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Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach

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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#101 » by Wizop » Tue Jan 5, 2021 6:17 pm

I do see some tweets suggesting Bjorkgren is playing his starters too long and they're wearing out, but it sure didn't hurt us in New Orleans.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#102 » by fbalmeida » Tue Jan 5, 2021 6:53 pm

I'm genuinely happy for you guys. Now if only his former boss who still runs my team can figure out how to avoid playing 4 out of 6 top rotation guys all playing at career worst levels (by significant margins) all at the same time.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#103 » by Topofthekey » Tue Jan 5, 2021 7:07 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:The players have kind of been open and honest in post game pressers of how much they loved laying in Bjorkgren’s system, and pretty much throwing shade at McMillan. Brogdon CLEARLY did not like playing in McMillan’s system.

Read on Twitter
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Good. I hate watching them play for McMillan

Good on Brogdon. He's having a good season so far. Although to be fair, he started previous season hot as well. We'll see if he can sustain it this season
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#104 » by pacers33granger » Tue Jan 5, 2021 10:58 pm

Old Nate just wasn't what the team needed at this point. Most of our guys who played major minutes didn't need the motivation to play hard or a coach who puts faith in them, both things Old Nate did well.

But yeah it seems Brogdon in particular hated how stupidly simple the offense was. Which is understandable because it made him play almost exactly the opposite of how he should be used. Old Nate used him like an old school PG, which lead to a huge drop in percentages.

He obviously was the loudest at the end of the season though. So he has a vested interest in pumping up New Nate (not that he's not deserving of course).
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#105 » by pacers33granger » Tue Jan 5, 2021 11:02 pm

Wizop wrote:I do see some tweets suggesting Bjorkgren is playing his starters too long and they're wearing out, but it sure didn't hurt us in New Orleans.


I have been slightly disappointed that we haven't gone as deep as we expected during the offseason. But the end of the bench guys either aren't ready (Stanley, Lecque) or are use in emergency only types (Martin, Jakarr). And the guys we'd expect to get more minutes have had some injury issues (Goga, Sumner, Lamb).

Realistically we'll hopefully be adding Goga and Lamb to the regular rotation, so I'd expect us to start going 9-10 deep. Brogdon and Domas probably should come down a little bit from the 37 they're playing now no matter what though.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#106 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jan 6, 2021 2:50 am

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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#107 » by Topofthekey » Wed Jan 6, 2021 5:40 am

pacers33granger wrote:
Wizop wrote:I do see some tweets suggesting Bjorkgren is playing his starters too long and they're wearing out, but it sure didn't hurt us in New Orleans.


I have been slightly disappointed that we haven't gone as deep as we expected during the offseason. But the end of the bench guys either aren't ready (Stanley, Lecque) or are use in emergency only types (Martin, Jakarr). And the guys we'd expect to get more minutes have had some injury issues (Goga, Sumner, Lamb).

Realistically we'll hopefully be adding Goga and Lamb to the regular rotation, so I'd expect us to start going 9-10 deep. Brogdon and Domas probably should come down a little bit from the 37 they're playing now no matter what though.

Well, I think sometimes you just have to throw them into the mix and see what happens

Take the Celtic's Payton Pritchard for example. Against the Pacers he looked lost at times, but then he hit some big shots as well

Just put Sumner or Stanley in when Brogdon needs to rest, and let them play for a few minutes and see what happens. If they're doing well then keep them in for longer. If they aren't then pull them out, at least Brogdon got a few extra minutes of rest. Repeat again next game. Eventually they either show improvement, or they make you feel you've seen enough and then you just bench them the rest of the season and let them try again next year
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#108 » by Pacers_Freak » Wed Jan 6, 2021 2:07 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
Wizop wrote:I do see some tweets suggesting Bjorkgren is playing his starters too long and they're wearing out, but it sure didn't hurt us in New Orleans.


I have been slightly disappointed that we haven't gone as deep as we expected during the offseason. But the end of the bench guys either aren't ready (Stanley, Lecque) or are use in emergency only types (Martin, Jakarr). And the guys we'd expect to get more minutes have had some injury issues (Goga, Sumner, Lamb).

Realistically we'll hopefully be adding Goga and Lamb to the regular rotation, so I'd expect us to start going 9-10 deep. Brogdon and Domas probably should come down a little bit from the 37 they're playing now no matter what though.

