Stephenson benched indefinitely for disciplinary reasons

chube · Post #1 » by **chube** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:38 am

http://www.indycornrows.com/2011/4/9/2100855/lance-stephenson-done-for-year-with-Indiana-pacers

TJ Ford becomes the 3rd stringer. Even though we were eager to see what Price could do as the first backup (for better or worse), in his defense, TJ has been very professional throughout all of this. If only we could say the same (apparently) for the rookie in front of him.

Post #2 » by **Miller4ever** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 1:11 am

@#$%^&*$#@%^&*

Wizop · Post #3 » by **Wizop** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 3:06 am

I wondered why Posey was suited up the last couple of games. truth is though that we'll need TJ against Rose. AJ was sure miserable against Atlanta. wouldn't that be the final irony if TJ were to turn out to be the x-factor in the playoffs?

paulgeorge24 · Post #4 » by **paulgeorge24** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 4:29 am

Wizop wrote:I wondered why Posey was suited up the last couple of games. truth is though that we'll need TJ against Rose. AJ was sure miserable against Atlanta. wouldn't that be the final irony if TJ were to turn out to be the x-factor in the playoffs?

If TJ is our only hope against Rose, kill me now.

And I think the Pigs flying and the world bursting into flames would overshadow any irony if TJ lead us to victory.

Post #5 » by **Miller4ever** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:53 am

I would welcome it if TJ won us games against the Bulls. It would confuse the hell out of me, and make me wonder why he hasn't shown up for the previous two seasons, but I'd be okay with it.

Post #6 » by **Gremz** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 8:51 am

Well it's nice to be consistent. Wait.....

Post #7 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 10:23 pm

I see Lance getting thrown in on a deal this summer. He's still young enough and talented enough for someone else to assign some value to him (a la Shawne Williams). He's just showing to be too much of a knucklehead to put it together here.

Although, he's cheap enough that I could see one more year given to him (especially since it's already guaranteed), and then jettison him after next season if it doesn't work out, or if he has another behavioral/discipline/legal type issue.

Post #8 » by **PR07** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 10:58 pm

Someone needs to tell Clark Kellogg to do a better job on him, haha j/k.

He better figure it out soon because I don't think the Pacers are going to tolerate this act for much longer from Lance.

Pacersike · Post #9 » by **Pacersike** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:10 am

He should have been let go already.

There are two kinds of men in this world: the ones who throw their bitch down the stairs and the ones that don't.

This is only going to add...

paulgeorge24 · Post #10 » by **paulgeorge24** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:49 pm

Don't care. He wasn't going to play meaningful time in the playoffs anyways even if he was on the active list. Anyways, Posey led us back to the playoffs

Too many people overreacting in this thread. "TRADE HIM!!11!!! HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN GONE A LONG TIME AGOOO" Do you think the Pacers are surprised that something like this happened? Do you think they gave him a guaranteed deal while believing that his season would be sparkling clean? Yeah, I'm sometimes skeptical about our management, but they knew what they were getting into. Anyways, PLENTY of guys have violated team rules and plenty of those guys are not "troublemakers".

and did someone really mention TJ being professional? Did you see what he's being paid to sit in street clothes for a couple hours every night or two? I guess you already forgot that he didnt try to negotiate a buyout either. Sounds very professional. :evil:

chube · Post #11 » by **chube** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Yes, I do feel TJ was being professional. He's been a starter or first backup for all/most of his 8-year career. And then he's suddenly bumped to street clothes by a rookie coach in favor of an unproven rookie. But at no point did you ever hear of him becoming a cancer in the locker room or constantly going through the media or having a negative impact on a young (and sometimes struggling) team trying to make it into the playoffs. Not every NBA player would've behaved like that.

paulgeorge24 · Post #12 » by **paulgeorge24** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:43 pm

chube wrote:Yes, I do feel TJ was being professional. He's been a starter or first backup for all/most of his 8-year career. And then he's suddenly bumped to street clothes by a rookie coach in favor of an unproven rookie. But at no point did you ever hear of him becoming a cancer in the locker room or constantly going through the media or having a negative impact on a young (and sometimes struggling) team trying to make it into the playoffs. Not every NBA player would've behaved like that.

Once again, look at how much he's getting paid, bottom line. Not being a cancer does not mean that he's being professional. If he was upset about being on the bench, he could have taken a buyout for a decent amount of money and signed with a new team to make up for his dollars lost. Apparently, he's smart enough not to burn down more bridges while collecting a hefty pay check. Basically with your line of thinking, Jamaal Tinsley was very professional when he was in a similar situation, except for that he worked out a buyout.

*shakes head*

chube · Post #13 » by **chube** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:00 pm

Except that with Tinsley it got out to the media that there was bad blood between Tinsley and the management, which even went so far as to banning Tinsley from team activities, which is never good for a locker room and all the speculation that surrounded it. That never happened with TJ. And now when he's in a position to get back in the rotation, he's ready and the coach is comfortable putting him in there.

There is a difference.

paulgeorge24 · Post #14 » by **paulgeorge24** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:20 pm

chube wrote:Except that with Tinsley it got out to the media that there was bad blood between Tinsley and the management, which even went so far as to banning Tinsley from team activities, which is never good for a locker room and all the speculation that surrounded it. That never happened with TJ. And now when he's in a position to get back in the rotation, he's ready and the coach is comfortable putting him in there.

There is a difference.

1)Both guys were basically told not to come to practice or anything. The only reason TJ is back is because of the Lance situation otherwise he would be in street clothes/watching the playoffs. That's not good for a locker room either. Who said Vogel was comfortable putting him back in there? What basis would he have for being comfortable with it anyway? If he says he's comfortable with it, where was TJ when all 3 point guards were struggling? Yeah, I figured.
2)With Tinsley, everyone assumed it was because of the injuries/club rio thing/not living up to potential. Not to mention, what do the actions of management and the media in regards to Tinsley have to do with him being a professional? Just because management didnt let loose any "bad blood" to the media about TJ does not mean that TJ is being any more professional than Tinsley was.

