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2019 Off-Season Questions

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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#221 » by boomershadow » Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:46 am

basketballwacko2 wrote:
Wizop wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
I'd be surprised to see that.


I'd the logical counter to Boston going big with Horford at the 4. it allows us to match up with Turner and Sabonis without cutting Thad's minutes. my understanding is that the coaches have talked about it. (see Scott Agness Q&A on theAthletic where I asked about this. there is also an article there from Boston saying they plan to go big against us.)

what happens tonight may not tell us either way as both coaches may want to hide their cards for the playoffs.



I'd like to see it tried and see what happens.


It'd be really cool if we had a coach that tried things. :noway:
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#222 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:35 pm

boomershadow wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
Wizop wrote:
I'd the logical counter to Boston going big with Horford at the 4. it allows us to match up with Turner and Sabonis without cutting Thad's minutes. my understanding is that the coaches have talked about it. (see Scott Agness Q&A on theAthletic where I asked about this. there is also an article there from Boston saying they plan to go big against us.)

what happens tonight may not tell us either way as both coaches may want to hide their cards for the playoffs.



I'd like to see it tried and see what happens.


It'd be really cool if we had a coach that tried things. :noway:


I mean I get what you're saying. And I know Nate is rigid. But, his job is to win as many games as he can. I'm sure there are many combinations looked at in camp and practice as the year progresses. Doesn't make him right but if he and staff see a combo in practice they don't like then why would they run it out come game time? It's just like how everyone here wanted to give the keys to Holiday and then he had a couple bad games and he was our 3rd PG for the rest of his contract. Sometimes I think we forget how much time they spend working with these guys. It by no means means that his opinion is right. But I'm not sure we can say they don't try things.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#223 » by pacers70 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:48 pm

The young guys looked pretty good last night. We may have found our bench for next season. Holiday/Sumner/McDermott/Leaf/Johnson.

We need to decide what to do about Bogey, find a starting PG and in my opinion, find a 5th big with size that can bang with the Andre Drummond's of the league.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#224 » by Tom White » Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:34 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:I mean I get what you're saying. And I know Nate is rigid. But, his job is to win as many games as he can. I'm sure there are many combinations looked at in camp and practice as the year progresses. Doesn't make him right but if he and staff see a combo in practice they don't like then why would they run it out come game time? It's just like how everyone here wanted to give the keys to Holiday and then he had a couple bad games and he was our 3rd PG for the rest of his contract. Sometimes I think we forget how much time they spend working with these guys. It by no means means that his opinion is right. But I'm not sure we can say they don't try things.


Another thing to remember is once the season is underway practice time can be somewhat limited. How much time should they spend experimenting during practice as opposed to continuing to work with lineups that actually see court time together? It can be a real "catch 22" for the coaching staff, and if they get it wrong......well, they will have plenty of time to think about that as they search for their next job. :lol:
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#225 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:45 pm

pacers70 wrote:The young guys looked pretty good last night. We may have found our bench for next season. Holiday/Sumner/McDermott/Leaf/Johnson.

We need to decide what to do about Bogey, find a starting PG and in my opinion, find a 5th big with size that can bang with the Andre Drummond's of the league.


The other day you said Holiday was a 3rd PG?
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#226 » by pacers70 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:20 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:
pacers70 wrote:The young guys looked pretty good last night. We may have found our bench for next season. Holiday/Sumner/McDermott/Leaf/Johnson.

We need to decide what to do about Bogey, find a starting PG and in my opinion, find a 5th big with size that can bang with the Andre Drummond's of the league.


The other day you said Holiday was a 3rd PG?


No, I said 3rd guard. I stand by that...for now. 8-)
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#227 » by Wizop » Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:53 pm

pacers70 wrote:No, I said 3rd guard. I stand by that...for now. 8-)


were it up to me, it'd depend upon matchups. last night he got a lot of fouls. then again everyone on both teams did.

what Holiday does well is push the tempo. Sumner can do that too. even Leaf can run. we could really have a fast tempo 2nd unit next year.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#228 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:53 pm

pacers70 wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
pacers70 wrote:The young guys looked pretty good last night. We may have found our bench for next season. Holiday/Sumner/McDermott/Leaf/Johnson.

We need to decide what to do about Bogey, find a starting PG and in my opinion, find a 5th big with size that can bang with the Andre Drummond's of the league.


The other day you said Holiday was a 3rd PG?


No, I said 3rd guard. I stand by that...for now. 8-)


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Just giving ya crap. I agree with you. For now.... :lol: :lol:
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#229 » by pacers33granger » Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:18 am

Read on Twitter


Encouraging for our chances to keep Bogie. Maybe we just offer him the $18 mil or so in early bird instantly and he accepts without talking to other teams? It happens from time to time that players don't canvass the market if they want to stay put.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#230 » by PerkinsFor3 » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:30 pm

Who's playing at PG next season? CoJo?
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#231 » by Wizop » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:36 pm

PerkinsFor3 wrote:Who's playing at PG next season? CoJo?


a free agent? Holiday? Vic and CoJo could be complementary.

