Pacers vs. Lakers

[boomershadow]

So much nostalgia for this game given that we know for sure it will be Kobe's last year. And the reunion between Hibbert and his former team. I really don't have any desire to see the Lakers win this game, but I would love to see Hibbert give PG one monster block near the basket to remember him by.

[ThirtyOne]

Looks like you got your wish.

Lakers are a joke. Pacers should win by atleast 20.

[mikepacernation]

Honestly a really bad pacer game. Should've won by more then they did


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[boomershadow]

It was no joke. Around the seven minute mark I thought we were playing too fast. We were up by 15 and we were letting it turn into a shootout. That isn't what to do with that kind of lead. Playing that quick at the wrong moment just leads to momentum. Couple Nick Young 3s and it was in single digits. Add in a few from Kobe and World Peace, and we ended up with a nailbiter down to the whistle. I know we are down some guys in the front court, but that is the time to play tough, rough, and slowly let the air out of your opponent. Don't help generate the energy they eventually use against you.

A win is a win, but there were lots of things we were doing that arent sustainable. Can't let sub-500 teams turn a sure win into a shootout. Can't play that inconsistently against the better teams in the league and expect to pull out a W like we did tonight.

And Chase Budinger needs to worry about playing more solidly. He is so out of control playing uptempo and trying to make a wild play that every time he gets the ball I chew my fingernails that he gonna turn it over.

[ThirtyOne]

It was a joke. We were playing the 2nd worst team in the NBA and easily had a double digit lead most of the night. Pacers did enough to get the W after the Lakers made a run at the end.

Now onto the clippers, which is a game I think the team will take much more seriously.

[pacers33granger]

And Chase Budinger needs to worry about playing more solidly. He is so out of control playing uptempo and trying to make a wild play that every time he gets the ball I chew my fingernails that he gonna turn it over.

Yup, and he is way too unsure about shooting the three at times, which is the one thing he's semi-good at. Lots of times he'll be open and it will take him a split second to decide he's shooting and he ends up bricking it because he's not in motion. He missed quite a few rotations on defense as well tonight.

[mikepacernation]

I don't know about you guy but I can't stand when chase is on the floor. He's just not that good. Idc if he can hit the 3 sometimes. He's just a poor player who should be at best a 12-15th man on a team..


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[ThirtyOne]

I don't know about you guy but I can't stand when chase is on the floor. He's just not that good. Idc if he can hit the 3 sometimes. He's just a poor player who should be at best a 12-15th man on a team..


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Bud has not been too impressive, thats for sure. Id like to think hes actually a better ballplayer than what hes shown so far...maybe needs more time to get comfortable with the team. Seems like hes thinking too much.

[Scoot McGroot]

Anyone else notice that Hibbert and Mahinmi put up nearly identical statlines in similar minutes played last night?

Roy: 27 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 9 reb, 2blk
Ian: 28 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 10reb, 2blk

[basketballwacko2]

It was a joke. We were playing the 2nd worst team in the NBA and easily had a double digit lead most of the night. Pacers did enough to get the W after the Lakers made a run at the end.

Now onto the clippers, which is a game I think the team will take much more seriously.

At the end of the year it's still a win. We're starting to think that we should be stomping these bad teams, but let's not forget they are NBA teams, even if they have a bad record. They were playing at home and there was the Kobe announcement.

We have a big game coming up with the Clippers they've been off a bit not playing well, so maybe we get a win on their home court too.

[basketballwacko2]

Anyone else notice that Hibbert and Mahinmi put up nearly identical statlines in similar minutes played last night?

Roy: 27 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 9 reb, 2blk
Ian: 28 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 10reb, 2blk

That's a good point Roy $15 million.

Ian $4 million.

[basketballwacko2]

Continuing my look at the other teams game thread after we beat them, no trolling ok guys. Check out the opening post from the game thread here's a snippit. Look at point #3!

