What in heaven's name

[writerman]

was Posey doing in there before Hansborough?

I like this team...but when are Bird or Morway going to fire this clown impersonating a coach?

Last year McRoberts was irrelevant. This year he's the starting PF and doing reasonably well.

Why is Ford, who figures into none of our plans, playing instead of Price?

Too many turnovers...but our frontcourt played well against the Spurs' supposedly superior frontcourt.

Defense was bad...but there's hope that will improve as these guys get to know each other better. Remember--we have three new starters.

Hibbert is going to be VERY good in this league.

But if this team is ever going to get to the next level and beyond, Obie has to go!

[Miller4ever]

It starts from day one and it never lets up until he's finally gone.

[chube]

Thank you!

I made a thread about the same thing!

I read a few days ago that Posey was going to be used at the 4 sometimes, but I thought that it was more in cases where they needed to go small, or for injuries/foul trouble. Maybe when they went small for scoring and fast-break purposes. But for Posey and Solomon F. Jones to get noticeably more time than Hansbrough? Why? I don't see how Psycho T wasn't at least an option when going up against the solid frontcourt of Duncan, McDyess and Blair!

The main thing I can think of about the Ford-over-Price thing is that maybe they're trying to showcase Ford for a trade? I hope that's it. Because considering the preseason and the fact that Ford has been in and out of JOB's doghouse a few times, Price makes sense, especially for the future.

I actually think Bird has done a reasonable job as GM considering the mess he took over (not to say I'd protest Indiana native Kevin Pritchard taking over.) But the next big move he needs to make is to sack JOB before another actual good coach gets scooped up. We already missed out on former Pacer Byron Scott and Avery Johnson this year. Still sitting out there is Jeff Van Gundy (double-win considering he'd no longer be commentating), Mark Jackson (if you want a first-time coach) and Mike Woodson (IU graduate.)

Defense and turnovers - that's been the Pacers' M.O. the last couple years but they managed to put it together towards the end of last year. Hopefully they'll re-find that. The second Hibbert was drafted, I was excited. Both because of his potential and the fact that Indy needed a center. I think his career high is 29 and he nearly topped that tonight plus a solid night on the glass and 3 blocks to go along with it. And 8-8 for free throws! Hell yeah! You put a big guy who can muscle his way through the post and be a reliable free throw shooter! Bonus!

The Pacers now have what you want in a good team - a good point guard who can score and dish, a good center down low, and go-to scorer who can erupt for 30+ on any given night. Between that, some trade chips/expiring contracts, some summer financial flexibility and what is hopefully a growing bench in George (who I could see as a starter eventually), Price, Lance, McRoberts (he'd be a backup on any other team), and apparently Hansbrough, the Pacers could be pretty solid. But NOT with JOB. I'm not convinced that you could give him a roster like Orlando, Miami, or the Lakers and he'd still botch it.

Oh, and remember the two steals we supposedly found in the second round of the draft? Stephenson and Rolle? Well, JOB has now released one (Rolle) and the other (Stephenson) is in street clothes. Hopefully they develop Lance (and he stays out of trouble) and they're able to re-sign Rolle eventually. So much for those 2nd round steals, huh?

[Grang33r]

I wrote about this in the GDT. I agree 100%. They need to get a new coach in here to change the whole mentality of the team. I just don't think his style works for our team, and i don't think he knows what he's doing with tactics/substitutions. Last year at this time, i was hoping we lose and lose often to get a high pick, but, now, i don't even care about a pick. We have the cap space and the players to be a real good team, but we don't have the coach. This group of guys needs a new coach and until they get it, i feel like we will never make that other "jump".

[chube]

Bird, I think, despite some head-scratching moves, has gotten us into a decent position. Solid young nucleus of Danny, Hibbert, Collison, and maybe George, Hansbrough, Stephenson, Price, and Rolle (I don't know the details of his release and how our rights to him work in there.) All that, plus a bunch of cap room next summer. Not a horrible way to go forward.

God bless ya, Larry, but I think this next summer is the perfect time to take what we have and get some new blood in there. A new GM (Indiana native Kevin Pritchard, maybe?) and DEFINITELY a new coach (more crucial than a new GM, to me.) You got guys like Mike Woodson, Mark Jackson, Jeff Van Gundy, and it seems like there are a handful of assistants I'm always hearing would make good head coaches. I really think now is the time. The scattered regime of Larry/JOB is bad because not only has it not worked, but how does it look in the eyes of potential free agent targets?

[jowglenn]

Yeah. I actually talked about it before, with Ford, how he likely is going to play just to get showcased for trades. If we bury him as our 3rd PG, it will hurt his trade value, no team will offer anything for him. It would be like w/ Tinsley - didn't play at all, removed from team, ended up buying him out completely when we probably could have at least traded him for some equally-bad-contract awful player. Better than nothing.


I think Ford and Dunleavy will get steady playing time and then be heavily shopped around the deadline. Both guys are expiring, could play well in a contract year, then a team that needs a PG might decide to take a chance with Ford. You know, if the Bobcats horrid PG situation stays horrid, or a team comes down with a bad injury to their starting PG, if we've got a good looking TJ Ford, who's been doing a solid backup performance, we could really leverage it. He may end up being the best available PG option available at the trade deadline - expiring, good enough to fill in as a starter for a desperate team.

