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2021 Trade Deadline

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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#41 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:35 pm

Pacers Forever wrote:Question is did Pacers over value their players pushing themselves out of any possible trades or did teams under value Pacers players available ? I would have loved to trade Lamb and A Holiday for a reasonable return. I just don’t see any future for them here.


There’s just not always a fair or good market out there for every player. :dontknow:
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#42 » by Topofthekey » Fri Mar 26, 2021 12:51 am

I think a quiet deadline for the Pacers means that they are unlikely to be able to re-sign both Doug and TJ in the off-season

TJ has definitely played his way onto the radar of most teams, so it will be quite unlikely that Pacers will be able to retain him at his current salary

And Doug as a shooter will always garner interest around the league

They could still try to clear salaries in the off-season, but if they couldn't find any reasonable offers for Aaron or Lamb at the deadline, I don't think anything's going to change later on

Unless Pacers are willing to give Aaron or Lamb away for free (or worse pay to clear their salaries), which they obviously should not be doing, then it's unlikely Pacers can retain Doug and TJ without having to pay the tax. And they certainly aren't going to pay the tax for Doug and TJ

Heck, depending on how much other teams are willing to offer Doug and TJ, Pacers might not be able to keep even just one of them

It may be premature to say this, but essentially what they have done this season was sideline Aaron and Sumner in favor of playing TJ, in a season where the team isn't expected to compete, only to allow TJ to walk as a free agent at the end of the season. But at least they helped TJ earn a bigger contract. Racking up the positive karma by doing good deeds, right?

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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#43 » by Topofthekey » Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:07 am

Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#44 » by Scoot McGroot » Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:12 am

Topofthekey wrote:Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell


Would we have wanted that package?
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#45 » by Wizop » Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:25 am

I'm not pessimistic. I like our what we have and I like what I see in mock drafts.

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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#46 » by Wizop » Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:27 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell


Would we have wanted that package?
I wouldn't want that. A harder question is would I have done something like that for Aaron.

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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#47 » by Topofthekey » Fri Mar 26, 2021 2:08 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell


Would we have wanted that package?

As I said, it's a bit too premature to say

But if indeed TJ just leaves as a free agent at the end of the season, then yea I would rather get two 2RP at least

I think the Rondo trade is a baseline benchmark of what a backup playmaking PG was worth at the trade deadline. TJ is younger, cheaper, and doesn't have any injury concerns like Rondo, so if that was the package that Rondo fetched, TJ should probably be worth more
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#48 » by Scoot McGroot » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:01 am

Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell


Would we have wanted that package?

As I said, it's a bit too premature to say

But if indeed TJ just leaves as a free agent at the end of the season, then yea I would rather get two 2RP at least

I think the Rondo trade is a baseline benchmark of what a backup playmaking PG was worth at the trade deadline. TJ is younger, cheaper, and doesn't have any injury concerns like Rondo, so if that was the package that Rondo fetched, TJ should probably be worth more


We can buy 1, if not 2 extra 2nd round picks with just the $2-2.5m in extra salary we saved from the difference between TJ and Lou.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#49 » by Topofthekey » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:05 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Would we have wanted that package?

As I said, it's a bit too premature to say

But if indeed TJ just leaves as a free agent at the end of the season, then yea I would rather get two 2RP at least

I think the Rondo trade is a baseline benchmark of what a backup playmaking PG was worth at the trade deadline. TJ is younger, cheaper, and doesn't have any injury concerns like Rondo, so if that was the package that Rondo fetched, TJ should probably be worth more


We can buy 1, if not 2 extra 2nd round picks with just the $2-2.5m in extra salary we saved from the difference between TJ and Lou.

They can use someone else as salary filler, like Patrick Patterson or Reggie Jackson
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#50 » by Scoot McGroot » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:08 am

Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:As I said, it's a bit too premature to say

But if indeed TJ just leaves as a free agent at the end of the season, then yea I would rather get two 2RP at least

I think the Rondo trade is a baseline benchmark of what a backup playmaking PG was worth at the trade deadline. TJ is younger, cheaper, and doesn't have any injury concerns like Rondo, so if that was the package that Rondo fetched, TJ should probably be worth more


We can buy 1, if not 2 extra 2nd round picks with just the $2-2.5m in extra salary we saved from the difference between TJ and Lou.

