Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks

[Pacers Forever]

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Please just don’t take back worse assets by getting out from under the 10 million salary. Hopefully, something expiring or easy to flip.

[Scoot McGroot]

I’m guessing we’re being used as a smokescreen on CJ.

I hope you're right. fwiw, wiretap has this story too.

I don't get the McCollum thing. The Fischer notes imply the Blazers just want to get off his salary and he can be had on the cheap so sending Turner seems like an overpay and I don't see how else we match salary if Rubio's contract can't be aggregated in a re-trade. Plus, I just don't see the fit. It's one thing to buy up a player you see as a distressed asset on the cheap, but his salary is so high that it limits other things you can do.

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[Scoot McGroot]

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Please just don’t take back worse assets by getting out from under the 10 million salary. Hopefully, something expiring or easy to flip.

I’ll repeat it every time, EVAN MASSIE IS NOT A REAL SOURCE OR REPORTER. None of the beat writers know who he is, and he’s supposedly Indy based. He’s never been credentialed by the team. He claims to be an nba, nfl, and ncaa newsbreaker, which just doesn’t happen. I believe he’s even created and shutdown multiple sites and Twitter accounts after he’s been caught making things up.

Like, he may be a blind squirrel finding a nut sometimes, but he’s just guessing. And many times, he’s doing it with less knowledge than we do here.

[Pacers Forever]

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Please just don’t take back worse assets by getting out from under the 10 million salary. Hopefully, something expiring or easy to flip.

I’ll repeat it every time, EVAN MASSIE IS NOT A REAL SOURCE OR REPORTER. None of the beat writers know who he is, and he’s supposedly Indy based. He’s never been credentialed by the team. He claims to be an nba, nfl, and ncaa newsbreaker, which just doesn’t happen. I believe he’s even created and shutdown multiple sites and Twitter accounts after he’s been caught making things up.

Like, he may be a blind squirrel finding a nut sometimes, but he’s just guessing. And many times, he’s doing it with less knowledge than we do here.

I looked at his stories on Twitter and they seem to be rehashing of rumors so I understand he’s not a news breaker. Just hope we dump the Lamb anchor to continue house cleaning and give the youth more chance to play.

[Scoot McGroot]

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Please just don’t take back worse assets by getting out from under the 10 million salary. Hopefully, something expiring or easy to flip.

I’ll repeat it every time, EVAN MASSIE IS NOT A REAL SOURCE OR REPORTER. None of the beat writers know who he is, and he’s supposedly Indy based. He’s never been credentialed by the team. He claims to be an nba, nfl, and ncaa newsbreaker, which just doesn’t happen. I believe he’s even created and shutdown multiple sites and Twitter accounts after he’s been caught making things up.

Like, he may be a blind squirrel finding a nut sometimes, but he’s just guessing. And many times, he’s doing it with less knowledge than we do here.

I looked at his stories on Twitter and they seem to be rehashing of rumors so I understand he’s not a news breaker. Just hope we dump the Lamb anchor to continue house cleaning and give the youth more chance to play.

No, I hear ya. And I didn’t mean it as a personal attack. I’m more just shocked that a lot of the aggregator sites are listing his stuff. Honestly, just read the random thread in Trades and Transactions forum here and you’ll be ahead of him and see his stuff coming days and weeks ahead.

But I’m with you on Lamb for the most part. If we just can’t move him, we just need to play him as the last SG. He’s better than that, but we’re not, and we need to keep seeing Duarte, Duane, and even Taylor.

[Tom White]

me neither. the LeVert trade gives us 3 picks in the top 35 and I see that as setting a direction. we've got Duarte and Jackson playing like solid first round picks and Washington and Taylor exceeding all expectations. add 3 more rookies in the summer and I'd think new high priced veterans would just be in the way.

I say new as I don't want this read as arguing to trade Sabonis although he should influence our top pick. I'm undecided on Brogdon and Warren but that could just mean I need to see what the draft gives us.

at this point, I'd be trying for lightly protected 2023 draft picks from lottery teams.

I have to agree with you. Spreading out some acquired picks over a couple years is a good idea.

