Pacers Sign Damien Wilkins

[HurricaneDij25]

He also played for McMillan in Seattle...

[Moooose]

I got surprised and so I had to fix my log in details again. Good gracious. I thought it was a typo error or something.

[Pacers_Freak]

The problem is that there is zero upside to this for us. And the only reason we decided to sign a guy who hasn't played in 4 years is either nepotism or because we can't find enough young guys we want to take a free look at to fill up the rest of the invites. Either way, it's an issue and we have a bit of a history with nepotism.

This is an extremely minor move, but it's one of the small things we've done for years that winning teams don't do. And it's worse that we gave this out before giving one out to guys from SL who are deserving. I don't expect us to have the ability to do things like pay $3 mil for a 2nd round pick, but this is more of a level playing field excepting organizational preference of players.

In the long run it almost assuredly makes no difference. However, it's just an indication of the same issues being present.

Ok gotta admit I'm lost on how this is nepotism. Can you please explain?

[pacers33granger]

The problem is that there is zero upside to this for us. And the only reason we decided to sign a guy who hasn't played in 4 years is either nepotism or because we can't find enough young guys we want to take a free look at to fill up the rest of the invites. Either way, it's an issue and we have a bit of a history with nepotism.

This is an extremely minor move, but it's one of the small things we've done for years that winning teams don't do. And it's worse that we gave this out before giving one out to guys from SL who are deserving. I don't expect us to have the ability to do things like pay $3 mil for a 2nd round pick, but this is more of a level playing field excepting organizational preference of players.

In the long run it almost assuredly makes no difference. However, it's just an indication of the same issues being present.

Ok gotta admit I'm lost on how this is nepotism. Can you please explain?

Nate was Wikins' coach in Seattle. I'm not saying it definitely is, but we have a history of similar signings and it's hard not to believe that Wilkins was the choice out of all the vets out there due to the connection.

We likely drafted and kept Joe Young around so long because he's PG's cousin and we previously gave Ben Hansbrough a roster spot despite him barely being a D-League level player. The Joe Young one is kind of whatever since he has some talent, but the Hansbrough one was a giant waste of roster spot that should have gone to someone more deserving. I feel like there's another semi-recent example of a similar signing that I'm missing but that may be another team I'm thinking of.

[Wizop]

Ok gotta admit I'm lost on how this is nepotism. Can you please explain?

no family relationships involved so nepotism isn't the right word. perhaps favoritism. they mean they think the signing was because the coach had history with the player. personally I don't see this as a favor to a friend as much as a coach knowing what he was getting which makes it a low risk signing.

[pacers33granger]

Ok gotta admit I'm lost on how this is nepotism. Can you please explain?

no family relationships involved so nepotism isn't the right word. perhaps favoritism. they mean they think the signing was because the coach had history with the player. personally I don't see this as a favor to a friend as much as a coach knowing what he was getting which makes it a low risk signing.

Nepotism can include non-relatives.

"the practice among those with power or influence of favoring relatives or friends, especially by giving them jobs."

I just see no other way he's the vet chosen if not for Nate being the coach.

[Wizop]

I just see no other way he's the vet chosen if not for Nate being the coach.

I don't see what the problem is at this stage. Now if he's badly outplayed in the preseason and is kept anyway out of friendship, then it's a problem.

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[pacers33granger]

I just see no other way he's the vet chosen if not for Nate being the coach.

I don't see what the problem is at this stage. Now if he's badly outplayed in the preseason and is kept anyway out of friendship, then it's a problem.

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It's a very minor problem imo, but it's just disappointing to me mostly. It's 1 less spot for young talent. Even if it's extremely unlikely we find someone worth keeping, we should be taking those shots.

I totally understand your side of this as it's a tiny little thing that makes no difference ultimately. But we all know the team will never tank and this is an alternate way to acquire young talent that we're not taking full advantage of.

[Wizop]

we all know the team will never tank and this is an alternate way to acquire young talent that we're not taking full advantage of.

I just think the anguish is premature as the deal isn't guaranteed. Lots of time to cut him if some young player shows potential.

Edit I checked the cbafaq and the summer roster limit is twenty, not fifteen. This signing doesn't block signing young players to make good deals.

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[Boneman2]

The move in itself is an odd signing, but if the Pacers intend to develop him as a coach or are just looking for a really old veteran's locker room presence then it makes some sense.

I really could care less though as this pickup means less than our second 2nd round pick, another irrelevant transaction.

[HurricaneDij25]

I just see no other way he's the vet chosen if not for Nate being the coach.

I don't see what the problem is at this stage. Now if he's badly outplayed in the preseason and is kept anyway out of friendship, then it's a problem.

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Who cares if it's nepotism or not? If anything, I think it's only good for team continuity, and I hope he makes the roster...Such a young team needs a veteran voice.

I'd rather use the roster spot on a guy that could eat up some valuable rotation minutes as opposed to a marginal prospect that may or not be a worthy NBA talent.

Rebuilding or not, we still have to play Cleveland four times a year. You're saying that you are completely comfortable with the GR3/Bojan combo defending LeBron for 48 minutes???

[HurricaneDij25]

Ok gotta admit I'm lost on how this is nepotism. Can you please explain?

no family relationships involved so nepotism isn't the right word. perhaps favoritism. they mean they think the signing was because the coach had history with the player. personally I don't see this as a favor to a friend as much as a coach knowing what he was getting which makes it a low risk signing.

Nepotism can include non-relatives.

"the practice among those with power or influence of favoring relatives or friends, especially by giving them jobs."

I just see no other way he's the vet chosen if not for Nate being the coach.

Sorry this was the post I meant to quote in my previous post above. I'm new to this board if you couldn't tell already...