They can use someone else as salary filler, like Patrick Patterson or Reggie Jackson


I think we just saw that expiring contracts (like TJ) have less value than longer contracts. We saw Oladipo, Powell, Theis, Lou Will, etc, all get less in return than longer signed guys like Gordon and Rondo. Who knows what the market might have been willing to pay for McConnell, and whether or not Pritchard and the Pacers were willing to take another step backwards for something like a 2nd or two. I almost always like any value more than no value, but McConnell provides some value for the rest of our roster right now, and we may even try and keep him long-term.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#51 » by Topofthekey » Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:59 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
We can buy 1, if not 2 extra 2nd round picks with just the $2-2.5m in extra salary we saved from the difference between TJ and Lou.

They can use someone else as salary filler, like Patrick Patterson or Reggie Jackson


I think we just saw that expiring contracts (like TJ) have less value than longer contracts. We saw Oladipo, Powell, Theis, Lou Will, etc, all get less in return than longer signed guys like Gordon and Rondo. Who knows what the market might have been willing to pay for McConnell, and whether or not Pritchard and the Pacers were willing to take another step backwards for something like a 2nd or two. I almost always like any value more than no value, but McConnell provides some value for the rest of our roster right now, and we may even try and keep him long-term.

Rondo's also expiring though

But yea, I wouldn't mind re-signing TJ, and Doug, to another 2 or 3 year type deal

I guess we'll see how the team handles that later on
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#52 » by Scoot McGroot » Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:12 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:They can use someone else as salary filler, like Patrick Patterson or Reggie Jackson


I think we just saw that expiring contracts (like TJ) have less value than longer contracts. We saw Oladipo, Powell, Theis, Lou Will, etc, all get less in return than longer signed guys like Gordon and Rondo. Who knows what the market might have been willing to pay for McConnell, and whether or not Pritchard and the Pacers were willing to take another step backwards for something like a 2nd or two. I almost always like any value more than no value, but McConnell provides some value for the rest of our roster right now, and we may even try and keep him long-term.

Rondo's also expiring though

But yea, I wouldn't mind re-signing TJ, and Doug, to another 2 or 3 year type deal

I guess we'll see how the team handles that later on


Yeah, I’m with you and normally fully in asset acquisition mode. I just think that with this current team, and already having a surplus of 2nds (though there’s no such thing as too many draft picks), and the reports that Bjorkgren is still feeling his way out as a head coach and earning the players trust, having a guy like McConnell that he can trust as a coach on the court, or bench and not get any complaints, is probably more value to the long-term development of this roster and clubhouse. This year isn’t going to be ultra competitive: the Warren injury guarantees it now. I think its most important for the remainder of this season that we develop our coach, and work in trust and comfort amongst the players, including Levert.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#53 » by pacers33granger » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:57 pm

Topofthekey wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Topofthekey wrote:Hawks got Louis Williams, two 2RPs, and cash for Rondo

Hard to believe Pacers couldn't have gotten a similar package for TJ McConnell


Would we have wanted that package?

As I said, it's a bit too premature to say

But if indeed TJ just leaves as a free agent at the end of the season, then yea I would rather get two 2RP at least

I think the Rondo trade is a baseline benchmark of what a backup playmaking PG was worth at the trade deadline. TJ is younger, cheaper, and doesn't have any injury concerns like Rondo, so if that was the package that Rondo fetched, TJ should probably be worth more


If we're comparing TJ to the Rondo deal then we should have been able to get a first. But that's an indictment on Rondo as a player/person more than anything about TJ.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#54 » by Pacers Forever » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:29 am

Hypothetically if Pacers would want to fill their open roster spot could they sign Alize to a 10 day contract just to see if he’s improved his game since last with them ? If so then sign him for rest of the season ?
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#55 » by Scoot McGroot » Sat Mar 27, 2021 4:15 am

Pacers Forever wrote:Hypothetically if Pacers would want to fill their open roster spot could they sign Alize to a 10 day contract just to see if he’s improved his game since last with them ? If so then sign him for rest of the season ?