If all our young guys are to be retained, plus if the team uses the draft picks for themselves (instead of using them as part of a trade), then suddenly this becomes a very young team. I admit to being excited to see them all play, but at some point you get to a place where you have too much of a good thing. Of course, some of the 2nd round picks can be used to stock up the Mad Ants roster, so there is that avenue.

There is still a need to have some "old-timers" like Sabonis and McConnell around to contribute and give guidance to the younger guys.

[Wizop]

There is still a need to have some "old-timers" like Sabonis and McConnell around to contribute and give guidance to the younger guys.

and maybe Lance and Holiday and even Warren and Brogdon might count as old guys. I'm leaving out Turner although I'd happily keep him. note though that McConnell is 4 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis is about the same age as Duarte.

[Topofthekey]

I don't get the McCollum thing.

me neither. the LeVert trade gives us 3 picks in the top 35 and I see that as setting a direction. we've got Duarte and Jackson playing like solid first round picks and Washington and Taylor exceeding all expectations. add 3 more rookies in the summer and I'd think new high priced veterans would just be in the way.

I say new as I don't want this read as arguing to trade Sabonis although he should influence our top pick. I'm undecided on Brogdon and Warren but that could just mean I need to see what the draft gives us.

at this point, I'd be trying for lightly protected 2023 draft picks from lottery teams.

This is another reason why I'm quite excited about the team right now

Depending on what happens in the draft, there are so many different paths that Pacers could take in the off-season

If they won the lottery and ended up with Jabari Smith, what do they do with Turbonis? Who between them is a better fit with Jabari Smith? What about Isaiah Jackson?

If they ended up with a guard, like Ivey or Sharpe, who gets to be the starter? Ivey/Sharpe or Duarte? Or do you go with a three guard lineup and start them both?

What if their pick dropped a bit, and they used it on TyTy Washington? What happens to Brogdon? Do you go with a rebuild and trade Brogdon and let TyTy start? Or do you have him as the primary backup PG? Or do you start him with Brogdon sliding to the 2?

If they drafted someone who plays the position of Turbonis or Brogdon, do they trade Turbonis or Brogdon for a star?

There are just so many different ways they can tinker with the roster depending on what they get in the draft. Exciting times

[Tom White]

There is still a need to have some "old-timers" like Sabonis and McConnell around to contribute and give guidance to the younger guys.

and maybe Lance and Holiday and even Warren and Brogdon might count as old guys. I'm leaving out Turner although I'd happily keep him. note though that McConnell is 4 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis is about the same age as Duarte.

What you say about the ages of TJM and Sabonis is why I put quotes around the old-timers comment.

Now, when you start to mention Holiday, Brogdon and Warren in addition to TJM and Sabonis? If they are kept, are we REALLY changing the team at all? I'm more than ready to move on from Holiday, Brogdon and Warren. I have a feeling Lance is likely not in the Pacers' future either. Hate to say it about Lance, but that is what I think will be the case.

[Tom White]

What happens to Brogdon? Do you go with a rebuild and trade Brogdon

Yes. This should be job #1. I see it as essential, if you are going to change this team at all.

[Topofthekey]

I don't mind keeping Lance though

His bravado is good for a team full of rookies/sophomores, I feel

Duarte, Jackson, Washington, Taylor, plus the 3 top 35 picks the team has in the draft, that's 7 players or basically half the roster who have 1 year or fewer experience

If anything, I feel that it's an argument for retaining Lance

Also, I'd like to see the Pacers acquire a veteran rotational player. Someone who can be the papa smurf figure for all the youngsters

[Pacers Forever]

There is still a need to have some "old-timers" like Sabonis and McConnell around to contribute and give guidance to the younger guys.

and maybe Lance and Holiday and even Warren and Brogdon might count as old guys. I'm leaving out Turner although I'd happily keep him. note though that McConnell is 4 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis is about the same age as Duarte.

What you say about the ages of TJM and Sabonis is why I put quotes around the old-timers comment.

Now, when you start to mention Holiday, Brogdon and Warren in addition to TJM and Sabonis? If they are kept, are we REALLY changing the team at all? I'm more than ready to move on from Holiday, Brogdon and Warren. I have a feeling Lance is likely not in the Pacers' future either. Hate to say it about Lance, but that is what I think will be the case.

