Hibbert to Minny for #2 Pick

[geistmoney]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... aft_062011

What the HELL is Bird thinking even dangling this? Unless we're getting back Noah, Howard, Horford, Nene and possibly one other center I can't name right now, we shouldn't be trading Roy. Besides what he's done on the court, his off the court activities has helped boost attendance (area 55) and brought a renewed interest to the team. Plus, he's still growing and maturing as player. He beasted Dhoward earlier this year.

Would the Pacers be the new Twolves with 3 SF's on our squad (Granger, George, Williams)? I don't see any value that this trade would bring us, UNLESS we know that Nene is willing to come to Indy for $$$, which i would take.

What are everyone's thoughts?

[lonestar20]

The T'wolves probably won't accept this type of deal so its a moot point. But, to answer your question Bird is thinking he's got a middling, young center who got abused in the Chicago series by an aggressive and active player. Hibbert is fool's gold. Everyone always looks at the measurables of the guy and his nice shooting touch and decent passing ability and overlook the negatives. He's mentally and physically soft on the low block both offensively and defensively. Just re-watch the Chicago series to freshen your memory. There was a reason Foster was getting so many minutes. Hibbert is a nice player don't get me wrong. He can still improve as well, but to me he's only going to ever be a middling center (14ppg/8rpg) who is nice in the regular season. Come postseason time I don't trust him and that's more of an indictment of his mental approach/aggressiveness than anything else.

And if I can land a kid like Derrick Williams for Hibbert and the #15 I do it without thinking twice. And like you said we can provide further frontcourt depth with a Nene/Dalembert/etc...signing. Or make further moves to bolster the front court.

Bottom line is we were the 8th seed in a very weak eastern conference and we are going to have to improve our team vastly through the draft, free agency and yes trades if we want to come close to competing with the upper echelon of the conference. Bird isn't one to be satisfied with having a team consistently getting the 5-8 seeds year in year out. And unfortunately IMO as this roster progresses as currently constructed (and building to our existing core) that's where I see us maxing out...5th seed territory.

[Ruzious]

Speaking as a Wiz fan who got to watch Hibbert at G-town a few times, I'm really surprised Indy doesn't value Hibbert higher - especially seeing how he transformed his body over the last year or so. I see him as becoming one of the NBA's top centers. What would you all say to a trade with Washington - Hibbert for Javale McGee and the 18th pick? Hibbs and Javale are in similar contract situations - likely being RFA's after next season. Javale's got as high a ceiling for a big as there is after Superman, but he's also got the lower BBIQ and will drive you nuts as he develops. I think Wash does it to get a more mature individual who is more likely to re-sign - as he's tied to the DC area. Indy does it to get the player who could be a game-changer - plus the 18th pick - to add young depth.

[Indy2thaWindy]

That's bad for the Pacers. Williams is gonna be a 6th man tweener. Toronto wouldn't trade DeRozan for Williams. You know why? Because Williams isn't good. This trade leaves the Pacers with two bigs under contract, Hansbrough and Willams. Both are 6'8.

A lineup of Collison/George/Granger/Hansbrough/Williams?

Asking the Pacers to throw in a 1sr?

Only reason lonestar20 says do it is because he doesn't like Hibbert.

Not only is that gonna a be a terrible defensive team, but a team with nobody to really run the offense through. We were a good team last year when we ran the ball through Hibbert. Then JOB went away from it and then we started suckin because we was shooting too many 3's. Vogel comes in and runs the offense through Hibbert again. We're back to .500+ basketball to finish out the season. According to this trade we need to go back to being smallball 3pt chucking scrubs again without a low post option on offense or defense. Forget that.

[Indy2thaWindy]

Speaking as a Wiz fan who got to watch Hibbert at G-town a few times, I'm really surprised Indy doesn't value Hibbert higher - especially seeing how he transformed his body over the last year or so. I see him as becoming one of the NBA's top centers. What would you all say to a trade with Washington - Hibbert for Javale McGee and the 18th pick? Hibbs and Javale are in similar contract situations - likely being RFA's after next season. Javale's got as high a ceiling for a big as there is after Superman, but he's also got the lower BBIQ and will drive you nuts as he develops. I think Wash does it to get a more mature individual who is more likely to re-sign - as he's tied to the DC area. Indy does it to get the player who could be a game-changer - plus the 18th pick - to add young depth.

