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Great move benching Evan Turner. He dribbles the ball tooooo much and turns the ball over a lot. I hope the same happens today benching him. I hope he goes away after the season is over.

Welcome fella!

Agreed, I was excited for him to join us, but he is too clingy with the ball and inefficient on D. I would be surprised if we see him at all in action the rest of this post season.

Could you make an argument that Solomon Hill should dress ahead of Turner? He's probably a better defender maybe better shooting the three

I think Turner is an excellent player he may be a match up problem for this series, he handles the ball very well is a great rebounder for 6'7'' he can drive and pass like a point guard, but he's used to being a starter. If we are playing small ball I'd bench Hibbert and George Hill and start Ian at C and Turner at Point.

Fact is we have a lot of guys on this team who can flat play and if our starters can't get it done they should sit. If we lose this series I predict major changes will be made, we could see two starters traded, you know the 2 who tend to disappear at times.

basketballwacko2 wrote:I think Turner is an excellent player he may be a match up problem for this series, he handles the ball very well is a great rebounder for 6'7'' he can drive and pass like a point guard, but he's used to being a starter. If we are playing small ball I'd bench Hibbert and George Hill and start Ian at C and Turner at Point.

Evan Turner was an excellent college player. Excellent NBA player? I guess that depends on how you define it. Major contributor on a good NBA team? Hasn't happened yet for Evan. Run up big stats on a bad team, sure.

I see a guy who is a good rebounder for a wing player. He also has a good handle for a wing player too. But is he a guy a good team will want handling the ball a lot? Remains to be seen. In the mean time he's an unremarkable shooter and defender (the two skills most important for wing players that play on good teams).

He was the best player on a VERY bad team this season. They gave him and Allen away, the trade baffles me, I guess it was a money thing. Turner needs to be a starter. The games when we ran the 2nd unit he was a stud. I'd like to see him back and us do this: trade George Hill or Roy if not both like I just posted in a new thread and start this lineup:

C Ian
PF West
SF Paul George
SG Turner
PG Lance

We get a backup Center and Depth in the trades maybe future picks, spend the cap savings on Lance, Turner and Allen.

It all depends on how we do further on in the playoffs.

As I write this post Hibbert and Hill have the best +/- in Game 7.

Pacers WIN !!!!!! with Evan on the PINE ... lol ... Please Frank ..... Keep Evan in warm-ups against Washington. I do welcome Scola back to the rotation.

Evan is a very capable player. There is no question on his talent and on what he can do. He's just not used in playing on a system, not to mention as a bench player. If he keeps doing what he does, like he did in Philly, then the Pacers will surely have a problem since this is a team with far greater offensive options than him. He needs to understand what is needed of him and that is not to assume the role of a scoring leader or the main man.

I think Evan will be back in the series with Washington, the Pacers will need him if Stephenson and George need to rest. I think the problem with him in the series with Atlanta is that the offense gets stagnant whenever he tries to create. And with our offense not really working early in the series, we just cannot afford to wait for his game to turnaround. What the Pacers need more is the playmaking of Stephenson, and Turner still needs to learn how to do exactly just that.

Evan can do stuff, but that stuff is producing a net negative for our squad, kind of like Augustin last season. Integrating new talent takes time, and it's been shown time and again that when you're trying to integrate a career starter into the bench, it's a difficult process for many, especially in a relatively structured and disciplined system.

xmaster wrote:Pacers WIN !!!!!! with Evan on the PINE ... lol ... Please Frank ..... Keep Evan in warm-ups against Washington. I do welcome Scola back to the rotation.

I think the lesson of the Atlanta series needs to be that you need to be willing to adjust your rotation in the playoffs. Evan needed to sit against Atlanta because of the match-ups. ultimately too we tightened the rotation. I hope Vogel will be much quicker in adapting his rotation to Washington. at this point, I can't even tell you who they bring off their bench. I'm not ready to assume that because Evan didn't have a fit against Atlanta that the same will be true against Washington. and Scola was a big part of the game 2 win against Atlanta even though he struggled later.

I'm so glad Vogel decided to sit Turner and Scola. Both have played horribly for us lately and gave no energy at all. At least Cope and Butler tried. It must have been irking some guys to see them out there playing lazy and getting minutes for no reason.

Wizop wrote:

xmaster wrote:Pacers WIN !!!!!! with Evan on the PINE ... lol ... Please Frank ..... Keep Evan in warm-ups against Washington. I do welcome Scola back to the rotation.

I think the lesson of the Atlanta series needs to be that you need to be willing to adjust your rotation in the playoffs. Evan needed to sit against Atlanta because of the match-ups. ultimately too we tightened the rotation. I hope Vogel will be much quicker in adapting his rotation to Washington. at this point, I can't even tell you who they bring off their bench. I'm not ready to assume that because Evan didn't have a fit against Atlanta that the same will be true against Washington. and Scola was a big part of the game 2 win against Atlanta even though he struggled later.

Agreed Wizop, I might be too harsh on him and it could be that we need him against the Wiz. However, he should be playing for a contract and he hasn't been doing. I don't think any team out there will offer him over MLE and if they do they probably need checking out.

