Yep, JO is Officially Done!

[cdash]

I think he meant that Augustin might end up being better than Ford, which isnt an outrageous comment seeing as how well hes played as a rookie this year.

[HicksvsKnicks08]

Correct,

I believe , unfortunately and hope im wrong,. that DJ Augustine will end up being a better PG, (not because of injury either)

I do not believe we were offered Bynum. I'm pretty ready to say that with 100% confidence,

My friend I beg to differ, although who really knows but I think we got 2 packages from the Lakers at the time, one centered around Odom, one around Bynum. The problem was Bird wanted Both Bynum and Odom, which the Lakers smartly declined

It really boild down to I expected more from TJ, unless its OB holding him back fro some stupid reason

Also, I dont car if his defense is not as Good.....................


Diener should be the backup PG, NOT JACK!!! its not even close

TJ should start, Diener should back him up and JJ should get between 10-15 minutes at SG

HE has no business trying to run the point!! I swear if I see one more time when he jumps into the air, then throw the ball away im going to scream

[Grang33r]

I honestly don't have any sources or links to this, but i really don't think Andrew Bynum was ever offered for Jermaine. The Lakers didn't give up too much to land Pau Gasol so i don't think they would increase their offer by so much to send it for O'Neal. I remember all those threads, and we all demanded a 1st round pick and Bynum. I would obviously prefer Bynum and Augustin over what we have right now as well but like i said, i think the reason i liked that so much because it was a pipe dream, not a realistic trade proposal. If Lakers had no other options, then yeah it might have become possible, but Lakers had plenty of ideas to fill their PF role.

Speaking of the past and missed chances, i wish we never had gotten Al Harrington for the 2nd time and kept our draft pick. I know we expected to content with Harrington but come on, who really expected up to be that good and put us over the top? Keeping our pick and selecting Acie Law would have been nice. Now imagine, Law, Rush and Bynum. lol

[count55]

Bynum was never on the table. We probably did ask for both, but insiders are pretty solid on the fact that Kupchak refused to include Bynum in any deal (creating considerable friction with Jackson and Kobe).

DJ Augustin was drafted 9th by the Bobcats. Our pick was 11th. While there may have been considerable speculation that we were going to take Augustin, it became apparent in the days before the draft that it was unlikely that either of the PG's we wanted (Augustin or Westbrook) would be available.

As to TJ Ford, while his assists are a little low, he's basically performing at his career norms. Expecting more than this really reflects more poorly on the fan's understanding of who and what he is, than it does on TJ's actual performance. He a solid, but flawed PG.

We traded JO away for more or less equal parts talent and salary flexibility. Ford was to become a solid starter (but not a star) for us at the point. Rasho would give us a veteran presence in the middle, and an expiring contract. We drafted Hibbert in hopes that he could become a starter/solid rotational center for us down the road. To this point, the trade has met the realistic expectations, perhaps exceeded them.

JO is a very talented player. Everybody knew that if he could remain healthy, there was the chance that he could put up some very big numbers. However, the two big issues were his health and his contract. He has had big games this year, like the one you noted, but he has been very erratic. His YTD numbers have been 14 points and 7 rebs. He has played in 28 of 31 games, but played fewer than 20 minutes in six of those games. He is being paid $1.2 mm more this year than Ford, Nesterovic, Baston, & Hibbert combined, and next year's salary fo $23.0mm is roughly equivalent to what is owed to Ford (for two years) and Hibbert (for three more years) over the course of their contracts.

Had we kept JO, we would be in considerably worse shape than we are in now. The record may or may not be better, but JO's value would be plummetting with another year of nagging injuries. We would be paying the luxury tax for this season, and likely be up against it for next. It's not unreasonable to say that we may have held off on signing Danny's extension until next summer, and we may have faced losing him entirely.

I liked JO, but it was time to part ways. Keeping him was clearly not a survivable proposition. To point at one game from JO and call for a do-over (particularly one that was never do-able in the first place) is profoundly short-sighted.

[HicksvsKnicks08]

Expecting more than this really reflects more poorly on the fan's understanding of who and what he is, than it does on TJ's actual performance. He a solid, but flawed PG.

Count55,

As always you make valid points, however with the above statement, I respectfully beg to differ. I think the expectations of Ford were higher by the front office then what is being displayed recently. I expected , along with many others here, that Ford would put up career numbers, how OB's system was "taylor made" for a PG like Ford, some even so far as to guarnetee Ford would make the all-star team this year.

I haven't seen that, just like Calderon is playing bettter for Toronto. I expected Ford to be a much better playmaker than he has shown, he actually has proved to be a better shooter than I thought thouhg.

As far as JO, I knew it was time for him to go, and actually thought we did extreemly well , all things considered.

with Bynum you might be right ( I do rememeber Kobe allegdely being pissed Kupcake wouldnt trade Bynum for Kidd) but I think with JO ther were prepared to part with Bynum

No matter now, just please, please my knowledgable friend answer this...................................

Why does Jack continue to get big minutes? Why is he running the point?

I would love to hear "valadation" for that

[Miller4ever]

Jack runs the point because he's capable of some instant, if extremely unstable, offense. But that's not why he's getting minutes.

The real reason he's getting 28 minutes a game is because we don't have Dunleavy, so he's playing the 2 spot, and TJ is known to be injury-prone. I'm not saying that that's okay, but I'd rather have prudent subbing now until Dunleavy gets back. Then, we make our playoff push and TJ Ford will be leading it with Granger.

[realfung]

One good game doesn't mean anything.

[Grang33r]

Raptors general manager Bryan Colangelo is ready to shake things up in Toronto. He's tried to move forward/center Jermaine O'Neal to at least half a dozen teams. Scouts say O'Neal doesn't have any lift in his legs. That could be one reason the Cavs turned down a possible deal with Indiana. O'Neal can still defend and score. Forward Andrea Bargnani could also be had.

Link- http://www.news-herald.com/articles/200 ... 304836.txt

Not to add more to this discussion but i don't really think Toronto likes what it got in O'Neal. I wonder if they do end up trading him, what they would get in return? A pretty young starter and a first round pick?

[cdash]

Ehhh...I doubt it. We got an expiring contract, a decent young starter, and a mid-first rounder. His value couldn't have gone up and almost surely has gone down, so I'd imagine they will have a tough time trading him. Two years at $20+ million per isnt easy to move. I'd guess a decent young starter and probably a bad contract, and mayyyybe a late first rounder.

[Boneman2]

It feels great to be out from under the worst contract in the entire league.

We atually got a pretty favorable deal.

Good luck Toronto.

[Morris_Shatford]

Ehhh...I doubt it. We got an expiring contract, a decent young starter, and a mid-first rounder. His value couldn't have gone up and almost surely has gone down, so I'd imagine they will have a tough time trading him. Two years at $20+ million per isnt easy to move. I'd guess a decent young starter and probably a bad contract, and mayyyybe a late first rounder.

His value in the offseason was "Will he be anywhere close to where he was ever again", His value now is "Yeah...sometimes"

Toronto will not move him now, he becomes a 22 million dollar expiring contract at the draft. A deal that expires at the right time, moving him earlier then that would be nuts.