Week 8: Non-Packers

[LUKE23]

So Finley was worth 2.05 PPG last season by your own measure.

I counted the Redskins game as without him because he didn't play 90% of the game. I also have used since the beginning of 2009 for the calcs, as that is when he started seeing the field. That's 43 games. And the comparison is a relevant one, because our offensive weapons have been pretty consistent the last three years.

2. He hasn't produced at an elite level.

How so? If we're only measuring on individual catches/yards, we need to trade him right now for Fred Davis.

[chuckleslove]

Jamal Charles is another guy that changes his team's offense when he's on the field and is probably their best player.

Yeah for me he is in that second level right with Foster that might be a special player. But he isn't healthy right now so not really debating him

Chuck, all we're saying is that it isn't the least valuable position outside of K/P.

I'll listen to any other debate, really.

I agree with that, but running backs outside of AP and maybe Foster and Charles are literally a dime a dozen.

Just look at the next 20 starting running backs in the NFL and they are largely interchangeable which makes them not all that valuable to me. Not that they don't have an impact on a game to game basis sometimes a large one, but you could largely swap those guys out from team to team and not miss a beat.

I think saying they are least important next to K/P/ST is over the top but its closer to reality than saying RBs are a huge impact on the game nowadays.

[Kerb Hohl]

When CJ2K was rolling, you can't say that he wasn't a major impact. You can't put up those kind of numbers without being a massive impact. Something else is going on there, and part of it is line play.

[chuckleslove]

So Finley was worth 2.05 PPG last season by your own measure.

I counted the Redskins game as without him because he didn't play 90% of the game. I also have used since the beginning of 2009 for the calcs, as that is when he started seeing the field. That's 43 games. And the comparison is a relevant one, because our offensive weapons have been pretty consistent the last three years.

2. He hasn't produced at an elite level.

How so? If we're only measuring on individual catches/yards, we need to trade him right now for Fred Davis.

Our skill positions have largely remained the same over the last few seasons(Rodgers, Jennings, Driver, Nelson, Jones) but our offensive line has been anything but consistent over that period, neither has the running back position.

[chuckleslove]

When CJ2K was rolling, you can't say that he wasn't a major impact. You can't put up those kind of numbers without being a massive impact. Something else is going on there, and part of it is line play.

When he was I said it was mostly his OL personally. He was getting some huge holes and when he is in shape he is stupid fast so all it took was a little hole and he could explode through it, when he got a hole big enough to drive a car through it was off to the races.

[LUKE23]

Our skill positions have largely remained the same over the last few seasons(Rodgers, Jennings, Driver, Nelson, Jones) but our offensive line has been anything but consistent over that period, neither has the running back position.

It's been close enough to use a comparison. We've had the least turnover on offense of pretty much any team in the league since 2009.

[Newz]

Also, I'm not saying RB is just some position that has no impact on the game. I just think it's the least important position.

For example, AP is the best RB. I'd trade him for the best player at any non-K/P position. That's really just how I feel about running backs and running the ball in general in the NFL now. I just don't view it as important.

Due to his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield and pass block, I might honestly take Matt Forte at this point over AP.

Just like how Grendon believes C is the least important position in the league. I'm sure he doesn't think Pouncey is totally worthless or anything like that though.

I think another thing that adds to RBs lack of value is that they seem to always burn out quick and have short careers... because that's just the way the position is. So even if you have an elite RB they seem like they burn out faster than other players.

[LUKE23]

For example, AP is the best RB. I'd trade him for the best player at any non-K/P position.

Hilarious.

[PkrsBcksGphsMqt]

I could understand someone saying that the quality of the offensive line play as a whole is more important than a single RB, but I think a good RB is much more valuable than just a single offensive lineman. A single offensive lineman will never affect a game like Demarco Murray did a couple of weeks ago.

[Kerb Hohl]

How many centers can you name that are elite other than Mangold, Pouncey? Again, they are all a dime-a-dozen after the top, too.

I'd take the 15th best RB straight up in a trade for the 15th best C. And G.

[Newz]

Hilarious.

I don't really see why.

The only arguments you guys have are "PEOPLE DON'T GAMEPLAN AROUND CENTERS!!!!". Well they don't gameplan around left tackles either, so the **** what?

Or "NO GM IN THE NFL WOULD DO THAT!!!11!1"... Okay?

Or "Hilarious.".

Yeah, you got me. Great arguments. I type out reasons for how I feel and you just dismiss them as 'Hilarious' without even having a reason.

[Kerb Hohl]

Did you just say you'd trade Rodgers for AP?

[LUKE23]

Tackle is the only spot it is even a discussion. A studly T has more value than a studly RB. But any guard or C vs. elite RB? No.

[PkrsBcksGphsMqt]

I'm sure the Vikings would rather have Steve Hutchinson than Adrian Peterson.

[Newz]

A single offensive lineman will never affect a game like Demarco Murray did a couple of weeks ago.

You realize that part of the reason he played so well is likely due to incredibly performances from their offensive line... right?

[PkrsBcksGphsMqt]

A single offensive lineman will never affect a game like Demarco Murray did a couple of weeks ago.

You realize that part of the reason he played so well is likely due to incredibly performances from their offensive line... right?

Why have the rest of the Cowboys RBs struggled this year? You can't just say a RB played well because of the offensive line. A RB needs to have some elite break away speed if he is going to break a franchise record held by the greatest RB in the history of the league (statistically at least).

[Newz]

A single offensive lineman will never affect a game like Demarco Murray did a couple of weeks ago.

You realize that part of the reason he played so well is likely due to incredibly performances from their offensive line... right?

Why have the rest of the Cowboys RBs struggled this year?

He played well in one game.

Why have they performed so badly? Likely due to bad offensive line play. It certainly doesn't have to due with any of them lacking talent as Jones, Choice and Murray are all pretty good.

[LUKE23]

Dallas' offensive line is terrible.

[PkrsBcksGphsMqt]

It certainly doesn't have to due with any of them lacking talent as Jones, Choice and Murray are all pretty good.

Lulz. That's why they cut Choice, right?

[Kerb Hohl]

I'm an offensive line produces a lot of good RBs opinion guy myself, but RB isn't close to the least important position. There are also very good/dynamic ones.