Packers News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - 2023 Off Season

[ReasonablySober]

Yea, you guys. Sitting a first round QB for years never works.

You can make half court 3s too. Doesn't mean it's smart to make that your normal approach.

Want a list of the recent first round QBs who played early and flamed out?

There isn't one tried and true method. When Love gets his chance we'll find out if the pick was good or not. It's pointless to debate right now.

[th87]

Yea, you guys. Sitting a first round QB for years never works.

You can make half court 3s too. Doesn't mean it's smart to make that your normal approach.

Want a list of the recent first round QBs who played early and flamed out?

There isn't one tried and true method. When Love gets his chance we'll find out if the pick was good or not. It's pointless to debate right now.

That proves playing early definitively causes flameouts? Or do they just suck?

I think one year to sit and learn is fine. Then your cap advantage vs. QB knowledge gained diminishes.

And there is no special advantage to sit behind a HOFer. What makes Rodgers special cannot be transferred.

Unless Love is also a HOFer, this pick was stupid. You can do the "sit and learn" approach at any point in the future with any first round QB, and it would make more sense to wait until Rodgers is gone. Maybe it doesn't slow-burn down the team then.

[ReasonablySober]

You can make half court 3s too. Doesn't mean it's smart to make that your normal approach.

Want a list of the recent first round QBs who played early and flamed out?

There isn't one tried and true method. When Love gets his chance we'll find out if the pick was good or not. It's pointless to debate right now.

That proves playing early definitively causes flameouts? Or do they just suck?

I think one year to sit and learn is fine. Then your cap advantage vs. QB knowledge gained diminishes.

And there is no special advantage to sit behind a HOFer. What makes Rodgers special cannot be transferred.

Unless Love is also a HOFer, this pick was stupid. You can do the "sit and learn" approach at any point in the future with any first round QB, and it would make more sense to wait until Rodgers is gone. Maybe it doesn't slow-burn down the team then.

What makes you say that so definitely? How many other QBs do you know of that sat for three-plus years behind a HOF QB to begin their careers?

[th87]

Want a list of the recent first round QBs who played early and flamed out?

There isn't one tried and true method. When Love gets his chance we'll find out if the pick was good or not. It's pointless to debate right now.

That proves playing early definitively causes flameouts? Or do they just suck?

I think one year to sit and learn is fine. Then your cap advantage vs. QB knowledge gained diminishes.

And there is no special advantage to sit behind a HOFer. What makes Rodgers special cannot be transferred.

Unless Love is also a HOFer, this pick was stupid. You can do the "sit and learn" approach at any point in the future with any first round QB, and it would make more sense to wait until Rodgers is gone. Maybe it doesn't slow-burn down the team then.

What makes you say that so definitely? How many other QBs do you know of that sat for three-plus years behind a HOF QB to begin their careers?

Well, are there secrets they are imparting that their coaches don't know?

[ReasonablySober]

That proves playing early definitively causes flameouts? Or do they just suck?

I think one year to sit and learn is fine. Then your cap advantage vs. QB knowledge gained diminishes.

And there is no special advantage to sit behind a HOFer. What makes Rodgers special cannot be transferred.

Unless Love is also a HOFer, this pick was stupid. You can do the "sit and learn" approach at any point in the future with any first round QB, and it would make more sense to wait until Rodgers is gone. Maybe it doesn't slow-burn down the team then.

What makes you say that so definitely? How many other QBs do you know of that sat for three-plus years behind a HOF QB to begin their careers?

Well, are there secrets they are imparting that their coaches don't know?

Sure. Let Rodgers tell you:

“I have a lot of love for Favrey,” Rodgers said. “And, again, a lot of gratitude for the time I got to spend watching him. Not a lot of young quarterbacks are blessed with the opportunity to go to a team with a first-ballot Hall of Famer in the same room, and to get to watch and learn for three years. Somebody asked me the other day, 'Do you think things would have turned out the way they did if you’d been a starter in Year 1?' The obvious competitor in you, and the confidence and the ego, say, 'Of course. Of course. I definitely would have turned out this way.'

“But I think the human element, and the observer, and the gratitude is understanding things happen the way they happen to allow me to get in this position.