Well, I think sometimes you just have to throw them into the mix and see what happens

Take the Celtic's Payton Pritchard for example. Against the Pacers he looked lost at times, but then he hit some big shots as well

Just put Sumner or Stanley in when Brogdon needs to rest, and let them play for a few minutes and see what happens. If they're doing well then keep them in for longer. If they aren't then pull them out, at least Brogdon got a few extra minutes of rest. Repeat again next game. Eventually they either show improvement, or they make you feel you've seen enough and then you just bench them the rest of the season and let them try again next year


I agree with what you are saying, but in fairness.... Pritchard may not have gotten any run if Kemba was healthy.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#109 » by pacers33granger » Wed Jan 6, 2021 10:22 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
Wizop wrote:I do see some tweets suggesting Bjorkgren is playing his starters too long and they're wearing out, but it sure didn't hurt us in New Orleans.


I have been slightly disappointed that we haven't gone as deep as we expected during the offseason. But the end of the bench guys either aren't ready (Stanley, Lecque) or are use in emergency only types (Martin, Jakarr). And the guys we'd expect to get more minutes have had some injury issues (Goga, Sumner, Lamb).

Realistically we'll hopefully be adding Goga and Lamb to the regular rotation, so I'd expect us to start going 9-10 deep. Brogdon and Domas probably should come down a little bit from the 37 they're playing now no matter what though.

Well, I think sometimes you just have to throw them into the mix and see what happens

Take the Celtic's Payton Pritchard for example. Against the Pacers he looked lost at times, but then he hit some big shots as well

Just put Sumner or Stanley in when Brogdon needs to rest, and let them play for a few minutes and see what happens. If they're doing well then keep them in for longer. If they aren't then pull them out, at least Brogdon got a few extra minutes of rest. Repeat again next game. Eventually they either show improvement, or they make you feel you've seen enough and then you just bench them the rest of the season and let them try again next year


I get it, but if the staff doesn't feel like they get what the team is running, they could do a lot of damage. We all at one point or another said "how bad could it be" with throwing Leaf in and then found out that it was real bad even in garbage time.

I think Sumner's been dealing with some minor injuries though? Otherwise I'd expect he would have gotten some minutes here and there.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#110 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Jan 7, 2021 2:28 pm

pacers33granger wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
I have been slightly disappointed that we haven't gone as deep as we expected during the offseason. But the end of the bench guys either aren't ready (Stanley, Lecque) or are use in emergency only types (Martin, Jakarr). And the guys we'd expect to get more minutes have had some injury issues (Goga, Sumner, Lamb).

Realistically we'll hopefully be adding Goga and Lamb to the regular rotation, so I'd expect us to start going 9-10 deep. Brogdon and Domas probably should come down a little bit from the 37 they're playing now no matter what though.

Well, I think sometimes you just have to throw them into the mix and see what happens

Take the Celtic's Payton Pritchard for example. Against the Pacers he looked lost at times, but then he hit some big shots as well

Just put Sumner or Stanley in when Brogdon needs to rest, and let them play for a few minutes and see what happens. If they're doing well then keep them in for longer. If they aren't then pull them out, at least Brogdon got a few extra minutes of rest. Repeat again next game. Eventually they either show improvement, or they make you feel you've seen enough and then you just bench them the rest of the season and let them try again next year


I get it, but if the staff doesn't feel like they get what the team is running, they could do a lot of damage. We all at one point or another said "how bad could it be" with throwing Leaf in and then found out that it was real bad even in garbage time.

I think Sumner's been dealing with some minor injuries though? Otherwise I'd expect he would have gotten some minutes here and there.


To add to your point. The whole throw them out there and see what happens idea... The coaches see these guys perform every single day. They know what they are capable of. You might not and that's why its easy to say hell throw em out there. They work with them every single day. Not saying that coaches can't be wrong. But, they already have an evaluation of what those players are capable of.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#111 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Jan 7, 2021 5:05 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Well, I think sometimes you just have to throw them into the mix and see what happens

Take the Celtic's Payton Pritchard for example. Against the Pacers he looked lost at times, but then he hit some big shots as well

Just put Sumner or Stanley in when Brogdon needs to rest, and let them play for a few minutes and see what happens. If they're doing well then keep them in for longer. If they aren't then pull them out, at least Brogdon got a few extra minutes of rest. Repeat again next game. Eventually they either show improvement, or they make you feel you've seen enough and then you just bench them the rest of the season and let them try again next year


I get it, but if the staff doesn't feel like they get what the team is running, they could do a lot of damage. We all at one point or another said "how bad could it be" with throwing Leaf in and then found out that it was real bad even in garbage time.

I think Sumner's been dealing with some minor injuries though? Otherwise I'd expect he would have gotten some minutes here and there.


To add to your point. The whole throw them out there and see what happens idea... The coaches see these guys perform every single day. They know what they are capable of. You might not and that's why its easy to say hell throw em out there. They work with them every single day. Not saying that coaches can't be wrong. But, they already have an evaluation of what those players are capable of.