I think we've agreed that we should choose between Collison and CoJo although both are playing their way out of our heats.

I do not accept that Kyrie has exposed a weakness. sure he got his points but we lost once again on offense, not defense.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#232 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:38 pm

PerkinsFor3 wrote:Who's playing at PG next season? CoJo?


Holiday's the one under contract. Otherwise, we'll see. Could possibly re-sign CoJo or Collison, or look at the rest of the MLE level PG market like a Pat Beverley. Or, the draft. We seem to view Holiday very positively, so there's an outside chance he gets to play for the starting spot, but, I'd assume we would target someone as a placeholder at the spot.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#233 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:39 pm

Wizop wrote:I do not accept that Kyrie has exposed a weakness. sure he got his points but we lost once again on offense, not defense.


I don't know that there's really any one at the PG spot attainable that could really have defended him well last night. That was a star playing a star's type of night, and not much you could do about it, IMO.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#234 » by PerkinsFor3 » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:39 pm

Ah, totally forgot about Holiday. That would be interesting..
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#235 » by pacers70 » Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:55 pm

We desperately need to find a star caliber player either via Free Agency or trade.

I'd trade anyone but Vic and possibly hesitate on Myles. Anyone else, along with draft picks, I would consider moving.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#236 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:01 pm

pacers70 wrote:We desperately need to find a star caliber player either via Free Agency or trade.

I'd trade anyone but Vic and possibly hesitate on Myles. Anyone else, along with draft picks, I would consider moving.


Depending on what happens with Thad and the draft, I'd look at dealing Dom. Not because I want him gone in any way, but just because we do have Myles, and with Dom on his rookie contract, and with him still having the huge potential label since he comes off the bench for us, I think he's our only trade bait we could use to get a MAJOR piece in return. I mean, Dom/Dougie/1st allows us to trade for up to $15.8m in return without having to renounce anyone and use cap space. I don't know WHO that could be, but I think it could be someone. If it's a 4, you clear Thad's cap hold, then. If it's a 3, you clear Bojan's cap hold. If it's a 1, you clear Collison/CoJo off the books, and keep going.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#237 » by Tom White » Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:45 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:I mean, Dom/Dougie/1st allows us to trade for up to $15.8m in return without having to renounce anyone and use cap space. I don't know WHO that could be, but I think it could be someone.


My question is, do you really get an upgrade in talent at that dollar level? Involving three assets like that, you can't afford for it to wind up being a lateral move.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#238 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Apr 18, 2019 4:47 pm

Tom White wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:I mean, Dom/Dougie/1st allows us to trade for up to $15.8m in return without having to renounce anyone and use cap space. I don't know WHO that could be, but I think it could be someone.


My question is, do you really get an upgrade in talent at that dollar level? Involving three assets like that, you can't afford for it to wind up being a lateral move.


I'm sure there are some. But, we could also easily use some cap space to acquire someone up to around $30m by re-signing Thad for less than his $20m cap hold and retaining Bojan's cap hold on the books to sign him for up to $18.375m. That opens it up more. So, we can think a little open ended with the way free agency and cap holds work and see a bigger picture.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#239 » by boomershadow » Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:45 pm

I think this is another off-season where we make a few moves that quietly move the needle and don't excite many people. Fans will complain, but not at the same level as the fans of teams that overpaid guys like Biyombo, Mahinmi, Evan Turner, and that sort of thing. Not those names this off-season, but whichever ones inevitably get overpaid like that just because teams have so much money to spend and the supply of players worth spending it on fall way short of demand.
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Re: 2019 Off-Season Questions 

Post#240 » by Tom White » Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:36 pm

boomershadow wrote:I think this is another off-season where we make a few moves that quietly move the needle and don't excite many people. Fans will complain, but not at the same level as the fans of teams that overpaid guys like Biyombo, Mahinmi, Evan Turner, and that sort of thing. Not those names this off-season, but whichever ones inevitably get overpaid like that just because teams have so much money to spend and the supply of players worth spending it on fall way short of demand.


But doesn't that equate to..well, not as bad as shifting around the deck chairs on the Titanic, but you get the idea. I think it might be time for the team to make a much bolder move. I mean the kind of move that makes Victor the SECOND best player on the team, if he is retained. The kind of move that requires the team to package a pick (or picks) with a starter (or starters) for a REAL difference maker. I'm talking about an Anthony Davis or Kyrie Irving type, and yes that is going to cost, and no there aren't many of those. That is why they are worth a lot.

I'm sorry guys, but I just don't see Turner or Domas becoming all-stars on a regular basis - and that is the level of players we need. I think most of the guys on the team that we value highly, are valued that highly primarily because they are on our team.

I think it is time to stop cutting bait and to grow a pair and go fishing.

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