“Ultimately that’s what was best for me,” Rodgers said, “not just to be able to learn behind Brett, but to be picked by this organization. To kind of have a resettling of the ego and the competitive drive and the work ethic of, OK, now I’m in the room for the first time in my life with a guy who’s better than me. He throws it better. His mastery of the system is better. Instincts are better, pocket presence is better. And that was great for me because I really got to see exactly what I needed to work on in order to become great. Because my dreams and my aspirations and my drive was to be great."

Who knows if Love is as much of a sponge was Rodgers seemed to be. If Love has actually gotten better by sitting. We don't know. But I doubt you can make the case that it's actually hurt his development.

[jute2003]

Yup. Said it last night. If you're looking for reasons to fire Gute (and/or Murphy), then their handling of Rodgers is Exhibit A, B, and C.

I don't know....I'm not sure there was a right way to deal with Rodgers. I think it's very possible that the biggest mistake they made was not trading him when they had the chance.

[ReasonablySober]

Yup. Said it last night. If you're looking for reasons to fire Gute (and/or Murphy), then their handling of Rodgers is Exhibit A, B, and C.

I don't know....I'm not sure there was a right way to deal with Rodgers. I think it's very possible that the biggest mistake they made was not trading him when they had the chance.

That's what I mean. He should have been traded, not given a monster deal.

[leroyjw10]

Yup. Said it last night. If you're looking for reasons to fire Gute (and/or Murphy), then their handling of Rodgers is Exhibit A, B, and C.

I don't know....I'm not sure there was a right way to deal with Rodgers. I think it's very possible that the biggest mistake they made was not trading him when they had the chance.

That's what I mean. He should have been traded, not given a monster deal.

Hindsight is 20/20 and all, but trading Rodgers to Denver for that Russell Wilson haul (and prob then some), is sure looking good right about now. Granted, Gute would've just used those picks on underachieving defenders, but still.

[rilamann]

Yup. Said it last night. If you're looking for reasons to fire Gute (and/or Murphy), then their handling of Rodgers is Exhibit A, B, and C.

His draft record is pretty poor too. Let’s look at his trade ups:

Jaire
Burks
Savage
Love
Amari
Watson

Very possible we get one legit stud out of 6 trade ups.

3rd rounders:

Burks
Sternberger
Degaura
Amari
Rhyan

Zero guys you can even argue should start on any team.

I was going to say, I agree not trading Rodgers during the 2021 off-season is probably 1A, but Gute's draft record would be 1B if you were looking to fire Gute.

Sure, he's hit on a couple picks, but if you let anyone on this board be the Packer's GM for 5 drafts, we'd probably hit on the same number of picks just by dumb luck.

[rilamann]

Rodgers is coming off an MVP season so you could get a ton for him. But Rodgers is also at that age where he might be washed up in another year or two. This would be the perfect time to trade. I'd almost consider the Packers dumb not to trade him right now.

My post from April 29, 2021 and most here felt the same way at that time.

So it's not really 20/20 hindsight looking back on it now. We just have a really bad front office, Packers have had a really bad front office for a long time. I honestly think a number of people who post on this board could do a better job than the people who are actually on the Packer's pay roll.

[MickeyDavis]

What makes you say that so definitely? How many other QBs do you know of that sat for three-plus years behind a HOF QB to begin their careers?

Well, are there secrets they are imparting that their coaches don't know?

Sure. Let Rodgers tell you:

“I have a lot of love for Favrey,” Rodgers said. “And, again, a lot of gratitude for the time I got to spend watching him. Not a lot of young quarterbacks are blessed with the opportunity to go to a team with a first-ballot Hall of Famer in the same room, and to get to watch and learn for three years. Somebody asked me the other day, 'Do you think things would have turned out the way they did if you’d been a starter in Year 1?' The obvious competitor in you, and the confidence and the ego, say, 'Of course. Of course. I definitely would have turned out this way.'

“But I think the human element, and the observer, and the gratitude is understanding things happen the way they happen to allow me to get in this position.

