RealGM

When you think about how oh my gosh we need to trade Granger and make Hibbert and George the lead of the franchise going forward, two thoughts entered my mind.

1. This is a philosophy built on team, no one better then anyone else, all have to work together to become a championship contender. If we were heading into rebuilding mode I could understand the need to trade Granger now.

2. Lebron James! In the playoffs last year it was just an experiment at PF for Lebron James, this year it could become more and more a reality and it may become more important to have a player of Granger's capability to play PF to match Lebron. I love West to death, but in a finals matchup against the Heat, his minutes may dwindle to next to nothing because James athletically off the ball can prevent a lot of post passes despite the mismatches against Bosh!

Thoughts!!!

We have Hansbrough. Who needs to worry about LeBron?

So you found a new whipping boy to hyper focus on yet, now that Darren Collison is a Maverick Indy2?

I completely disagree.

Hibbert, West, and Granger have all shown they can and will be productive parts of a team, and we've seen moments of leadership and skills from Hill as well. The one person yet to prove himself is Paul George.

Now, no doubt George is a good player. He shows his streaks of greatness and potential with his clutch 3s and amazing momentum boosting dunks throughout the season. People have been saying how much "potential" he has. He will be going into his 3rd (Correct me if I'm wrong) season in the NBA. At some point that potential needs to show up on the court. That time is now. We can't wait any more years hoping another player falls into our laps late into the draft; George needs to step up.

He hardly showed up in the playoffs, and I would argue he and Barbosa could be most attributed to the loss to Miami. His shooting was awful, his passing horrid, and his decision making worst of all. He played like a rookie again. He seemed to lack confidence being guarded by Wade, and seemed to not give the explosiveness he did throughout the regular season. He HAS to show up in the playoffs, or we won't win a 7 game series against Miami.

George is the key to this team this upcoming year, not Granger. He can turn the team into the best we've seen in years, or he can break this team and send us back to mediocre land with middle round draft picks.

Jake0890 wrote:I completely disagree.

Hibbert, West, and Granger have all shown they can and will be productive parts of a team, and we've seen moments of leadership and skills from Hill as well. The one person yet to prove himself is Paul George.

Now, no doubt George is a good player. He shows his streaks of greatness and potential with his clutch 3s and amazing momentum boosting dunks throughout the season. People have been saying how much "potential" he has. He will be going into his 3rd (Correct me if I'm wrong) season in the NBA. At some point that potential needs to show up on the court. That time is now. We can't wait any more years hoping another player falls into our laps late into the draft; George needs to step up.

He hardly showed up in the playoffs, and I would argue he and Barbosa could be most attributed to the loss to Miami. His shooting was awful, his passing horrid, and his decision making worst of all. He played like a rookie again. He seemed to lack confidence being guarded by Wade, and seemed to not give the explosiveness he did throughout the regular season. He HAS to show up in the playoffs, or we won't win a 7 game series against Miami.

George is the key to this team this upcoming year, not Granger. He can turn the team into the best we've seen in years, or he can break this team and send us back to mediocre land with middle round draft picks.

...

George had a really good season last year. He was 21 years old, comparing his 2nd season to Granger's (who was 2 years older) Per 36 George averaged the same amount of points, way more rebounds, almost twice as many assists more than twice as many steals, and he was already a better defender than Granger. He was also way better than Roy was his 2nd year.

As for the playoffs, he was our 5th option offensively, and put all of his energy into defending Wade in that Miami series, which payed off for the first 4 games, which may have been the worst 4 playoff games Wade has ever played in his life. George is progressing fine. Granger was the largely disappointing one during the Miami series, he's the leader, and the vet, and should be counted on to step up more than a 21 year old kid trying to guard an all-world player. I don't entirely blame Granger because James is a handful, but the expectations on established players and vets should certainly be higher than on a 21 year old with that matchup.

George has alot of talent, but noone on this team is going to explode statistically, at least in terms of points, we have too balanced a roster, and noone plays very many minutes. If he has a comparable improvement from his 2nd to 3rd year as he did from his 1st to his 2nd then he'll be well on his way to being a future all-star. He isn't even close to his prime years yet.