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1415826#start_here

Keys to the Game:

1. Control the glass, especially those 2nd chance opportunities

2. Limit the 3pt Shot, we'll need to against this new Indy squad. Make them put it on the floor

3. Control the paint, I'm looking for Randle to abuse Paul George and Hibbert do it on the defensive end

4. Find Kobe on catch and shoot opportunities, avoid the heavy iso plays. We'll need balanced scoring to win this one

5. Get off to a good start to avoid playing from behind for 3 quarter

6. Our bench has to outscore their bench somehow

[pacers33granger]

Anyone else notice that Hibbert and Mahinmi put up nearly identical statlines in similar minutes played last night?

Roy: 27 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 9 reb, 2blk
Ian: 28 minutes, 2-3fg, 4-6ft, 8pts, 10reb, 2blk

Yeah once the league cracked down on the verticality thing Hibbert's impact took a major dive (plus him sulking and being a cancer last year). Outside of being a better shooter overall (though honestly this year I think Ian has shown more touch down low than Hibbert ever had) and slightly better at protecting the rim, they're not much different of players. Oh and Ian has been a great leader for this team since he got here.

Really hoping we can lock Ian up after this season to a reasonable deal, but the way he's playing I could see someone offering him near 10 mil. Pretty crazy that when we traded Collison for him in a sign and trade it was panned as a horrible deal everywhere, but we really got the better end of the deal in the long run.

[Jake0890]

Bad game, should have beaten them more handily.

Still, PG named EC player of the week and the Pacers are now listed at #5 in the league power rankings. Respect coming the Pacers' way now, eh?

[pacers33granger]

I don't know about you guy but I can't stand when chase is on the floor. He's just not that good. Idc if he can hit the 3 sometimes. He's just a poor player who should be at best a 12-15th man on a team..


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Bud has not been too impressive, thats for sure. Id like to think hes actually a better ballplayer than what hes shown so far...maybe needs more time to get comfortable with the team. Seems like hes thinking too much.

I honestly believe that Rudez gave us more last year as a rookie than Bud has so far. He shot better last year than Bud ever has and it's not like it's a small sample as he played over 1000 minutes. Yeah Rudez sucked at rebounding, but so does Bud and we have more than enough guys to cover that on this team.

And I don't believe Bud is better than this. His current numbers are right in line with his career averages. Nor do I believe he "makes the right play" as some announcers have been saying (which is sometimes code for "we don't know why this guy is on the floor"). Vogel just needs to give his minutes to GRIII.

[Scoot McGroot]

I don't know about you guy but I can't stand when chase is on the floor. He's just not that good. Idc if he can hit the 3 sometimes. He's just a poor player who should be at best a 12-15th man on a team..


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Bud has not been too impressive, thats for sure. Id like to think hes actually a better ballplayer than what hes shown so far...maybe needs more time to get comfortable with the team. Seems like hes thinking too much.

I honestly believe that Rudez gave us more last year as a rookie than Bud has so far. He shot better last year than Bud ever has and it's not like it's a small sample as he played over 1000 minutes. Yeah Rudez sucked at rebounding, but so does Bud and we have more than enough guys to cover that on this team.

And I don't believe Bud is better than this. His current numbers are right in line with his career averages. Nor do I believe he "makes the right play" as some announcers have been saying (which is sometimes code for "we don't know why this guy is on the floor"). Vogel just needs to give his minutes to GRIII.

Damo hit 3's, but it's disingenuous to say that he gave us more than Chase does. Damo wasn't just a bad rebounder: he was a historically bad rebounder. Also, the surprising thing is that our team defense is statistically better with Chase on the court than without. We give up almost 4 less points per 100 possessions when Chase is on defense. Last year, we were almost 2 points per 100 possessions worse offensively and defensively when Damo was on the court. IF Chase's shot comes around, we're infinitely better off. Even if it doesn't, we're still well better off with Chase than Damo. Chase isn't the answer to anything, but right now, he's likely less of a problem. When compared to Damo, it's a simple answer. Chase is better. Easily. When compared to the other possibilities on our roster like GR3, Stuckey, etc? Well, that's a better discussion.

[pacers33granger]

Bud has not been too impressive, thats for sure. Id like to think hes actually a better ballplayer than what hes shown so far...maybe needs more time to get comfortable with the team. Seems like hes thinking too much.