“Ultimately that’s what was best for me,” Rodgers said, “not just to be able to learn behind Brett, but to be picked by this organization. To kind of have a resettling of the ego and the competitive drive and the work ethic of, OK, now I’m in the room for the first time in my life with a guy who’s better than me. He throws it better. His mastery of the system is better. Instincts are better, pocket presence is better. And that was great for me because I really got to see exactly what I needed to work on in order to become great. Because my dreams and my aspirations and my drive was to be great."

Who knows if Love is as much of a sponge was Rodgers seemed to be. If Love has actually gotten better by sitting. We don't know. But I doubt you can make the case that it's actually hurt his development.

Bingo. Asked and answered, no spin required.

[th87]

Well, are there secrets they are imparting that their coaches don't know?

Sure. Let Rodgers tell you:

“I have a lot of love for Favrey,” Rodgers said. “And, again, a lot of gratitude for the time I got to spend watching him. Not a lot of young quarterbacks are blessed with the opportunity to go to a team with a first-ballot Hall of Famer in the same room, and to get to watch and learn for three years. Somebody asked me the other day, 'Do you think things would have turned out the way they did if you’d been a starter in Year 1?' The obvious competitor in you, and the confidence and the ego, say, 'Of course. Of course. I definitely would have turned out this way.'

“But I think the human element, and the observer, and the gratitude is understanding things happen the way they happen to allow me to get in this position.

“Ultimately that’s what was best for me,” Rodgers said, “not just to be able to learn behind Brett, but to be picked by this organization. To kind of have a resettling of the ego and the competitive drive and the work ethic of, OK, now I’m in the room for the first time in my life with a guy who’s better than me. He throws it better. His mastery of the system is better. Instincts are better, pocket presence is better. And that was great for me because I really got to see exactly what I needed to work on in order to become great. Because my dreams and my aspirations and my drive was to be great."

Who knows if Love is as much of a sponge was Rodgers seemed to be. If Love has actually gotten better by sitting. We don't know. But I doubt you can make the case that it's actually hurt his development.

Bingo. Asked and answered, no spin required.

I agree, no rookie should probably start in year 1. The jump is too much.

But if this is not a feel-good answer for the media, let's pull up his points:
- he needed to be humbled
- he realized his QB attributes are not as good as they should be

Is this something that can't be obtained without an extended apprenticeship under a HOFer? I almost think Ryan Fitzpatrick or Tony Romo (unheralded guys who managed to overcome limitations to carve out a career) would be better teachers than "naturals" and top prospects.

[RRyder823]

Sure. Let Rodgers tell you:



Who knows if Love is as much of a sponge was Rodgers seemed to be. If Love has actually gotten better by sitting. We don't know. But I doubt you can make the case that it's actually hurt his development.

Bingo. Asked and answered, no spin required.

I agree, no rookie should probably start in year 1. The jump is too much.

But if this is not a feel-good answer for the media, let's pull up his points:
- he needed to be humbled
- he realized his QB attributes are not as good as they should be

Is this something that can't be obtained without an extended apprenticeship under a HOFer? I almost think Ryan Fitzpatrick or Tony Romo (unheralded guys who managed to overcome limitations to carve out a career) would be better teachers than "naturals" and top prospects.

I actually agree with the last paragraph you wrote. Guys that made it without a ton of natural talent tend to make better teachers.

In the case of Rodgers specifically. His mechanics were reworked from his time in college and there's very little guarantee those changes take hold the way they did if he only had say a year to work on them before the bullets started flying for real.

By that I mean until something is fully ingrained and second nature once a player starts feeling the pressure there's a natural subconscious impulse to revert to what's more familiar and it can/could take more then a year to get to that point

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[Soca]

Is that what the Packer company line is now, that the team had no chance of competing in 2022?

And is that why they re-signed Rodgers to that big new extension?

Cuz when Murphy announced he was retiring (in 3 years) this summer, he sure made it seem like he expected Green Bay to be a contending team this season:

“It has been an honor and a privilege to serve as the Packers president,” wrote Murphy. “I plan on making the last three years as successful as possible, with multiple Super Bowl championships!”

https://zonecoverage.com/2022/packers/the-packers-are-too-stubborn-to-be-sellers-at-the-trade-deadline/

I guess he was talking about bring home Lombardi Trophies in 2023 and 2024.

What a joke.