I think he is a nice guy, but he isn't doing enough to convince me, and these are the playoffs... not much room for error. Play him the first couple of games, see how he gets on, but if it doesn't work defensively he needs to sit.

No doubt it was smart for Vogel to go away from Turner and Hibbert in this series. But, as Vogel mentioned today after practice, they will need Scola and Turner to have a bigger impact in the second round, and if we are going to make life difficult for Washington, we will need the Roy Hibbert of few months ago to come back. He was fantastic in Game 7, but they will need more of it going forwards.

8305 wrote:Could you make an argument that Solomon Hill should dress ahead of Turner? He's probably a better defender maybe better shooting the three

I am not sure how you can make that arguement?

I am a big supporter of Solomon Hill too, so this is not a knock on him as a player. He hasn't really adjusted to the NBA game yet in his first season, and the playoffs are higher intensity and quicker pace. I think he'd be lost out there if he was playing to be honest.

Grang33r wrote:

8305 wrote:Could you make an argument that Solomon Hill should dress ahead of Turner? He's probably a better defender maybe better shooting the three

I am not sure how you can make that arguement?

I am a big supporter of Solomon Hill too, so this is not a knock on him as a player. He hasn't really adjusted to the NBA game yet in his first season, and the playoffs are higher intensity and quicker pace. I think he'd be lost out there if he was playing to be honest.

Yeah, you are probably right. Management looks bad enough from making the trade. If he wasn't even dressing it would simply be throwing salt on the wound. But since you asked here's how I'd make the arguement.

Turner and Stephenson especially and even Turner and George to a lesser extent are just a bad combinations. They all tend to over handle the ball and neither Stephenson or Turner are respected enough as shooters to create any space. Stephenson and George have worked enough together that things work when they share the floor. For whatever reason I don't think Turner has been excepted by the rest of the team. Throw in Turner's poor defense and when I total it all up I'm not sure it would be any worse with Solomon Hill. Someone on the radio threw out his +/- the other day. That in itself might indicate that it couldn't be much worse.

Grang33r wrote:But, as Vogel mentioned today after practice, they will need Scola and Turner to have a bigger impact in the second round

praise in public and criticize in private. I wouldn't read too much into that comment as he'd need to say that if only to build confidence.

Grang33r wrote:

8305 wrote:Could you make an argument that Solomon Hill should dress ahead of Turner? He's probably a better defender maybe better shooting the three

Rasual Butler should play ahead of either of them and if match-ups allow you'd play Cope ahead of Solo at the three too. still I think you dress Turner because he might be a better third point guard than Sloan.

Turner will be an interesting play this series. Atlanta played a VERY smart series and took advantage of any possible advantages they had. This time around with Wizards, they run a conservative offense and will Indiana's TEAM DEFENSE the opportunity to show off their only valuable skill!

Unfortunately, the Bulls made the Wizards look better than they are because of our limited offense.

I am super excited for this series and have the Pacers in six at most with Nene and Gortat shooting about 40% while Beal and Wall get worn to the ground mid-way through game 4 by Paul George, George Hill, Lance Stephenson, AND CJ WATSON!

Wizop wrote:

Grang33r wrote:But, as Vogel mentioned today after practice, they will need Scola and Turner to have a bigger impact in the second round

praise in public and criticize in private. I wouldn't read too much into that comment as he'd need to say that if only to build confidence.

Grang33r wrote:

8305 wrote:Could you make an argument that Solomon Hill should dress ahead of Turner? He's probably a better defender maybe better shooting the three

Rasual Butler should play ahead of either of them and if match-ups allow you'd play Cope ahead of Solo at the three too. still I think you dress Turner because he might be a better third point guard than Sloan.

I think Rasual should be first as well, experienced and lethal in the corners plus he doesn't shirk on D.

Copeland has really annoyed me these series. He is way too weak on perimeter defense to be allowed to play against anybody that can shoot and he hasn't exactly overwhelmed on inside D either, nor on offense. I am still scratching my head over him being +17 for game 5, I just don't know how that happened as each time I saw him I also saw a Hawk shoot some open shot that he should have covered.

I definitely have seen why he didn't play a lot all year, he isn't good enough defensively at all.

Turner can still be an x-factor but the issue is he has to do it in short bursts because he is probably even more of a defensive liability than Cope is... So he can only come on when we need a quick 4-8 points off the bench and when Lance isn't on the floor, and he isn't the player that is effective in those situations.

So as I said, I think Rasual should play those minutes ahead of either of these two.

Robertchk wrote:Turner will be an interesting play this series. Atlanta played a VERY smart series and took advantage of any possible advantages they had. This time around with Wizards, they run a conservative offense and will Indiana's TEAM DEFENSE the opportunity to show off their only valuable skill!

Unfortunately, the Bulls made the Wizards look better than they are because of our limited offense.

I am super excited for this series and have the Pacers in six at most with Nene and Gortat shooting about 40% while Beal and Wall get worn to the ground mid-way through game 4 by Paul George, George Hill, Lance Stephenson, AND CJ WATSON!

CJ is going to be crucial this series, if he can bully and control Miller than we will gain points with the second unit out, if he can't than we will lose points during those stretches.