No Negotiations With Granger

[count55]

They can talk about them as targets for a trade without violating anything, though "talking about them" is kind of loose language. I think it's been widely reported that the Blazers were interested in trading for Danny last season (and may have even approached the Pacers about it), so it's not unreasonable to say that Danny is a target of the Blazers without any kind of tampering.

[CableKC]

greenway84 or Pacer Forum Mods.....you should change the title to "Negotiations haven't started with Granger yet".

The title is misleading since it implies that there are "No negotiions with Granger" or that there will be "No negotiations with Granger" regarding any extension.... as opposed to none have started yet.

I agree with PacerPerspective......we know that there will be some talks regarding an Extension.....it's just that I can see that TPTB are likely focusing on moving Tinsley first.

[CableKC]

The Pacers better extend him this Summer or face having to match a max deal from the Blazers next year.

The Blazers will have max cap room next year, have a hole at SF and have specifically mentioned Granger as a player they really like. And they have by far the wealthiest NBA owner, so money is no limitation.

Exactly...this is what I am worried about....I really hope that TPTB extend Granger before the start of the Preseason games ( by late September ).

I don't want the Blazers to get their money-laden hands on Granger and be stuck in the same position as the Warriors were this offseason.

[CableKC]

Take it for what it's worth, but Granger has improved every year, and is a tremendous player. He may not be Josh Smith talent level, but he's a very smart teammate and makes up for it. Around $11 million a year is probably about right for a guy like Granger. He's pretty much the exact same as Luol Deng, but older and has not had a set-back season yet.

I would have ZERO problem starting Granger off with a straight-up $12 mil a year contract for 5 seasons....or even go the Monta Ellis route with a slightly lower contract at $11 mil for 5 years with incentives going up to $13 mil a year over 5 years.

I just want him signed before the start of the offseason. I REALLLLLY HOPE that the Simons/Morway/Bird aren't like the Hawks and Rick Sund where they not only low-ball their top FA......they p*ss him off in the process.

I really hope that they get it done quick and fast.....go straight to the 11-12 mil contract and get it done.

[CableKC]

The Pacers better extend him this Summer or face having to match a max deal from the Blazers next year.

The Blazers will have max cap room next year, have a hole at SF and have specifically mentioned Granger as a player they really like. And they have by far the wealthiest NBA owner, so money is no limitation.

What's the MAX Level deal that the Blazers or any other team then the Pacers can offer him?

Are we talking about a $14 mil for 5 year type deal?

I'm guessing that the Pacers can offer a $12 mil per season / 6 year....which would be comprable to a $14.5 mil a year / 5 year deal for the Blazers.

[count55]

The Pacers better extend him this Summer or face having to match a max deal from the Blazers next year.

The Blazers will have max cap room next year, have a hole at SF and have specifically mentioned Granger as a player they really like. And they have by far the wealthiest NBA owner, so money is no limitation.

What's the MAX Level deal that the Blazers or any other team then the Pacers can offer him?

Are we talking about a $14 mil for 5 year type deal?

I'm guessing that the Pacers can offer a $12 mil per season / 6 year....which would be comprable to a $14.5 mil a year / 5 year deal for the Blazers.

Well, assuming the normal 5% salary cap increase, then the max contract that Portland would be able to offer would be a 5yr, $92mm deal, starting at about $15.2, and increasing at 10.5% a year, averaging out at around $18.4mm

If Danny signed that offer sheet, the Pacers would have to match that exactly (5/92). If, simultaneously, the Pacers were to offer 6/72 while Portland offered 5/70, Danny would sign the 5/70, then the Pacers would have to match that, exactly as written, or let him go.

No one will view the same or similar money over more years as equal. If, in your example, Portland were to offer 5/70, then a 6/72 contract would not be comparable, it would be worse. A comparable contract for the Pacers would be 6/84.

[CableKC]

Well, assuming the normal 5% salary cap increase, then the max contract that Portland would be able to offer would be a 5yr, $92mm deal, starting at about $15.2, and increasing at 10.5% a year, averaging out at around $18.4mm

If Danny signed that offer sheet, the Pacers would have to match that exactly (5/92). If, simultaneously, the Pacers were to offer 6/72 while Portland offered 5/70, Danny would sign the 5/70, then the Pacers would have to match that, exactly as written, or let him go.

No one will view the same or similar money over more years as equal. If, in your example, Portland were to offer 5/70, then a 6/72 contract would not be comparable, it would be worse. A comparable contract for the Pacers would be 6/84.

Wow.....I would be stunned if the Blazers offered Granger a MAX contract at $92 mil for 5 seasons.

IF they want to make him an offer for that much.....then they can have him. Granger is not worth an average of $18.2 mil a season for 5 seasons.

JD45, since you're from the Blazers board....does that 5 year / $92 mil contract offer from the Blazers sound right as the MAX offer that the Blazers can offer? I know that Paul Allen has no problem spending $$$ to improve the team....but Granger would likely be a 2nd/3rd scoring option on the team....where he would get as many touches as Oden/Bayless but likely less touches then Roy as the #1 scoring option on the team.

[Bucky O'Hare]

Iguodala just got 6/$80M from the 76ers.

[Scoot McGroot]

Iguodala just got 6/$80M from the 76ers.

I think Iggy is widely viewed as to be worth a bit more financially than Granger.