[pacers33granger]

Edit I checked the cbafaq and the summer roster limit is twenty, not fifteen. This signing doesn't block signing young players to make good deals.

I know, my point was that it takes up one of the spots. Maybe that last invite turns out to be our Covington. Unlikely? Very, but again, my overall point is we should be taking each and every shot we have at getting young talent. I believe TJ Mcconnell was the final invite for the Sixers a few summers back. Had they signed a Wilkins they never take a real look at him and don't have a decent, young, and super cheap backup pg.

Ultimately we could have invited enough young talent to make it to 20 and then sign Wilkins later on. I doubt any other teams were looking to add him when there are still so many free agents out there who are going to have to swallow their pride and start taking camp deals.

[pacers33granger]

Sorry this was the post I meant to quote in my previous post above. I'm new to this board if you couldn't tell already...

No worries, it can take some getting used to but you'll get the hang of it. And welcome if no one has said it before, always glad to have more posters here.

Who cares if it's nepotism or not? If anything, I think it's only good for team continuity, and I hope he makes the roster...Such a young team needs a veteran voice.

I'd rather use the roster spot on a guy that could eat up some valuable rotation minutes as opposed to a marginal prospect that may or not be a worthy NBA talent.

Rebuilding or not, we still have to play Cleveland four times a year. You're saying that you are completely comfortable with the GR3/Bojan combo defending LeBron for 48 minutes???

My problem is that, if it is nepotism, it signals a larger problem. We're in a position to where we need to be scouring the league for talent and we're leaving stones unturned here (a single stone I suppose, but still the point stands).

And I don't believe Wilkins has the ability to eat up rotation minutes, but I could be proven wrong if we keep him. He averaged 15 in the D-Leauge last season, which is fine, but for a guy who knows what he's doing on the court is underwhelming. And he's not making any sort of a difference defending Lebron. He wasn't a good defender in his prime and he's 37 now.

I get the idea that we want someone who won't miss a rotation, will make the right pass, etc. in the event he needs to play. But I recall us keeping Solomon Jones over Magnum Rolle (who we really liked) for this very reason. Now Rolle never made a career so we didn't lose anything there, but we wanted to keep him and opted to keep Jones instead who was every bit as terrible as a rookie big would have been when he got minutes.

[Wizop]

At what point does an additional young prospect interfere with the development of other players?

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[Scoot McGroot]

Edit I checked the cbafaq and the summer roster limit is twenty, not fifteen. This signing doesn't block signing young players to make good deals.

I know, my point was that it takes up one of the spots. Maybe that last invite turns out to be our Covington. Unlikely? Very, but again, my overall point is we should be taking each and every shot we have at getting young talent. I believe TJ Mcconnell was the final invite for the Sixers a few summers back. Had they signed a Wilkins they never take a real look at him and don't have a decent, young, and super cheap backup pg.

Ultimately we could have invited enough young talent to make it to 20 and then sign Wilkins later on. I doubt any other teams were looking to add him when there are still so many free agents out there who are going to have to swallow their pride and start taking camp deals.

And much like the Sixers waived someone the day before training camp to bring in McConnell (or was it Covington?), the Pacers can absolutely still do that. This contract doesn't even mean that he's for sure coming to camp. It's non guaranteed.

[HurricaneDij25]

No worries, it can take some getting used to but you'll get the hang of it. And welcome if no one has said it before, always glad to have more posters here.

Thanks. Much appreciated. Great to be here. Before joining, I was essentially run off from a message board where you pretty much had to be a snob from Florida or California (in other word, either a Heat, Lakers, or Warriors fan), to have full credibility on the board.

Even though I live near Chicago, I've always been a die-hard Pacers fan since my junior high days (I'm 29 now). And to this day, I still believe Mr. $tern had an agenda when he handed Artest the season-long suspension. The league was still suffering from Jordan withdrawal at the time and he was going to do everything in his power to prevent a Pacers/Spurs finals matchup from happening.

And no offense, I didn't like Granger when he was here. I'm pretty sure that's where Me-G13 got his soft, complacent, jumper-settling ways from. And when Granger signed with Miami the offseason after we traded him, that's when I REALLY hated him.

[HurricaneDij25]

My problem is that, if it is nepotism, it signals a larger problem. We're in a position to where we need to be scouring the league for talent and we're leaving stones unturned here (a single stone I suppose, but still the point stands).

And I don't believe Wilkins has the ability to eat up rotation minutes, but I could be proven wrong if we keep him. He averaged 15 in the D-Leauge last season, which is fine, but for a guy who knows what he's doing on the court is underwhelming. And he's not making any sort of a difference defending Lebron. He wasn't a good defender in his prime and he's 37 now.

I get the idea that we want someone who won't miss a rotation, will make the right pass, etc. in the event he needs to play. But I recall us keeping Solomon Jones over Magnum Rolle (who we really liked) for this very reason. Now Rolle never made a career so we didn't lose anything there, but we wanted to keep him and opted to keep Jones instead who was every bit as terrible as a rookie big would have been when he got minutes.

I disagree, I think having a veteran body in there will help greatly against LeBron, as opposed to having some young kid out there who possibly idolized him and possibly become star-stuck when facing him. As far as Wilkins' age is concerned, it's not as if LeBron who turns 33 in December, is any example of a fountain of youth at this point.

As for the Rolle/Solomon Jones dilemna, from my understanding that had more to do with Jones having a guaranteed contract at a time when neither player had distinguished themselves. It was never as if Jones was any sort of veteran presence at the time.

[Wizop]

Now official.

http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/pacers-sign-damien-wilkins-and-ben-moore

[tocooks101]

Make no mistake we are signing Wilkins to basically be another coach out there for the Mad ants, not to fill out any type of rotation on our NBA roster.