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I think I'll go for a little bit of each.

Definitley MM and Bob Sanders deserve the most blame.

Who in the hell voted as us being a "flash in the pan last year"? That's delusional.

mbucks22 wrote:Who in the hell voted as us being a "flash in the pan last year"? That's delusional.

We won three regular season games against teams with a winning record. Two of the wins came with the help of fluke fumble recoveries. Against the only two upper-echelon teams we faced, NY and Dallas, we looked like we didn't belong on the field. We returned all but one starter and are sitting at 5-8. You tell me if we were legit.

I don't necessarily think it's any one thing, but that was the closest option on the list in my opinion.

mbucks22 wrote:Who in the hell voted as us being a "flash in the pan last year"? That's delusional.

You obviously voted to put the blame on TT.

I voted for MM and the coaching staff, although the players should be right behind them. 5 games lost of 4 or less, lays right on the coaching staff. Although they cannot help the LB's cover people on the last drive of the game . . . . . .

DrugBust wrote:

mbucks22 wrote:Who in the hell voted as us being a "flash in the pan last year"? That's delusional.

We won three regular season games against teams with a winning record. Two of the wins came with the help of fluke fumble recoveries. Against the only two upper-echelon teams we faced, NY and Dallas, we looked like we didn't belong on the field. We returned all but one starter and are sitting at 5-8. You tell me if we were legit.

I don't necessarily think it's any one thing, but that was the closest option on the list in my opinion.

+1

Well, if we were a flash in the pan last year, then its really on Thompson.

How long is this rebuilding job, then officially?

Coaching ... penalties have absolutely killed us this year and this shows how undisciplined we are

There is blame enough to go around for everyone but I feel that coaching has really been a major letdown this year. I have always hated Bob Sanders, was given a job by default that he never earned, he is not bright and is horrible at making alterations during the game. How many times today did we see press coverage and the entire middle of the field wide open? That is absolutely absurd, he just isn't bright enough to match wits with the more intelligent coordinators. McCarthy has been weak many times this year as well, when Tausher left you had to realize his awful back-up was coming into the game, did he give him any kind of help? He left a scrub who was going to be cut, if not for an injury, on an island to get humiliated all day long. In this league it is a razor thin line between winning and losing, the lack of discipline (penalties) have killed this team.

Jollay wrote:Well, if we were a flash in the pan last year, then its really on Thompson.

How long is this rebuilding job, then officially?

Yep

If some want to keep implying that last year was largely a fluke built on beating bad teams and this year is more the true example of the talent on the team, then they are basically saying that TT hasn't built a good team yet in four years as GM.

One thing is very obvious though, the front seven on defense is a mess and needs a big infusion of talent, skill, and athletic ability.

I blame O.J.

Last year I think everything went right for this team. This season I think nearly everything has gone wrong. The truth is somewhere in between. We're a good team capable of contending for the division, but that's something you can say for about a dozen teams in the NFl. Good, not great and certainly not awful. We lack the superstar, All-Pro type talent that the very best teams have. Whether it's through free agency, or more likely the draft, we need to hit a home run on both sides of the ball.

DrugBust wrote:Last year I think everything went right for this team.

I don't

Last year the team was in it's share of close games, but they made plays to win games. I think on offense, some of that was simply Favre having a special season. He made big plays late in close contests that won games. While Rodgers has played well and i'm very excited about his future, he just hasn't been able to do things to win tight games late as Favre did. Granted, there were circumstances at times late in games that Rodgers can't be faulted for.

On defense, it was a mix of poor decisions/talent evaluations by Ted and bad luck injury wise that helped turn a defense that could get big stops last year into one that couldn't this year. Not having KGB, Jenkins, or C. Williams like we had last year and replaced with anything near as productive has been devastating to the defense.

Yea we didn't beat a lot of really good teams last season, but that's the case of most big winning teams. You need to feast and take advantage of the poor and average NFL teams, then finish around .500 vs the tough teams. Do that, you'll win 10-13 games.

El Duderino wrote:

DrugBust wrote:Last year I think everything went right for this team.

I don't

OK.

El Duderino wrote:

DrugBust wrote:Last year I think everything went right for this team.

I don't

Last year the team was in it's share of close games, but they made plays to win games. I think on offense, some of that was simply Favre having a special season. He made big plays late in close contests that won games. While Rodgers has played well and i'm very excited about his future, he just hasn't been able to do things to win tight games late as Favre did. Granted, there were circumstances at times late in games that Rodgers can't be faulted for.

On defense, it was a mix of poor decisions/talent evaluations by Ted and bad luck injury wise that helped turn a defense that could get big stops last year into one that couldn't this year. Not having KGB, Jenkins, or C. Williams like we had last year and replaced with anything near as productive has been devastating to the defense.

Yea we didn't beat a lot of really good teams last season, but that's the case of most big winning teams. You need to feast and take advantage of the poor and average NFL teams, then finish around .500 vs the tough teams. Do that, you'll win 10-13 games.