Your argument contains irrelevant, invalid, and somewhat biased information.

Post #15 » by **Miller4ever** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:26 pm

Jamaal Tinsley was not on the bench during games. TJ Ford is always on the bench in games, showing support for his teammates.

Wizop · Post #16 » by **Wizop** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:34 pm

Tinsley accepted a buyout. TJ did not. Tinsley burned all bridges with the fans. TJ did not.

TJ never got a handle on the Obie offense and by the time Vogel took over we'd moved on to developing the younger guys knowing TJ wasn't going to be resigned at any price. I'm disappointed we didn't see Lance last night and Friday but I'm not at all disappointed to see TJ get warmed up as we'll need lots of point guard fouls against Chicago.

paulgeorge24 · Post #17 » by **paulgeorge24** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:02 pm

Wizop wrote:Tinsley accepted a buyout. TJ did not. Tinsley burned all bridges with the fans. TJ did not.

TJ never got a handle on the Obie offense and by the time Vogel took over we'd moved on to developing the younger guys knowing TJ wasn't going to be resigned at any price. I'm disappointed we didn't see Lance last night and Friday but I'm not at all disappointed to see TJ get warmed up as we'll need lots of point guard fouls against Chicago.

How did Tinsley burn all bridges with fans? Tinsley did more for this franchise in his time here than TJ could even fathom. And how is that relevant anyways? He was told not to come back after he finished a season on injured reserve. He never said anything or did anything that was detrimental to the team. If bridges were burned, its because fans couldnt put up with a guy getting injured playing in the NBA and then not being able to play often while injured before he was put into a situation similar to TJ.

In regards to M4E's post, TJ has not always been on the bench for games. That is inaccurate. It's not really relevant either because Tinsley was told to pack up his stuff and stay away by management so theres no evidence that contradicts Tinsley wanting to be on the sidelines cheering on his team. Coincidence: same time that the legendary JOB was starting his coaching career here...interesting

I'm not condoning or making excuses for Tinsley's actions when he was here, just pointing out the inaccuracies in arguments for why TJ is being professional and thus more professional than Tinsley was in a similar situation.

Post #18 » by **Miller4ever** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:56 pm

paulgeorge24 wrote:How did Tinsley burn all bridges with fans? Tinsley did more for this franchise in his time here than TJ could even fathom.

Go ahead and poll Pacers fans. See who they hate most out of all previous Pacers point guards. In fact, he may be the most hated Pacer after Ron Artest and Stephen Jackson.

And as for doing more for this franchise, I have no idea why you would even suggest that. As a career 39% FG shooter who missed a crapload of games while the rest of the team was busy winning 60 games and being a complete idiot a lot of the time he was here, I would have to say that his "contribution" to this franchise was more negative than positive. Meanwhile, TJ Ford just hasn't done much, but he never set the Pacers backwards.

chube · Post #19 » by **chube** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:53 pm

I'm definitely in line with Miller's latest post. When it comes to the era of Pacers basketball that I would like to forget, Ron Artest, Stephen Jackson and Jamaal Tinsley are the names that come to mind. Because aside from his first two years or so, he was a headache on and off the court. Whereas TJ just didn't necessarily progress the franchise which was in no small part because he played under Jim O'Brien, whose coaching style is not point guard-friendly to begin with. Plus, you also have to consider how we got TJ - in a trade for Jermaine O'Neal who was aging, injured, has done next to nothing since then, and was part of the whole blowing-up-the-team-and-starting-over-process (plus, I think that's how we got the Roy Hibbert pick isn't it? Through that trade?)

Anyway, my point is that Tinsley and TJ have handled their respective benchings in a polar opposite manner. Tinsley butted heads with the management and it got ugly to the point where we bought him out in exchange for nothing except finally ending the drama and saving a little bit of money. With TJ, he's still wanted in this franchise enough so that he's back in the rotation, and good thing since it looks like Stephenson hasn't moved on from his knuckleheaded ways. So it was nice, especially considering Lance's past, that TJ was still there as insurance. Is that how TJ wanted to be on the roster? In street clothes? No, but there are 15 roster spots and only 12 that can dress so the fact is that there has to be reserves who don't play.

I'll take how TJ handled his situation over Tinsley's any day of the week.

paulgeorge24 · Post #20 » by **paulgeorge24** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 8:34 pm

Neither of you addressed what Tinsley did to burn bridges with fans or supplied any evidence that he butted heads with management after being "banished". (I'll assume that was you making up things trying to prove a point until proven otherwise) The only evidence for either is: Tinsley took a buyout (had to file a grievance because the pacers wouldnt negotiate one) while Ford refused. The fact that he's back in the rotation is irrelevant and doesnt mean that management still thought highly of him so I dont know where you came up with that one. (The Pacers couldnt afford to let Lance get away with violating team rules so conveniently, TJ was still here because we wouldnt be able to survive with only 1 1/2 pg's. with Lance and TJ both inactive) So we're back where we started. :evil:

and i'm sure you watched the games during those seasons. He single handedly won us games some nights. Yeah he had nights where he struggled and lost us some games. But you're kidding yourself by saying that TJ had a more positive impact, especially when TJ has been the guy engineering our 4th quarter collapses the two previous years that ended up keeping us out of the playoffs. Also that era of basketball that you would like to forget is conveniently when we probably had one of the best Pacer teams of all-time in terms of record and talent. Keywords: one of

*shakes head in disappointment*