This was gonna a retooling year no matter what. Doesn't matter what you think or what the PR statements were (honestly it's sad you thought that was somehow a good point).

If you thought this team was a contender comming into this year or that they could've been "if they just did x" that's a you issue.[/b]

Really I have no idea why you follow this team. I can't imagine a scenerio with this team where you aren't bitching about something. Move on and enjoy life a little more

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If anyone thinks the Green Bay Packers signed 38 year-old Aaron Rodgers to a $200 million extension in May that made him the highest-paid player in NFL history [b]coming into this season as part of a REBUILD, with a 2020 1st and 4th round QB already on the roster, they are either blithering idiots or Gutey's doting mother.[/b]

There is no scenario in which Packers management could possibly spin 2022 as a planned rebuilding season. Not one.

That said, if unconditional loyalty to misguided management makes you feel like a true and better Packer "fan" than those fans who want the team to get back to another Super Bowl, it is a free country and have at it.

But perhaps, while reflexively deflecting blame away from management for its failures, you might try not bitching so much about fans who do not share your enthusiasm for the direction of the soon to be 3-5 Packers and getting out and enjoying life more (or even reading a little more to enhance your ability to spell basic words).

Agreed. No way this was considered a retooling year.

[vegaspacker]

There's been a few Michael Thomas to the Pack rumors in the Yahoo FF chat rooms.

Maybe he's being a diva and not playing. Either way, a guy who's injured or recovering is not a quick fix.

Was a beast, might not ever regain that form. Seriously though, when he could go.. he was it.

A 5th or a fourth for him, whatevs. We are most likely doomed as fans for a bit.

[tski1972]

We should be trading players, not acquiring them.

[humanrefutation]

We're still only one game out of the playoffs and with Rodgers and all of the other expensive vets that we just signed to extensions, this team is clearly in win-now mode. There's exactly a zero percent chance that they're going to sell, IMO.

I expect them to bring in a reciever, one way or another. My dream would be DJ Moore, but I don't think Carolina will move him.

[Frank Nova]

Packers are further away than just a WR but this team can still realistically contend in a wide open conference. The defense stinks in the middle on both levels. Campbell looks like a guy that was randomly cut 2yrs ago and both safeties have been abysmal. If we were gonna make some splashy move it should’ve been for Roquan Smith but im sure no one wants to hear that tho.

DE, S and LB are all more pressing needs than WR in a real football world for the packers right now. Daniel Jones and Saquan Barkley are winning games with trash bag WRs so how isn’t Aaron Rodgers and Aaron Jones having similar success winning games?

Stack the defense, run the ball, turn Rodgers back into a glorified game manager instead of a perceived savior and go win some **** games.

[Treebeard]

We're still only one game out of the playoffs and with Rodgers and all of the other expensive vets that we just signed to extensions, this team is clearly in win-now mode. There's exactly a zero percent chance that they're going to sell, IMO.

I expect them to bring in a reciever, one way or another. My dream would be DJ Moore, but I don't think Carolina will move him.

Honestly, I'm not seeing enough chance for a turnaround to even eke in as a wild card. Dallas and the Giants have better odds at this point, and the Rams, and Niners are more realistic darkhorse (IMO) to have a remote shot at a wild card. This is nowhere near as good of a team as we were expecting (most of us anyways...)

I will agree that the Packer FO has sunk their job future on making a SB run, however unlikely that was, so buckle up for a head-scratcher desperation roster move or two yet today.....

[WeekapaugGroove]

Packers are further away than just a WR but this team can still realistically contend in a wide open conference. The defense stinks in the middle on both levels. Campbell looks like a guy that was randomly cut 2yrs ago and both safeties have been abysmal. If we were gonna make some splashy move it should’ve been for Roquan Smith but im sure no one wants to hear that tho.

DE, S and LB are all more pressing needs than WR in a real football world for the packers right now. Daniel Jones and Saquan Barkley are winning games with trash bag WRs so how isn’t Aaron Rodgers and Aaron Jones having similar success winning games?

Stack the defense, run the ball, turn Rodgers back into a glorified game manager instead of a perceived savior and go win some **** games.

Throwing anymore resources at this **** defense would be criminal.

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