I wouldn't do it, but it's a much better offer than #2 for Hibbert & #15.

[lonestar20]

@Indy-

Its not that I don't like Hibbert. I just think that we can do better and that he's never going to blossom into what a lot of people on here expect. Also, you keep acting like after a trade of this kind Bird would be done adjusting the roster. If, and this is a big if, but if we do trade Hibbert do you really believe Bird is going to sit tight and enter the season with only Hansbrough/Derrick Williams in our front court? Of course he wouldn't. We'd make other moves or add depth via free agency. To imply after this kind of trade that our roster would be set isn't accurate at all.

Again, I like Hibbert. I just don't love the guy.

Also, I'm not a fan of McGee and wouldn't be interested in that deal. So, no I wouldn't just give him away in any kind of deal. I do value Hibbert, but we need considerably more talent on the roster. We just differ on what kind of player Derrick Williams will end up being.

[8305]

I'm actually intrigued by this. I think Williams could be very good. A match up nightmare for 4's. In that game against Duke and throughout the NCAA Tournament he reminded me of Blake Griffin. Imagine running Goerge, Granger and Williams at the 2,3 and 4. There's a bunch of defensive problems for most any team in the League.

As for Roy there was a stretch of time last season when he completely went into the tank. During that stretch he was flat out embarassing. Do you blame that all on JOB? I don't think you can help but question Roy's mental toughness. I'm generally a pretty big supporter of Roy but Williams could be a really unique talent.

As for replacing him. Take a look at Dallas's other center Brendon Hayward. A little overpaid but a big time defender and capable rebounder. He could actually be a pretty good fit with Granger, Williams and George. Betting Hayward is acquireable too.

I'm not saying I'm sold on the idea of trading Hibbert but, this is not a slam dunk bad idea.

Sorry Indy, I know some day we will agree on something.

[Indy2thaWindy]

What kind of player do you see Derrick Williams being?

In the last day you've made two Hibbert trades on the trade board.

And then

I'm not the biggest Hibbert fan.

I just assumed you didn't like Hibbert.

My bad for assuming. Shouldn't do it.

[chube]

I'm not big on this idea (and I'm a little biased because Hibbert is my favorite Pacer right now.)

That would leave a huge logjam at the wing with Williams, Granger and George. Look at the past few champions and how they had at least quality bigs - Mavs had Chandler, Lakers had Bynum, Celtics had Perkins, Spurs had Duncan. Duncan aside, I believe Roy could match and surpass the level of the other 3. In a league where quality starting 5's are so rare, having a 7'2" guy with the skillset Hibbert has is a blessing. Plus, as it was mentioned, he's a quality dude who has embraced the community and is getting that love in return.

I'm not too worried though. It's not even a main article. Just a two-sentence blurb buried in another article. Remember when we were supposedly discussing Granger for the #2/Beasley/Rubio? That rumor was floating around for about a day and we haven't heard anything since.

[Indy2thaWindy]

Sorry Indy, I know some day we will agree on something.

Who should we go with at 15?

[lonestar20]

@Indy-

By saying "I'm not the biggest Hibbert fan" all I'm saying is that is one area where I'd definitely like the Pacers to look at improving. In means would I just fire sale the guy. He's got value, but I just don't see him as ever becoming an upper echelon center. If we keep him I hope I end up being dead wrong.

As far as D errick Willliams I see him being a severe matchup problem. I think he'll be able to take less mobile/athletic 4s outside and shoot/drive on them with ease. If the defense tries to guard him with a smaller, more slender SF I think he can take them down to the block and use his size and strength to score or get to the line. Not sure what kind of defender he can be, but with the kind of athlete he is I'd expect him to at the very least be a good defender. In short, I think he can be an all-star by his 3rd year.

