't really his offense though, it's been when his offense is off he can't make up for it in other facets of his game. That's why I believe Yao should be less concerned with fouls and fouling out. Just play balls out on defense and on the boards and see how effective he can be because right now he expends all his energy banging in the post.

I seriously believe this team would be so much better if the offense wasn't so focused around Yao, that he instead gets his touches in the flow of the game (where he can shoot an insanely high %) and just focus on the defensive end and on the boards. I would gladly take less points from Yao if he was able to cut his TOs, increase his rebounding rate and play solid defense. No other team force feeds their big man like HOU does. San Antonio does not do it with TD, nor does BOS with KG, nor ORL with D12.

moofs · Post #19 » by **moofs** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 6:04 am

As far as the poll's question, the options are inane so I'm not gonna pick one. Ilgauskas? Please. You can compare him to Smits if you want, until remembering that Smits loved the corners of the FT line, and we all moan ANY time Yao moves out there. As was pointed out, AND IS OBVIOUS, Yao is vastly superior to Smits statistically as well. He's most likely in the 10-30 range. Also, TMU's arguments aside, until I see enough good footage to the contrary, I don't consider Russell top 5.

Others:
Chamberlain, Olajuwon, Shaq, Robinson, Ewing, Russell, Mutombo, Jabbar, Malone, Duncan, maybe Reed, maybe Cowens, Parish, Zo, maybe Sikma, maybe Thurmond...
That's 12-16 off the top of my head.

spolgar · Post #20 » by **spolgar** » Wed Jan 7, 2009 6:38 am

Too early to tell. Yao is a 20-10 threat every night. He commands double teams. That is now. With an 80% free throw shooting percentage, hack-a-yao will not work. He is a far more offensively polished center than any other, in terms of fundamentals. He's definitely a bigger, more physically gifted Arydas Sabonis, now. And I really really liked Arydas Sabonis.

At retirement, if Yao continues to be hampered by injuries and teammates that are in turn hampered by injuries, then he's going to be sitting just outside of Cowens and Reed just because those two have rings. Is he better than Zo? Offensively, yes. Defensively, no. Is Yao better than Parish ? I would have to say so. That should land him right outside of 25.

Assuming Yao wins a championship, his outlook in the lens of history would be far rosier. He would usurp Ewing's place, which would easily be in most people's top 15. Would he pass Walton and Robinson is dependent on the guy who is rating, but given Walton played really 5 seasons of exceptional basketball and Robinson won only one championship on his own on a shortened season, I wouldn't be too surprised.

I believe Yao Ming will be remembered as being....