Yes. But also Nate talked explicitly about how his rotations were going to be deep, and change constantly, even if it loses games now, because that may help you win games in the playoffs. We have yet to see that, though it may come soon. He’s also done some things towards earning his players trust such as calling iffy coaches challenges to show Oladipo and Sabonis he’s behind them.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#112 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Jan 7, 2021 5:10 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
I get it, but if the staff doesn't feel like they get what the team is running, they could do a lot of damage. We all at one point or another said "how bad could it be" with throwing Leaf in and then found out that it was real bad even in garbage time.

I think Sumner's been dealing with some minor injuries though? Otherwise I'd expect he would have gotten some minutes here and there.


To add to your point. The whole throw them out there and see what happens idea... The coaches see these guys perform every single day. They know what they are capable of. You might not and that's why its easy to say hell throw em out there. They work with them every single day. Not saying that coaches can't be wrong. But, they already have an evaluation of what those players are capable of.


Yes. But also Nate talked explicitly about how his rotations were going to be deep, and change constantly, even if it loses games now, because that may help you win games in the playoffs. We have yet to see that, though it may come soon. He’s also done some things towards earning his players trust such as calling iffy coaches challenges to show Oladipo and Sabonis he’s behind them.


I agree with what you are saying. He said he was going to do play a deep rotation and hasn't. Him doing differently than he says is different than the hell threw em out there reasoning. Fans forget coaches and staff work with the players every day. There is no such thing as hell throw em out there unless there is a rash of injuries and you have to play someone before they are ready. The hell throw em out there is fans wanting to see what players can do.

Perhaps with the short training camp and short pre-season there was a larger focus on getting the main rotation guys understanding the system and bringing along everyone else as the season progresses.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#113 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Jan 7, 2021 6:31 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
To add to your point. The whole throw them out there and see what happens idea... The coaches see these guys perform every single day. They know what they are capable of. You might not and that's why its easy to say hell throw em out there. They work with them every single day. Not saying that coaches can't be wrong. But, they already have an evaluation of what those players are capable of.


Yes. But also Nate talked explicitly about how his rotations were going to be deep, and change constantly, even if it loses games now, because that may help you win games in the playoffs. We have yet to see that, though it may come soon. He’s also done some things towards earning his players trust such as calling iffy coaches challenges to show Oladipo and Sabonis he’s behind them.


I agree with what you are saying. He said he was going to do play a deep rotation and hasn't. Him doing differently than he says is different than the hell threw em out there reasoning. Fans forget coaches and staff work with the players every day. There is no such thing as hell throw em out there unless there is a rash of injuries and you have to play someone before they are ready. The hell throw em out there is fans wanting to see what players can do.

Perhaps with the short training camp and short pre-season there was a larger focus on getting the main rotation guys understanding the system and bringing along everyone else as the season progresses.


I mean, I certainly don't think that. I imagine most, if not all, of the posters here don't think that. On twitter, Facebook, and in daily life, sure, maybe. But, I do know that they do things like "practice".

I do imagine that We can mostly agree that playing Sabonis (coming off of plantar fasciitis) and Malcolm Brogdon (history of bumps and bruises) 37+ minutes per night likely isn't sustainable over even a shortened 72 game season, though.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#114 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Jan 7, 2021 6:51 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Yes. But also Nate talked explicitly about how his rotations were going to be deep, and change constantly, even if it loses games now, because that may help you win games in the playoffs. We have yet to see that, though it may come soon. He’s also done some things towards earning his players trust such as calling iffy coaches challenges to show Oladipo and Sabonis he’s behind them.


I agree with what you are saying. He said he was going to do play a deep rotation and hasn't. Him doing differently than he says is different than the hell threw em out there reasoning. Fans forget coaches and staff work with the players every day. There is no such thing as hell throw em out there unless there is a rash of injuries and you have to play someone before they are ready. The hell throw em out there is fans wanting to see what players can do.

Perhaps with the short training camp and short pre-season there was a larger focus on getting the main rotation guys understanding the system and bringing along everyone else as the season progresses.


I mean, I certainly don't think that. I imagine most, if not all, of the posters here don't think that. On twitter, Facebook, and in daily life, sure, maybe. But, I do know that they do things like "practice".

I do imagine that We can mostly agree that playing Sabonis (coming off of plantar fasciitis) and Malcolm Brogdon (history of bumps and bruises) 37+ minutes per night likely isn't sustainable over even a shortened 72 game season, though.


I wasn't speaking to you directly. There have been countless posts here over my time for coaches to let bench guys just have a chance and see what they can do.


