2012 Draft Night(s)

[LoboGuerrero]

Things I'd change:

Take Iloka at some point. If not him, Antonio Allen later on.
Take Molk or Dennard instead of this last OLB.
I really like the Reiff pick, would've been happy with DeCastro too.
I like the Broyles pick, but I would've been just as happy if not happier with Lavonte David.
Not sold on all these CB and OLB we drafted.

[TSE]

They picked 3 OLB i did not know we had such a need at that position, maybe they plan on moving someone.

Well maybe they are just looking for one new OLB to breakout and be a star for the future and they feel they have 3 shots now to get that 1 great addition. So it could be not a huge need in numbers, but an important need in general and that they want to take a triple shot instead of a double shot to get that 1 guy.

Chargers got Molk, shucks.

[TSE]

Things I'd change:

Take Iloka at some point. If not him, Antonio Allen later on.
Take Molk or Dennard instead of this last OLB.
I really like the Reiff pick, would've been happy with DeCastro too.
I like the Broyles pick, but I would've been just as happy if not happier with Lavonte David.
Not sold on all these CB and OLB we drafted.

I pretty much agree with each of your comments to some level. I wouldn't have been happy with DeCastro as high as 23 since it would have been a reach when we could have still traded down for big profit to get him or a comparable player of value, which is why the Reiff pick doesn't make sense although Reiff was the 2nd highest rated OT so there are things to like in general about that. The concept of managing draft is all about value and maximization and winning Super Bowls in the most efficient and most likely projection to me, and that's where we keep failing at the core.

Broyles too is another guy that I was higher on than most people but even I wouldn't reach for a player that I love as much as Broyles! And if we went heavy with a premier rated player like a Lavonte David (not saying he's my premier choice but assuming he was) then we wouldn't have had to spend 3 picks on other OLBs to get help by numbers and then we could have picked 3 players we liked ala Dennard or Burfict or Molk (et. etc. for DOZENS of intriguing players) or an RB such as Gray who went late or Michael Smith who is really fast.

[Leolovinliberal]

Where is our 3rd string QB could it be next pick ? or will they go RB ?

Kellen Moore. Great pick up, fantastic.

[ajaX82]

Kellen Moore seems like a perfect third string guy. Very nice FA pick-up

It seems at the end we just drafted LBs and CBs and hope to have a battle royale in camp to see who sticks. Should be interesting

[Piston Pete]

Burfict will go undrafted, no point in wasting a pick.

Jeremy Lane was a guy the Lions liked, he just went though. Mike Harris another.

If you're looking for developmental upside then the better bet is small school guys. If you're looking for more immediate function you take big-school players with flaws that get covered some by your system.

I would like Kelcie McCray S Arkansas State next or Antonio Allen from So Car.
Tom Compton T South Dakota would be fine, or Reiffs teammate Zusevics.

Loads of wideouts with potential left, probably better off not drafting and cherry picking UDFAs.
Two RBs I like left: Adonis Thomas and Jonathan Grimes.

I remember you talking about McCray a while ago. Have the Lions also expressed interest in him? Love to have him in camp as an UDFA.

[ajaX82]

FWIW I thought the Travis Lewis pick was sneaky good. He could be a Willie Young type guy: 7th rounder who makes the team and performs way above his draft position

I think we drafted just about every Oklahoma player available. At least they'll be comfortable. R. Lewis is the steal of our draft for me...I bet he turns into a really good DE

[Piston Pete]

Kelcie McCray signed on with the Miami Dolphins as an UDFA.

Guys I'd LOVE to get as UDFA's:

RB Polk (Washington) - WOULD BE HUGE
CB Minnifield (Virgina)
WR Owusu (Stanford)

[Sheeeeed]

Kellen Moore seems like a perfect third string guy. Very nice FA pick-up

It seems at the end we just drafted LBs and CBs and hope to have a battle royale in camp to see who sticks. Should be interesting

Ronnell and Whitehead might end up as DEs if they ever get to play more than special teams.

[TSE]

Kellen Moore seems like a perfect third string guy. Very nice FA pick-up

It seems at the end we just drafted LBs and CBs and hope to have a battle royale in camp to see who sticks. Should be interesting

It sure seems like a battle royale, but it could mean one of two other things. It couple mean what I want it to mean which would be that it’s a trading-royale where we swap old veteran material for new material whether future picks or young players or new veterans that do make sense to be here. Or it could mean that some of them land on the PS, which would suck because if a player can’t make the roster then that was a waste of a draft pick if he wasn’t worthy of being protected. I’m hoping for what I hope for the most every single year, and that’s the trading-royale of all players that aren’t needed due to a lack of a logical purpose.

