B1G Title Game: Bucky v PSU

[BUCKnation]

Chryst really needs to nail recruiting skill position players on both sides of the ball after this season. The safeties were fine, Shelton is normally solid, and Peavy is decent, but it really was the biggest weakness on the team and it was blatantly shown on Saturday.

[El Duderino]

I think like most, I'm most upset in the way we lost. Losing I can cope with - we've had a hell of a season and exceeded all expectations. I don't say that to be defeatist, but just honest. But again, the way we lost is just a punch in the gut, nuts, and shins. Just brutal. Our D got shredded by some bitch kid throwing up prayers. I mean props to them, it worked. I just can't believe it. Disbelief is the best word I can come up with.

I am generally in agreement with you but I had this same discussion with some friends on the matter. People are acting like a guy that just threw for 400 yards on 17 completions the previous week against a generally good defense (MSU, yes i know they suck this year) is "throwing up prayers" or maybe...you know, like, throwing up 1 on 1 balls to NFL receivers against non-NFL defenders? Maybe it looked like a prayer, but it was a pretty clear and reasonable strategy. And some of them were placed very well.

My few thoughts were

1. Penn St. had the type of skill/big play ability at WR which the Badgers badly lack. Alvarez when coach was always very heavy run first, yet he consistently managed to recruit skilled receiver talent.

2. Both Chryst on offense and Wilcox on defense seemed to be to conservative in that second half. The big plays by Penn St looked to scare Wilcox into mainly just rushing four with less blitzing, but that four man rush wasn't getting home and our DB's couldn't cover those receivers when McSorely had time to throw deep.

On offense we ran the ball pretty well all game, but in that second half, i was really wanting Chryst to try more play action on early downs in an attempt to make bigger plays downfield. It was mostly just run on 1st/2nd down and then when Penn St got us in 3rd and 4 or more where they knew we had to pass, their rush started getting home. The Penn St offense was gashing us for big plays and then we'd get the ball and try to match points by running nearly every down 3-7 yards a pop.

3. Why is Chryst almost always so conservative before halftime when the Badgers have the ball and multiple timeouts? Penn St got that TD to make it 28-14, but we had the ball around the 35-40 yard line with 40ish seconds left and three timeouts. Yet, Chryst just let the clock run out. That was annoying. IMO, that last 3 minutes of the first half lost the game.

[Kerb Hohl]

1. Penn St. had the type of skill/big play ability at WR which the Badgers badly lack. Alvarez when coach was always very heavy run first, yet he consistently managed to recruit skilled receiver talent.

There was a brief span where there was some great WR talent, but there were also many similar years.

Alvarez was there from 90-2005 and the list of super talent I'd say is:
-Chambers
-Evans

Pretty good talents:
-Donald Hayes
-Lee DeRamus
-Brandon Williams

There were obviously a host of good walk-on guys like Nick Davis and such but I'd say that those guys are matched by guys that Bielema, Andersen, and Chryst have had.

Bielema had:
Very good/good:
-Nick Toon

Abbredaris was a walk-on but he was so good I'd probably include him.

Andsersen barely even had time to really say he got any stud WRs but he struck out trying to get some in recruiting. George Rushing is OK but he thought he had a bunch of 4-stars that all busted, failed to qualify, or transferred. AJ Taylor may be a pretty good scat WR. Erickson was good but probably falls under Bielema and also was a walk-on, of course.

Chryst has had almost no time to judge on recruiting, but I don't see why if he coaches 15 years that he can't produce 2 high NFL draft picks and a couple mid-round guys.

This was just a really long-winded way of saying that Alvarez's receiving talent wasn't really that great over a long period of time. There have been many waves of good/great TEs (Bielema actually had a great run) but I don't think anyone is really complaining right now about Fumagalli/Penniston and a pretty solid list of guys on their way in. The rust belt barely produces good WRs, and if it does...good luck recruiting them over Ohio State, Penn State, hell...even maybe a team that passes more like Northwestern. It's pretty obvious that we'll have to luck out to get a 3rd tier guy that blows up from the south (Quintez Cephus may qualify for this in a few years).

On offense we ran the ball pretty well all game, but in that second half, i was really wanting Chryst to try more play action on early downs in an attempt to make bigger plays downfield.

I think this is a bit indicative of what we have. I watched them play most of the season and save for a long-developing out/corner that reached 20 yards in the air on 3rd and long or a tricky wheel route thrown back across the field, I'm not sure they threw the ball more than 20 yards in the air all season. Hornibrook obviously doesn't have a great arm for it, but it also must have to do a bit with the WRs.

That was a staple with Abby (speed to get over the top) and Stave had a pretty big arm. For whatever reason, we just didn't do with this personnel group.