Totally agree that those minutes are probably not the best recipe moving forward. But, really just need to shave a minute or 2 per game off their totals and they pretty well fall in line.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#115 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Jan 7, 2021 8:06 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
I agree with what you are saying. He said he was going to do play a deep rotation and hasn't. Him doing differently than he says is different than the hell threw em out there reasoning. Fans forget coaches and staff work with the players every day. There is no such thing as hell throw em out there unless there is a rash of injuries and you have to play someone before they are ready. The hell throw em out there is fans wanting to see what players can do.

Perhaps with the short training camp and short pre-season there was a larger focus on getting the main rotation guys understanding the system and bringing along everyone else as the season progresses.


I mean, I certainly don't think that. I imagine most, if not all, of the posters here don't think that. On twitter, Facebook, and in daily life, sure, maybe. But, I do know that they do things like "practice".

I do imagine that We can mostly agree that playing Sabonis (coming off of plantar fasciitis) and Malcolm Brogdon (history of bumps and bruises) 37+ minutes per night likely isn't sustainable over even a shortened 72 game season, though.


I wasn't speaking to you directly. There have been countless posts here over my time for coaches to let bench guys just have a chance and see what they can do.


Totally agree that those minutes are probably not the best recipe moving forward. But, really just need to shave a minute or 2 per game off their totals and they pretty well fall in line.


In a way, though, some of these guys really do need to see some game time. Sure, maybe it's a health thing, but we've seen Sumner contribute. It'd be nice to get some guys like Stanley/Martin in (until Lamb returns) for some game experience and seeing how they adapt to live minutes. Practice is great, but guys probably also need some flashes of live minutes to see just how different games are from practice. I'm not worried about Sampson...he's enough of a vet and has proven he can turn on his energy at a moments notice. But just like shows like SNL occasionally have to put a new performer on the live show-for them to see and hear and feel their writing/sketch go flat and bomb, you kind of have to in the NBA too. If the player bombs, and doesn't work to recover in practice, you find out quickly that they need to be moved on. :dontknow:
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#116 » by Pacers_Freak » Thu Jan 7, 2021 8:50 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers_Freak wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
I mean, I certainly don't think that. I imagine most, if not all, of the posters here don't think that. On twitter, Facebook, and in daily life, sure, maybe. But, I do know that they do things like "practice".

I do imagine that We can mostly agree that playing Sabonis (coming off of plantar fasciitis) and Malcolm Brogdon (history of bumps and bruises) 37+ minutes per night likely isn't sustainable over even a shortened 72 game season, though.


I wasn't speaking to you directly. There have been countless posts here over my time for coaches to let bench guys just have a chance and see what they can do.


Totally agree that those minutes are probably not the best recipe moving forward. But, really just need to shave a minute or 2 per game off their totals and they pretty well fall in line.


In a way, though, some of these guys really do need to see some game time. Sure, maybe it's a health thing, but we've seen Sumner contribute. It'd be nice to get some guys like Stanley/Martin in (until Lamb returns) for some game experience and seeing how they adapt to live minutes. Practice is great, but guys probably also need some flashes of live minutes to see just how different games are from practice. I'm not worried about Sampson...he's enough of a vet and has proven he can turn on his energy at a moments notice. But just like shows like SNL occasionally have to put a new performer on the live show-for them to see and hear and feel their writing/sketch go flat and bomb, you kind of have to in the NBA too. If the player bombs, and doesn't work to recover in practice, you find out quickly that they need to be moved on. :dontknow:


We usually see eye to eye. This one we don't. I'll always believe playing time is earned and not given. We don't know if Stanley is struggling to pick up NBA defensive rotations with a short training camp. We don't know if Keelan looks every day like he doesn't belong like he did against the Cavs. We'll never know what is going on behind the scenes and the people behind the scenes do. I hope Sumner and Goga get healthy and can start taking some of these minutes. Because in reality we are talking about the guys that were signed to be our 13th and 14th guys getting into games. Guys that if everyone was healthy and this was a normal year might be in street clothes for games.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#117 » by Jake0890 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 3:35 pm

With Doug's new ankle sprain, if there was ever an opening for some Stanley minutes, it would probably be now.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#118 » by Pacers_Freak » Fri Jan 8, 2021 4:27 pm

Jake0890 wrote:With Doug's new ankle sprain, if there was ever an opening for some Stanley minutes, it would probably be now.


Possibly... I think they will give Martin the first crack at it.
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Re: Pacers Hire Nate Bjorkgren as Head Coach 

Post#119 » by Topofthekey » Fri Jan 8, 2021 4:49 pm

Pacers_Freak wrote:
Jake0890 wrote:With Doug's new ankle sprain, if there was ever an opening for some Stanley minutes, it would probably be now.


Possibly... I think they will give Martin the first crack at it.

I'm fine with either Martin getting more minutes, or Stanley leapfrogging him so that Martin remains a "break in case of emergency" option like Sampson

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