[Icness]

I agree with the battle royal concept. There is need for young cheap depth after the last two drafts only had 5 players apiece and the cap is going to be an ongoing issue. Should make for an interesting summer camp. Better late-round picks than more expensive veterans that offer no greater upshot.

I'm hoping for another FA QB. Kellen Moore, I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Fortunately the Lions are only keeping two active QBs and if Stafford or Hill gets hurt they're going to sign a veteran.

Kellen Moore won all those games because of the scheme and talent around him. For every argument about his stellar record, imagine what a guy like RG3 or even Kirk Cousins would have accomplished in the same situation. Boise would never have lost, might not have had a game within 20 points. I've been to many postseason bowls (Senior Bowl, Shrine, etc.) and Moore has the weakest, lightest arm of any QB I've seen wtih the possible exception of Todd Reesing. When he guns the ball at his max velocity he really loses accuracy. I guess maybe the hope is that he and Titus Young can rekindle some of that magic. I won't hold my breath for that.

[TSE]

Arm strength can be worked on and improved, granted not overhauled. But more important than strength is accuracy. Justin Verlander and his 100 MPH fastballs help him to be the best pitcher in the game, but that doesn't mean there is no use for a guy like Tim Wakefield who throws around a 70 MPH fastball pretty successfully. You would think fast is better when trying to get the ball past opposing eyes and reaches, but if you can't then you can get creative with placement to accomplish your objective. If you put an 'x' on the field there are lots of angles and speeds and arcs that can all combine to hit that 'x'. Basketball players don't take long shots by rifling the ball through the air, it's an artform that is about touch. In football you may have increased odds of defenders getting into position on a slower ball, but you also have increased odds that the balls aren't dropped by the receiver. There are pros and cons to every style of delivering a football and at the end of the day, and there are multiple variations of sweet spots that you can arrive at. I don't care what level of football you are playing, but novice players as well as pros are going to catch footballs at a higher rate of the time when they are slow and easier to follow than when they are rifled in. It makes the hands of your receivers better and as long as you keep the ball out of the opposing team's hand, you can find a harmonious benefit.

Kellen Moore can be successful based on his measurables if he has the right coaches and the right playbook and scheme design that are tailored to the types of throws that he is best suited for.

[Piston Pete]

Is Kellen Moore a knuckleball-throwing QB?

Comparing him to Wakefield makes little-to-no sense.

[TSE]

It's not a comparison. It's an analogy, which is completely something different especially in this particular context. And if you have a problem with Wakefiled being a knuckleballer then you can pick one of the slower throwing fastball pitchers from baseball history of your choice to replace for a better analogy if you wish. How about Greg Maddux?

Here check this title and the sub-title to capture the spirit of my point:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espnmag/story?id=3336514

[Piston Pete]

Arm strength for a QB is important. Especially with defenses getting faster by the minute, it seems.

It makes little sense comparing any QB to a MLB pitcher. Its a pitcher's job to trick the batter. A pitcher doesn't need to have a super arm to be effective. They just have to be accurate, change speeds on multiple pitches, change locations (high/low, left/right), etc. A pitcher does not need to throw 95+ mph fastballs to be effective.

A QB's job is to get the ball to their reciever. A QB with a "lesser" arm will have trouble challenging defenses down the field, and will also have trouble zipping throws into tight windows. Arm strength does matter in the NFL - not so much in college.

[TSE]

Yeah I agree with all of that.

[TSE]

It should be an interesting battle to see if which guy wins a starting CB spot. I'm gonna pick Bentley, but Greenwood sure sounds like a great athlete and he could be an interesting defensive weapon with his size.

[ajaX82]

It should be an interesting battle to see if which guy wins a starting CB spot. I'm gonna pick Bentley, but Greenwood sure sounds like a great athlete and he could be an interesting defensive weapon with his size.

I think Greenwood is a pretty big project and would suspect he is a practice squad guy all year, getting molded by the coaches to play in a few. Bentley is a 4 year guy who should be able to jump right away into the slot

[Piston Pete]

Ice - do you know if the Lions plan on keeping all the CB's we drafted at CB? Looking at his szie, weight, and at how raw he is - do they plan on trying Greenwood out at S?

Also, with Reiff on board, any rumbling on whether or not they've considered moving Goz or Backus inside?

[Sheeeeed]

The Lions seemed high enough on Greewood to trade back into the 5th to get him. Gunther has been comparing him to Brandon Carr coming out of Grand Valley State. I think if he slipped down to practice squad he'd probably easily get poached by another team.