I think this is actually a good offseason for Granger to come up for extension. There's so many other SF/PF's that have hit the market this offseason that his value is pretty much already fleshed out for him. It seems like something between 6/$72M and 5/$55M is about the market value set out. Sounds about right for me, and right at a decent to good long-term price for us.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

I played in that GM game over in the trade forums and the value around the league - at least from other teams fans is that Granger is the most rounded SF in the NBA outside of LeBron James.

I would give Granger whatever we need to keep him. I'm fine with overpaying to keep him, now 18 million is too much, but even Portland won't offer him that. If Portland offers him the max, they will have to offer the rest of their players maxes and when it all catches up to them it will screw them over. I don't care what anyone else says, the NBA would change rules if Portland just offers everyone maxes and pays the luxury tax without hesitating.

The Pacers need to lock Granger up, he is the perfect base to build our team around. From what I gathered around that GM game is that most people would rather have Granger for a long term answer than Josh Smith, Luol Deng, Andre Iguadala, and so on. I would even rather have Granger than Melo, Granger offers so much on both sides of the floor and Melo doesn't and doesn't even have an attitude that Melo carries or the off the court problems.. I am fine with being called a homer for that assessment, but the fact is Granger is the perfect player to build a team around. He does everything, he scores, he rebounds, he plays defense, he is a model citizen, he has the family man attitude, and he is an excellent locker room player. I don't care what we have to do to sign him, but we need to lock him up.

[bballpacen]

Personally, I am disappointed in TPTB for not getting this done... I would let Danny know that he is our guy for now, and just get him locked up... No sense in piddeling around... The market is established... There should be very little negotiations... About 10 minutes is all this should take... Then once this is dealt with, then lets focus on moving the Tinman...

And as much as I lilke Danny, I would not be willing to offer him a max deal... If Portland would offer him max dollars, then good for Danny... but there is another thing that I would rather not worry about, and that is Danny playing himself into a better, slightly possibly a max deal... Bottom line, I think that getting Granger locked in long term should be the #1 priority...

[Scoot McGroot]

I would think a Tinsley deal would make a huge difference on Granger's extension. Not so much in total money, but rather in how the contract is constructed. If we have to add salary next year, then we'd probably do a normal step contract. Say it's 5 yr/$55 million. We'd do the first year as cheap as possible, and then give him the necessary raises every year to equal out $55 million.

Now, if we got extremely lucky and dumped Tinsley for expiring contracts, we could then do a front-loaded contract that would allow us more financial flexibility halfway through and on the back-end when we'd actually be looking at some free agent signings and could use the flexibility.



Tinsley's situation does affect Granger more than we'd like to admit.

[bballpacen]

Scoot, I understand this, but for christ sakes.... Lets at LEAST be in touch with his agent... If what you say holds to be true, and I personally dont think that it does, could we at least call up Danny and his agent, maybe have two seperate deals in place, and depending on what happens, sign one or the other... I dont see at all how the Jamaal situation needs to be resolved before we at least talk to them....

[count55]

I would have to agree that the Pacers should not be waiting on resolution of the Tinsley issue before talking to Danny. I think the most sound assumption is that Tinsley's salary (or a reasonable approximation of it) will be on the books for at least the next two seasons, if not all three. I believe there is ample room under the tax in that assumption to deal with most salary structures (Front load, backload, level load) for Danny's extension.

[CableKC]

I would have to agree that the Pacers should not be waiting on resolution of the Tinsley issue before talking to Danny. I think the most sound assumption is that Tinsley's salary (or a reasonable approximation of it) will be on the books for at least the next two seasons, if not all three. I believe there is ample room under the tax in that assumption to deal with most salary structures (Front load, backload, level load) for Danny's extension.

This assumes that a deal can be had where we get back a similiar deal to Tinsley's. I suspect that we won't....if anything...we're gonna get back a slightly worse contract of equal length for a player that may fill one of our remaining holes.

Another thing to consider.....moving Tinsley ASAP before the start of Training Camp for other teams could be as important since teams maybe reluctant to add anyone of significance after Training Camp starts.

Although negotiations haven't begun...I really hope that TPTB haven't at least reached out to Granger and let him know that they will try to extend him and that he is valuable to the team but are focusing their attention on moving Tinsley.

[bballpacen]

This assumes that a deal can be had where we get back a similiar deal to Tinsley's. I suspect that we won't....if anything...we're gonna get back a slightly worse contract of equal length for a player that may fill one of our remaining holes.

Agreed, but i would say that the contract we get back will be much worse, when we have to add in an expiring contract to make salaries work... but we have to weigh weather the risk of adding this other player(s) is worth moving JT... K-mart is someone that we could possibly get, and I personally would not be to much against it, but is it going to be at least a worth the extra 20M or what ever over the course of the contract??

Another thing to consider.....moving Tinsley ASAP before the start of Training Camp for other teams could be as important since teams maybe reluctant to add anyone of significance after Training Camp starts.

But are we going to really be able to add anyone of significance in a Tinsley deal?? I dont think so, unless it is a K-mart or Diaw type move where we take back significant financial burden...

Although negotiations haven't begun...I really hope that TPTB haven't at least reached out to Granger and let him know that they will try to extend him and that he is valuable to the team but are focusing their attention on moving Tinsley.

I assume that you mean that they HAVE, which I agree, but you have got to get this guy locked up ASAP... and all else should fall behind that...