Reggie: All-Star Game should be a reward for winning

Post #1 » by **Grang33r** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:12 am

Reggie Miller is currently on TNT broadcasting the Lakers and Wizards game. He said, the All-Star process is wrong and wishes NBA would fix it. He said All-Star selections (for reserves) should be a reward for winning. He said players like Danny Granger, Kevin Durant and David Lee are great players but shouldn't go to the ASG because they play on bad teams. He said, if they played on good teams, they wouldn't have nearly as good of stats.

Very interesting. Thoughts? Comments?

Post #2 » by **Miller4ever** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:29 am

Reggie Miller was on the All-Star squad 3 times (appropriate considering what he did as a player). I'm not entirely in agreement with him here. Yes, there should be more consideration for the people who are key players on winning teams, but I think that the system kind of works that way already.

Look at Elton Brand. When he was a Bull, and an early Clipper, he would post 20 and 10 every game, but his team was horrible, and he never made the team. Dale Davis (10 and 10) was taken instead. How about Tim Duncan making it every year despite dips in performance? Shawn Marion of the past, pre-Nash, was also a statistical monster, but he wasn't making the All-Star team. Guy named Andrei Kirilenko was on it. Okay, Andrei was on a pretty bad team, too, but they were better than the bottom-feeding Suns of the time.

Nowadays, Eastern conference All-Stars generally come from losing teams. If you're below the 4th seed, you're probably a losing team. Proof that the NBA is ahead of Reggie Miller's thought process? The Detroit Pistons had 4 All-Star reserves that one year that they started off incredibly well. Chancey, Rip, Big Ben, and Sheed all donned All-Star jerseys.

We have more problems to worry about in the All-Star process, namely the Chinese Factor. Yi Jianlian will be voted in next year, because more Chinese people will have internet, and they will also realize that ou can vote more than once.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #3 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:56 am

Reggie has become the Tiki Barber of the NBA. Since leaving the Pacers he has done nothing but bash us, I mean in some instances hes had good points, but I just didn't expect this from him.

Something tells me that if Reggie was on a losing team, putting up Danny Granger numbers, he'd feel like he deserved to make the All-Star game.

bballpacen · Post #4 » by **bballpacen** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 6:28 am

I think that Reggie has the right to say damn near what he wants... His points do have some validity, but I think that more than just winning has to be weighed... When you put up numbers like Danny is, then you have to give him a serious look, even when our team is well below .500... It is arguable that he would not be putting up as big of numbers on a winning team, but I look at it as the opposing team is keying on him defensively, and yet he is still going nuts...

Who do you add from the east to take Grangers spot?? Especially when there are not that many teams that are under .500, which is Uncle Reg's gold standard... Lets brake it down...

**Boston, KG is already in, and you could certainly make an argument for PP as a reserve, so lets say that is 2 forward spots taken...

**Cleveland, LBJ is in, but no one else is having any were close to an AS type season up front... 3 out of what, 5-6 forward spots taken?? OK

**Orlando, Turkoglu and Lewis... Both having good seasons, but the numbers are not close to Danny... You could argue Maybe 1 will go under Reggies Standard... MAYBE...

**Atlanta, Smith is the only one worth consideration, but he is not putting up the numbers that an AS should...

**Detroit, Prince and Wallace, Numbers aren't there, PERIOD...

**Same goes for Miami with Beasley and Marion...

Out of those forwards Only KG, LBJ are the only ones that are locks ahead of Danny... Pierce, and one of Turkoglu and Lewis could be seen as having AS numbers... That still leaves 1 or 2 spots... Of the rest of the East, Bosh and Jamison are the only other possible AS that I see... If you exclude players b/c of their teams record, then you are taking FAR inferior players... I just fail to see how you can not go with Danny as an AS, regardless of the teams record, b/c he is simply putting up the numbers...

Post #5 » by **PR07** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 6:41 am

Reggie has a point in that its easier to put up big numbers on a lousy team, but Granger isn't just getting garbage points. He's had a lot of big shots in a lot of close games. It's not like this team is getting blown out. They are about a big man away from winning most of these close games. He's been special and deserves to be there.

Post #6 » by **Miller4ever** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 7:51 am

All-stars have not always had to produce numbers. Look at Rasheed Wallace (with the Pistons) or Dale Davis, or...Grant Hill. There's a lot more, but I'm tired.

Post #7 » by **APerna** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 5:14 am

First off, Reggie was a five-time All-Star. Secondly, I wouldn't read TOO much into all this. I gotta believe that Reggie tries not to take the side of the Pacers in a majority of his arguments. He's always been highly critical of the team since his retirement.

With that said, I tend to agree. Danny should (without-a-doubt) be an All-Star, but if players have comparing stat lines, it has to go to the guy with the better record. That's why a David Lee shouldn't make it...

Post #8 » by **Miller4ever** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 6:56 am

Also, winning is a little more than the record. Look a the people we've beat because of Danny Granger. There's a lot of other games we lost because of other deficiencies that are not Granger's fault. He's even hit game-winners.

mr_merriweather · Post #9 » by **mr_merriweather** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:54 am

I don't know if the "easier to put up big numbers on a lousy team" idea holds up. The player faces the same defenses everyone else in the league is facing. If they happen to be the only talent, defenses can key on them in a way they can't with a more talented roster (see Lebron completely shutting down Granger). Plus does a good PG not boost the stats of the post player he's feeding, and a good post player who can convert once dished the ball not boost the assist total of the PG? I just think there are too many variables, and too many ways to look at it, for this idea to be accepted as truth.

All-Star games should be for the best players in terms of talent. They've always been a showcase of talent and a spectacle for the fans, not some reward for a good mid-season report card. What do you gain if you put a glue guy on a great team on the All-Star team? The players hardly play, are constantly going for alley-oops, so what's the point? Elect the players who can perform the spectacular, not the ones who do the little things.

If we're talking All-NBA teams, or MVP awards, it's a whole different ball game. But I think sometimes people lose sight of what the All-Star game is really about.

Post #10 » by **Miller4ever** » Sun Jan 25, 2009 6:11 pm

mr_merriweather wrote:I don't know if the "easier to put up big numbers on a lousy team" idea holds up. The player faces the same defenses everyone else in the league is facing. If they happen to be the only talent, defenses can key on them in a way they can't with a more talented roster (see Lebron completely shutting down Granger). Plus does a good PG not boost the stats of the post player he's feeding, and a good post player who can convert once dished the ball not boost the assist total of the PG? I just think there are too many variables, and too many ways to look at it, for this idea to be accepted as truth.

There are definitely two sides. One form of stat-boosting is the scoring of Tyson Chandler, and Shawn Marion, when he was on the Suns. Because they play with great point guards, they get better looks, because they are guys who don't create their own offense. Then you get mediocre guys who do create their own offense, like Ricky Davis and Jason Richardson, and they have a lot of points because they just take that many shots.