Unfortunately Favre can no longer do the things late in games that Favre used to do, the Packers second round pick is now in serious jeapordy, but it is after Thanksgiving............

That cold weather argument about Favre is BS. Seemed kind of cold in Green Bay today and Favre wasn't there to lose it for us. I think it has more to do with the coach. They don't practice outside when its cold. And there was something in the paper about MM wanting to heat the practice field the other day. I don't think its a Favre thing I think its a Packer thing. Just look at our record at home recently.

xTitan wrote:

El Duderino wrote:

DrugBust wrote:Last year I think everything went right for this team.

I don't

Last year the team was in it's share of close games, but they made plays to win games. I think on offense, some of that was simply Favre having a special season. He made big plays late in close contests that won games. While Rodgers has played well and i'm very excited about his future, he just hasn't been able to do things to win tight games late as Favre did. Granted, there were circumstances at times late in games that Rodgers can't be faulted for.

On defense, it was a mix of poor decisions/talent evaluations by Ted and bad luck injury wise that helped turn a defense that could get big stops last year into one that couldn't this year. Not having KGB, Jenkins, or C. Williams like we had last year and replaced with anything near as productive has been devastating to the defense.

Yea we didn't beat a lot of really good teams last season, but that's the case of most big winning teams. You need to feast and take advantage of the poor and average NFL teams, then finish around .500 vs the tough teams. Do that, you'll win 10-13 games.

Unfortunately Favre can no longer do the things late in games that Favre used to do, the Packers second round pick is now in serious jeapordy, but it is after Thanksgiving............

you called it

Unfortunately Favre can no longer do the things late in games that Favre used to do, the Packers second round pick is now in serious jeapordy, but it is after Thanksgiving............

I don't doubt that at all. I said after last year ended, Brett in those very cold weather games looked like i do now in the cold. A mix of despising living here and wanting to get out of the cold ASAP. That along with liking Rodgers talent was why i was fine with TT telling Brett it was over in Green Bay. Aaron needed to get on the field and Favre's days of excelling in the cold were done with.

That said, a season is 16 weeks long and games in September, October, and early November count in the standings to determine who makes the playoffs. Last year, Favre had 4-5 regular season games where he came through big time late in those games/OT when we needed a big TD pass or long drive for a score to tie or win games. Aaron has had some similar chances and couldn't get it done. Now it's quite possible that Brett wouldn't have been able to repeat all those late game clutch plays if he had played here another season, but i don't see how anyone could objectively say that Favre's clutch play late in games last year didn't play a sizable role in finishing with 13 wins and/or Rodgers inability to do some of the the same wouldn't have resulted in another win or two.

Rodgers was a first year starter and did well overall as a first year starter, plus he's very skilled. In the future i expect him to do much better in these pressure packed 3 minutes or less left situations where he needs to quickly get the team downfield and producing needed points. Aaron didn't suffer through to many first year starting QB growing pains, that shows his abilities. Getting game tying/winning points was one though.

I think the cold weather is one(not the only) of the reasons Favre wanted to go to Minnesota so much. He would be playing in a dome, although he's always sucked in domes, I think now at this stage of his career, he would rather play in a dome. I really don't expect the Jets to do anything in the playoffs, that's if they get there, and Favre's recent playoff struggles and the cold are two of the reasons why.

El Duderino wrote:

Unfortunately Favre can no longer do the things late in games that Favre used to do, the Packers second round pick is now in serious jeapordy, but it is after Thanksgiving............

I don't doubt that at all. I said after last year ended, Brett in those very cold weather games looked like i do now in the cold. A mix of despising living here and wanting to get out of the cold ASAP. That along with liking Rodgers talent was why i was fine with TT telling Brett it was over in Green Bay. Aaron needed to get on the field and Favre's days of excelling in the cold were done with.

That said, a season is 16 weeks long and games in September, October, and early November count in the standings to determine who makes the playoffs. Last year, Favre had 4-5 regular season games where he came through big time late in those games/OT when we needed a big TD pass or long drive for a score to tie or win games. Aaron has had some similar chances and couldn't get it done. Now it's quite possible that Brett wouldn't have been able to repeat all those late game clutch plays if he had played here another season, but i don't see how anyone could objectively say that Favre's clutch play late in games last year didn't play a sizable role in finishing with 13 wins and/or Rodgers inability to do some of the the same wouldn't have resulted in another win or two.

Rodgers was a first year starter and did well overall as a first year starter, plus he's very skilled. In the future i expect him to do much better in these pressure packed 3 minutes or less left situations where he needs to quickly get the team downfield and producing needed points. Aaron didn't suffer through to many first year starting QB growing pains, that shows his abilities. Getting game tying/winning points was one though.

Also, I remember in 2005 and 2006 that we were in a lot of close games and we couldn't get it done. So maybe next year something clicks with Arod and this team and we go 13-3 again, who knows. But most of last year's success had to do with Grant being consistently good after he got his chance, it's amazing what a consistent running game can do for a quarterback.