Fwiw I heard Mark Boyle say the other day that for the Pacers to be remarkably better this year Paul George will need to have a break out season.

daschysta wrote:but noone on this team is going to explode statistically, at least in terms of points, we have too balanced a roster, and noone plays very many minutes.

In my eyes, you can't do well without having a go-to scorer late in games. We don't have a guy who steps up to take the big shots, because Granger doesn't have the best decision-making in the clutch.

You can spread the ball around as much as you want, but you need a clutch and go-to scorer.

8305 wrote:Fwiw I heard Mark Boyle say the other day that for the Pacers to be remarkably better this year Paul George will need to have a break out season.

George is definety due for a breakout season. He's worked hard all summer long i've heard, even with a coach most of the time in Indianapolis. He's as committed to being the best as anyone. But, he still will need someone else. We will still need to rely heavily on Granger.

But, this does worry me: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ly_In_Camp

Worries me a lot, actually.

Grang33r wrote:

8305 wrote:Fwiw I heard Mark Boyle say the other day that for the Pacers to be remarkably better this year Paul George will need to have a break out season.

George is definety due for a breakout season. He's worked hard all summer long i've heard, even with a coach most of the time in Indianapolis. He's as committed to being the best as anyone. But, he still will need someone else. We will still need to rely heavily on Granger.

But, this does worry me: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ly_In_Camp

Worries me a lot, actually.

Meh. He's had nicks and bruises constantly, such as the tweaked ankle against the Miami Heat. I doubt it'll be that much of a factor come season-opener.

Out "indefinitely" doesn't sound good. Usually means a long time. Strange. Not day-to-day, or a week or two. Why indefinitely? For just soreness?

sounds like surgery is coming

Uh oh. If granger is out, will George be starting SF, his natural position, and Green starting SG?

I doubt it. first, I'm not sure I'd say 3 is George's natural position. he's always been mostly a 2 for us and besides the 2 and the 3 are pretty interchangeable in our offense and we know he can defend the 2. second, why change two things to fix one problem? that creates unnecessary disruption.

Well, Green and George are going to be the starters. How you view them (2 vs. 3) is likely in the eye of the beholder. Ultimately, the definition likely just isn't necessary.

Wizop wrote:I doubt it. first, I'm not sure I'd say 3 is George's natural position. he's always been mostly a 2 for us and besides the 2 and the 3 are pretty interchangeable in our offense and we know he can defend the 2. second, why change two things to fix one problem? that creates unnecessary disruption.

Sure, the 2 and 3 are interchangeable, but I still think George first better guarding a 3, rather than a 2. George weighs more, has a bigger reach (I think), and is just more apt to guarding more physical players.

Jake0890 wrote:

Grang33r wrote:

8305 wrote:Fwiw I heard Mark Boyle say the other day that for the Pacers to be remarkably better this year Paul George will need to have a break out season.

George is definety due for a breakout season. He's worked hard all summer long i've heard, even with a coach most of the time in Indianapolis. He's as committed to being the best as anyone. But, he still will need someone else. We will still need to rely heavily on Granger.

But, this does worry me: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ly_In_Camp

Worries me a lot, actually.

Meh. He's had nicks and bruises constantly, such as the tweaked ankle against the Miami Heat. I doubt it'll be that much of a factor come season-opener.

Still not worried?

Grang33r wrote:

Jake0890 wrote:

Grang33r wrote:
Meh. He's had nicks and bruises constantly, such as the tweaked ankle against the Miami Heat. I doubt it'll be that much of a factor come season-opener.

Still not worried?

Nope, I do think its a problem now.

I'm seriously concerned about bench offense while he's out. With Green starting we're awfully thin.

Vogel really needs to have Green coming off the bench as the go to guy with that second unit and make Young the starter. I've said that since it was announced Granger was out. Green is our scoring punch off the bench, and frankly, without him, the bench is not very good. He's the 5th option in with the starters, and he knows it, whereas with the bench he's the go to guy. Sam can just come in with the starting 5, focus on locking someone down, and get his if it falls in his lap. Vogel has to see that and make the switch

Vogel is keeping either Green or George on the court at all times so that Lance and Sam will not be on the court together in the second unit. that accomplishes the same thing as starting Young while giving the better player, Green, more minutes.