Finally, his shooting percentages is what really excite me. Shooting 57% from 3 and 75% from the line bode well for him. I don't think he translates immediately to shooting the NBA 3, but having that range out to 19-20 feet is going to cause some serious problems for opposing bigs. And if he's shooting mid 70% at the stripe that IMO lays the foundation for him to be a consistent 80% FT shooter in the NBA. Having him and Paul George on the floor I think will provide the Pacers with lots of FT opportunities and some easy points.

[cavsfan_osiris]

I'm very surprised at this. It's a terrible idea to trade a big like Hibbert for a tweener like Williams.

[laydo]

source: Adrian Wojnarowski

huh....

[chube]

The thing is is that it looks like the rumor hasn't picked up any steam. It was just a two-sentence blurb as part of the bigger Josh Smith article. I'm not worried yet. I'd hate to lose Roy though. I just got an autographed picture of him!

[dmacdaddy30]

I remember the same conversation came up with Rick Smits. You do not give up on a 7'2 center. There are not many to go around. There are plenty of 6'9 tweeners in the league so I would consider this a bad trade unless we are missing some pieces.

If we did a trade with Hilbbert, I would actually go something along the lines of Minn # 2 and Beasley for Hilbbert, Rush and 15. With the # 2 I would select Kanter. Beasley can start at the 4 with Kanter coming off of the bench. Beaslery is a one year starter as we will get the best out of him since it is a contract year. Can resign McRob for a two year deal for the third PF back up and find a center out there via free agency such as Nene or others. This way we are only focusing on getting a vet Center instead of having to find a vet PF and Center. You can always find a backup SF,

PG = DC/Price/Stephenson
SG = George/Jones
SF = Granger/Posey/
PF = Beasley/Hanbrough/McRob
C = Nene or Chandler/Kanter

[Indy2thaWindy]

I remember the same conversation came up with Rick Smits. You do not give up on a 7'2 center. There are not many to go around. There are plenty of 6'9 tweeners in the league so I would consider this a bad trade unless we are missing some pieces.

If we did a trade with Hilbbert, I would actually go something along the lines of Minn # 2 and Beasley for Hilbbert, Rush and 15. With the # 2 I would select Kanter. Beasley can start at the 4 with Kanter coming off of the bench. Beaslery is a one year starter as we will get the best out of him since it is a contract year. Can resign McRob for a two year deal for the third PF back up and find a center out there via free agency such as Nene or others. This way we are only focusing on getting a vet Center instead of having to find a vet PF and Center. You can always find a backup SF,

PG = DC/Price/Stephenson
SG = George/Jones
SF = Granger/Posey/
PF = Beasley/Hanbrough/McRob
C = Nene or Chandler/Kanter

If you can get a Nene or Chandler why not go with

Lance/DC/Price
George/Brooks/Jones
Granger/Rush/2nd Round Pick/Posey
Nene or Chandler/Hansbrough/McRoberts
Hibbert/Nene or Chandler/Foster

[mizzoupacers]

It's a false rumor.

At least, Larry Bird denies it to the Indianapolis Star.

[dmacdaddy30]

at Indy2thaWindy - I would rather do that instead of the trade, but I was just proposing a trade that would kinda of make sense based on the original rumor.

[camahl]

Indiana do this and its the worst move in a long long time!

[8305]

Sorry Indy, I know some day we will agree on something.

Who should we go with at 15?

I'm not as high on Brooks as it seems most people are. Wonder how a high volume shooter in college translates to the Pacers. Don't see him getting to be a high volume shooter here and if that's the case how will he react? Alec Burks is more interesting to me based on the possibility he could play some point guard. I could probably get with Klay Thompson or Kenneth Faried too.

Mike Wells had Jan Vesely falling to the Pacers in his mock. If he's there and the Pacers don't take him I'd be disappointed. Also wonder about Jonas Valcencius (buy out settled but not playing in the NBA this year)? It would really be interesting if he fell. How many teams ahead of us can afford to draft a guy who won't play next year? An opportunity to make a San Antonio move is intersting. Haven't answered your question. Probably because I have no idea. Expect this to be an entertaining draft though.