So I don't really mind too much that he's playing.


But Posey? Unless Hansbrough brought a bag full of dead babies to practice, that was unconscionable.


And for the record I'd like to get Mark Jackson. We just got our best point guard since Mark Jackson... why not get Mark Jackson to coach him. Mark Jackson. Say it enough times and it just rolls really weird off the tongue like it's a bunch of meaningless sounds. Mark Jackson.

[Starkiller]

I can't remember right now but is Mike Brown available? I'd love to have him back in Indiana.

I've said it for years, Solo and Dun are f'n scrubs. Dun really shouldn't play. Is he really THAT much better than George? Give the young guy the experience. You can't say Dun gives us a better chance to win since he played like crap and we didn't win.

[chube]

^^^ Yes, MIke Brown is available. I knew I was forgetting somebody.

[Wizop]

the answer is simple: they want to win and they are playing the best players. they are not playing to develop players who will be best next year or the year after. today Ford and Posey are better than Price and Hansbrough.

I've been to two preseason games and I'll be there Saturday. huge numbers of empty seats. I can't argue with their judgment that there are more people willing to buy tickets to see a team with a chance of winning this year than there are people willing to shell out money to see a team that might win down the road.

not to mention the fact that NBA coaches tend not to want to lose games in order to develop players for the next coach.

[PaceWalker]

More importantly why was Solo playing before Foster and Hansbrough. The guy is terrible!!!!!!!

[Kuq_e_Zi91]

the answer is simple: they want to win and they are playing the best players. they are not playing to develop players who will be best next year or the year after. today Ford and Posey are better than Price and Hansbrough.

Are they really, though?

[8305]

I too wonder if Solo and Ford getting minutes last night indicates some interest from another team. If they could get that 2 for 1 done quick enough maybe Rolle could be resigned.

Posey didn't impress me that much in the preseason games I saw or last night. In a small line up (without a traditional 4) I like Granger at the 4. He creates a nasty mismatch for almost any power forward and truth be told he probably defends 4's better than wings.

And jees, I hope that guard combo of Ford and Collison gets filed away in some distant place. Does anyone really want TJ handling the ball over Collison?

[Kuq_e_Zi91]

And jees, I hope that guard combo of Ford and Collison gets filed away in some distant place. Does anyone really want TJ handling the ball over Collison?

I hope that lineup of Ford/Dunleavy/George/Posey/Solo goes with it.

[Wizop]

[quote="Wizop"today Ford and Posey are better than Price and Hansbrough.

Are they really, though?[/quote]

do you have so little confidence in the entire basketball staff that you are willing to second guess their judgment on something so basic? now, if you want to argue that Bird should give OB an extension and tell him that he's got a job next year regardless of how many games we win and order him to pay the younger players, fine.

[writerman]

[quote="Wizop"today Ford and Posey are better than Price and Hansbrough.

Are they really, though?

do you have so little confidence in the entire basketball staff that you are willing to second guess their judgment on something so basic? now, if you want to argue that Bird should give OB an extension and tell him that he's got a job next year regardless of how many games we win and order him to pay the younger players, fine.[/quote]

Entire staff? Maybe not...but I do have that little confidence in O'Brien...who after all is calling the shots, and doesn't like to be second guessed (Lester Connor says hello.)

I just don't think there's enough difference between Posey and Ford over Hansborough and Price that two guys who don't really fit into our plans should be playing over guys who do fit into our plans and who could probably play at least as well given the minutes.

[Wizop]

I'll certainly grant you that O'B can be too stubborn. I thought he should have played McRoberts more last year but here he is starting so maybe there is something to be said for bench time being a teacher and motivator. lots of games yet to go.

[writerman]

Stubborn? Yeah, that too. But the REAL problem is that the man is just a very bad coach.

He's keeping Hansborough out because TH doesn't know the offense? We score 109 points, but give up 122 points to the slow, methodical Spurs, and the moron is worried about the OFFENSE? And Posey, of course, is the answer...

This team is going no further until someone summons the good sense to fire O'Brien and get a coach who works with the talent he has, and doesn't try to cram them into his preconceived "system."

[colts2004]

Stubborn? Yeah, that too. But the REAL problem is that the man is just a very bad coach.

He's keeping Hansborough out because TH doesn't know the offense? We score 109 points, but give up 122 points to the slow, methodical Spurs, and the moron is worried about the OFFENSE? And Posey, of course, is the answer...

This team is going no further until someone summons the good sense to fire O'Brien and get a coach who works with the talent he has, and doesn't try to cram them into his preconceived "system."

You got that right, we have talent on this team, Tyler is gonna be a great basketball player, but until Bird fires JOB, we aint gonna go anywhere

[Wizop]

and get a coach who works with the talent he has, and doesn't try to cram them into his preconceived "system."

again I agree that O'B was stubborn about his system in prior years despite the fact that it wasn't working. his comments this year, however, suggest a possible new found flexibility perhaps after off season conversations with Bird. of course, one game is hardly a big enough sample to judge upon. I'm not urging an O'B return next year, but I'm not one who has made his mind up that he must go regardless of what happens this year. he's got to earn a new contract. could happen.