I honestly believe that Rudez gave us more last year as a rookie than Bud has so far. He shot better last year than Bud ever has and it's not like it's a small sample as he played over 1000 minutes. Yeah Rudez sucked at rebounding, but so does Bud and we have more than enough guys to cover that on this team.

And I don't believe Bud is better than this. His current numbers are right in line with his career averages. Nor do I believe he "makes the right play" as some announcers have been saying (which is sometimes code for "we don't know why this guy is on the floor"). Vogel just needs to give his minutes to GRIII.

Damo hit 3's, but it's disingenuous to say that he gave us more than Chase does. Damo wasn't just a bad rebounder: he was a historically bad rebounder. Also, the surprising thing is that our team defense is statistically better with Chase on the court than without. We give up almost 4 less points per 100 possessions when Chase is on defense. Last year, we were almost 2 points per 100 possessions worse offensively and defensively when Damo was on the court. IF Chase's shot comes around, we're infinitely better off. Even if it doesn't, we're still well better off with Chase than Damo. Chase isn't the answer to anything, but right now, he's likely less of a problem. When compared to Damo, it's a simple answer. Chase is better. Easily. When compared to the other possibilities on our roster like GR3, Stuckey, etc? Well, that's a better discussion.

I think those defensive statistics will start to change soon since we've played a bunch of teams that have poor benches with no scoring options. We also have a pretty good bench right now with scoring options (Stuckey and Turner before the injury mainly). And any sort of on/off stats are going to likely be poor for our players last year with how the team was.

I also think that Chase's shot won't "come around" so to speak since he's shooting slightly better than his career average. Even at it's highest his TS% was 1.6% higher and that was 4 years ago in Houston. So I think that what we're seeing with Bud is exactly what he is and I don't expect his shot to get better.

Damo's rebounding was very bad, but remember he played SF a lot of last year and was on the perimeter. I'd imagine it'd still be very bad, but slightly better if he was defending in the post more often. And it's not like Bud is really helping us in that aspect at all, he's at 6.1 TRB%. Certainly higher than Rudez's 2.5 last year, but still.

Ultimately the thing to me is that Damo is clearly a better shooter and was much more confident in his shot even as a rookie learning the NBA game. Bud is out there solely for his shooting so why not have the better shooter? Last year I was confident that Rudez would hit an open three if he had it. I don't have that confidence in Bud right now.

[Miller4ever]

I got to go to this game for free. Kobe's announcement made it into a game the fans really wanted to win, as opposed to the tanking. Reggie was there, sitting near the Laker's bench, giving him some words after the game. Makes me wish the days they would fight each other. In a good way, of course.

[Miller4ever]

I just learned I'm going to Wednesday's game vs. the Clippers for free, too. Boom, baby. That'll hopefully be a better game all around.

[Scoot McGroot]

Damo's rebounding was very bad, but remember he played SF a lot of last year and was on the perimeter. I'd imagine it'd still be very bad, but slightly better if he was defending in the post more often. And it's not like Bud is really helping us in that aspect at all, he's at 6.1 TRB%. Certainly higher than Rudez's 2.5 last year, but still.

Ultimately the thing to me is that Damo is clearly a better shooter and was much more confident in his shot even as a rookie learning the NBA game. Bud is out there solely for his shooting so why not have the better shooter? Last year I was confident that Rudez would hit an open three if he had it. I don't have that confidence in Bud right now.

Damo hurt us in so many other ways that the only reason he had a chance of being on the court was to hit a 3. Otherwise, he leaked points defensively like a sieve.

As for rebounding, the SF position has nothing to do with it. Budinger plays the same SF position that Damo did and is rebounding at orders of magnitude better. In fact, Damo Rudez had one of the lowest rebounding percentages EVER IN NBA history at the SF position, and even overall, for anyone who played over 400 minutes in a season (roughly 5 minutes a night). He only gathered 2.5% of all available rebounds while he was on the court. That's insanely low. One of the lowest percentages of all time. Chase's 6.1% is a massive amount higher (though it doesn't seem like it. Orders of magnitude higher. 6.1% accounts somewhere in the average spot.