[BUCKnation]

I think the Badgers have always had one go to guy that was probably NFL level and that was very reliable. These last two years have been a struggle as Peavy is only decent and not the most reliable receiver and the thing is too, he is probably way ahead of someone our number two right now (Wheelwright?), which doesn't help when you have relatively average QBs at this stage with Houston and Hornibrook.

[El Duderino]

1. Penn St. had the type of skill/big play ability at WR which the Badgers badly lack. Alvarez when coach was always very heavy run first, yet he consistently managed to recruit skilled receiver talent.

There was a brief span where there was some great WR talent, but there were also many similar years.

Alvarez was there from 90-2005 and the list of super talent I'd say is:
-Chambers
-Evans

Pretty good talents:
-Donald Hayes
-Lee DeRamus
-Brandon Williams

There were obviously a host of good walk-on guys like Nick Davis and such but I'd say that those guys are matched by guys that Bielema, Andersen, and Chryst have had.

You forgot Tony Simmons

Abbredaris and Erickson ended up being highly productive even though they were a walk-on, but since Alvarez has stepped down, outside of Toon, it's been a real dry spell in regards to recruited receivers who have turned out to be really good.

I will grant though that in pretty much every season Chryst has called the plays, at least one tight end was really productive and sometimes there were two.

It just was so noticeable in the talent at WR for Penn St compared to Wisconsin.

[RiotPunch]

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/202/467/365/

The only reason he was jazzed up about PSU is because they were making a huge comeback. He wanted his call to be memorable, and the only way that happens is if it's a tight game. No announcer wants to call a blowout.

FWIW, I don't think Gus is a great football announcer. The tedium that comes in between every play isn't suited to his style, which is like building towards a sportsgasm. He's a much better basketball guy.

It was more as a drunken joke than anything. But still, I'm not a fan.

[Kerb Hohl]

1. Penn St. had the type of skill/big play ability at WR which the Badgers badly lack. Alvarez when coach was always very heavy run first, yet he consistently managed to recruit skilled receiver talent.

There was a brief span where there was some great WR talent, but there were also many similar years.

Alvarez was there from 90-2005 and the list of super talent I'd say is:
-Chambers
-Evans

Pretty good talents:
-Donald Hayes
-Lee DeRamus
-Brandon Williams

There were obviously a host of good walk-on guys like Nick Davis and such but I'd say that those guys are matched by guys that Bielema, Andersen, and Chryst have had.

You forgot Tony Simmons

Abbredaris and Erickson ended up being highly productive even though they were a walk-on, but since Alvarez has stepped down, outside of Toon, it's been a real dry spell in regards to recruited receivers who have turned out to be really good.

I will grant though that in pretty much every season Chryst has called the plays, at least one tight end was really productive and sometimes there were two.

It just was so noticeable in the talent at WR for Penn St compared to Wisconsin.

Franklin and Penn State are at another level in terms of recruiting, style, and location. There's always the thought that the Badgers should now be reaching an elite recruiting level...but they're never going to recruit guys like PSU has. They're going to run the ball and get linemen, of course.

We're averaging one really good WR per 5 years since Alvarez took over. The Andersen years may have been the first time we didn't have one but it's somewhat understandable due to the turnover.

Point being, I don't think this is a huge drought. The Badgers have had less stud receivers than we think. Beilema made up for it with TEs outside of Toon, but I'm expecting maybe 1-2 legit NFL WRs in the next decade. That's just how it goes.

[MikeIsGood]

I think like most, I'm most upset in the way we lost. Losing I can cope with - we've had a hell of a season and exceeded all expectations. I don't say that to be defeatist, but just honest. But again, the way we lost is just a punch in the gut, nuts, and shins. Just brutal. Our D got shredded by some bitch kid throwing up prayers. I mean props to them, it worked. I just can't believe it. Disbelief is the best word I can come up with.

I am generally in agreement with you but I had this same discussion with some friends on the matter. People are acting like a guy that just threw for 400 yards on 17 completions the previous week against a generally good defense (MSU, yes i know they suck this year) is "throwing up prayers" or maybe...you know, like, throwing up 1 on 1 balls to NFL receivers against non-NFL defenders? Maybe it looked like a prayer, but it was a pretty clear and reasonable strategy. And some of them were placed very well.

Maybe. Not convinced that many of his throws weren't indeed prayers. Our defense was shredded in a way they haven't been all year, and this was not the first time we played "NFL talent." In fact, we've gone up against some very highly regarded WRs this year and have not had the same issues we did against PSU. But maybe said QBs, WRs, and coaches did not know to exploit that advantage, I guess.

Regardless, it certainly worked.

[MickeyDavis]

Chryst has been coach less than 2 years (hired 12=18-14), I'll give him 4-5 before really judging his recruits.