If Lance is in the Pacers future it has to be the old veteran, quick energy infusion, and cheerleader role. He still has the passing skills, but his shooting, defense, and stamina seems to be hit and miss.

[Wizop]

Now, when you start to mention Holiday, Brogdon and Warren in addition to TJM and Sabonis? If they are kept, are we REALLY changing the team at all?

this is why I don't want to make a big trade until after I know what the draft gave us. I'm okay letting Brogdon play out his contract regardless as he is an off court leader but do we need Warren if we draft a wing (Griffin?)? are we into a new Turbonis problem if Holmgren falls to us? can Ivey play point? will a point guard fall to the Cleveland pick?

the one thing I do not want to do NOW is trade for a 30mm contract no matter how good the "star" is. wait, is Simmons the exception?

[Scoot McGroot]

Now, when you start to mention Holiday, Brogdon and Warren in addition to TJM and Sabonis? If they are kept, are we REALLY changing the team at all?

this is why I don't want to make a big trade until after I know what the draft gave us. I'm okay letting Brogdon play out his contract regardless as he is an off court leader but do we need Warren if we draft a wing (Griffin?)? are we into a new Turbonis problem if Holmgren falls to us? can Ivey play point? will a point guard fall to the Cleveland pick?

the one thing I do not want to do NOW is trade for a 30mm contract no matter how good the "star" is. wait, is Simmons the exception?

I’m really less worried about that as lost of our guys or the draftees are multi position flexible. Like, Jabari is a 4/3. Chet is a 4/5. Ivey is a 1/2. Duarte is a 2/3. Oshae is a 4/3. Jackson is a 4/5. Sabonis is ideally a 5, but a 4/5. Brogdon is a 1/2. Warren is a 3/4. I think a lot of these guys can play together. And either way, as we see this year, we could absolutely keep Warren and still add a drafted 3. We seriously lack solid wing presences.

[Tom White]

I'm okay letting Brogdon play out his contract

HA! This is my nightmare scenario.

if Holmgren falls to us?

I'm just not interested in Holmgren.

the one thing I do not want to do NOW is trade for a 30mm contract no matter how good the "star" is. wait, is Simmons the exception?

I agree with you about not taking on a huge contract. Simmons would NOT be an exception, to me. He has so many flaws that the negatives out-weigh any positives. Plus, my guess is, he is hoping to land on one of the "big stage" teams like either LA team or NY. We would likely have a problem with him not showing up and basically doing a one-person boycott.

[Wizop]

We seriously lack solid wing presences.

I definitely agree with that. I want enough depth at 3 to keep Duarte at 2. I'm not sold on Ivey as a 1 or that TyTy wil be worth our lottery pick.

Can Jabari play the 3? Griffin, Brown, and Murray have my early attention. if someone wants to give us a haul for Holmgren or Banchero, I'd certainly listen. maybe there is a draft day deal to me made a la Jason Tatum.

[Scoot McGroot]

We seriously lack solid wing presences.

I definitely agree with that. I want enough depth at 3 to keep Duarte at 2. I'm not sold on Ivey as a 1 or that TyTy wil be worth our lottery pick.

Can Jabari play the 3? Griffin, Brown, and Murray have my early attention. if someone wants to give us a haul for Holmgren or Banchero, I'd certainly listen. maybe there is a draft day deal to me made a la Jason Tatum.

I mean, that was just 1 down to 3. That kind of move doesn’t present itself as well at 5 or 6 and trading down.

[Wizop]

I mean, that was just 1 down to 3. That kind of move doesn’t present itself as well at 5 or 6 and trading down.

if we're at 5 or 6, the "bigs" should be off the board and we can just take the BPA. but if we move into the top 3 either by losing or getting lucky in the lottery options may open up.

[boomershadow]

If Lance is in the Pacers future it has to be the old veteran, quick energy infusion, and cheerleader role. He still has the passing skills, but his shooting, defense, and stamina seems to be hit and miss.

They always were lol.

[Pacers Forever]

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