Alize is currently under contract with the Brooklyn Nets, so we could not possibly sign him until his 10 day contract there ends, or he is released. So, no.

Otherwise, we essentially signed Brissett coming into this season to replace Alize in that same role.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#56 » by Pacers Forever » Sun Mar 28, 2021 1:11 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers Forever wrote:Hypothetically if Pacers would want to fill their open roster spot could they sign Alize to a 10 day contract just to see if he’s improved his game since last with them ? If so then sign him for rest of the season ?


Alize is currently under contract with the Brooklyn Nets, so we could not possibly sign him until his 10 day contract there ends, or he is released. So, no.

Otherwise, we essentially signed Brissett coming into this season to replace Alize in that same role.


LOL I know that he's under contract and that we've got Brissett on a 10 day. I'm talking after this if Brooklyn doesn't resign him and Pacers don't resign Brissett. Then could they ?
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#57 » by Topofthekey » Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:16 am

Trade deadline has passed, but there's still the off-season

Trying to brainstorm a little here

Is there anyway we can turn Sabonis and Brogdon into Siakam and Beal?

Myles - Siakam - Warren/Justin - Beal - Caris

That lineup looks very intriguing to me. You have a big time scorer in Beal who can play both on and off ball, allowing Caris and Warren to also get their touches, and you have two great/good defenders in Myles and Siakam to help cover up Beal's defensive issues

I'm even ok with using Warren as trade bait and plug Justin in as the full time SF in that lineup

Is there anyway to make this happen, in theory at least?

Anyone?
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#58 » by Pacers Forever » Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:57 am

Topofthekey wrote:Trade deadline has passed, but there's still the off-season

Trying to brainstorm a little here

Is there anyway we can turn Sabonis and Brogdon into Siakam and Beal?

Myles - Siakam - Warren/Justin - Beal - Caris

That lineup looks very intriguing to me. You have a big time scorer in Beal who can play both on and off ball, allowing Caris and Warren to also get their touches, and you have two great/good defenders in Myles and Siakam to help cover up Beal's defensive issues

I'm even ok with using Warren as trade bait and plug Justin in as the full time SF in that lineup

Is there anyway to make this happen, in theory at least?

Anyone?


Probably not for many reasons but I'll play along. I don't know their contract status with their clubs for the future. Can't see Washington wanting to part with a scoring stud like Beal. Interesting that Westbrook is costing Washington 41,000. :o Toronto I think would be ok trading Siakam based on their recent willingness to move Powell slowly breaking up the championship team.

What I did is look up that Beal makes 28,000 and Siakam 30,000 totaling 58,000 incoming. Brogdon 21,000 and Sabonis 20,000. Throw Lamb 10,000 plus McDermott 7,000 in to get 58,000 going out. I'm using this year's salaries because it's easy to find. Ha !

First option Washington takes Brogdon and McDermott for Beal and Toronto takes Sabonis and Lamb for Siakam.

Second option Washington takes Brogdon and Lamb for Beal and Toronto takes Sabonis and McDermott for Siakam.

Third option Sabonis and Lamb to Washington with Toronto taking Brogdon and McDermott which they already have Lowry and VanVleet.

Personally I would love to have Beal as probably a lot of NBA fans in other cities would. I just don't see the Pacers brass parting with Sabonis, Turner, LeVert, Warren, or Brogdon, but who knows ? Warren's contract is so good that they won't part with him as long as he reverts back to his upward talent growth trend he's been on during his career. Still hard to believe Phoenix parted with him.

I'm really not sure who the franchise promotional player of the Pacers is currently. Used to be Reggie. Then Danny G. Next came Paul G. Currently is it Myles or Sabonis or both that they wouldn't part with to not ruffle fans feathers ? I don't think it's Brogdon and they could part with him other than I think new Nate has a thing for him ? Regardless here is one take on your question. Interested to see other's replies to Top of the Key.
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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#59 » by Wizop » Sun Mar 28, 2021 1:32 pm

I prefer the band of brothers approach to the star with backup singers approach. I like what we have particularly if the draft goes well. However, if Warren is back next year at full speed, I can see Lamb being expendable. Also, Aaron needs to emulate McConnell.

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Re: 2021 Trade Deadline 

Post#60 » by Scoot McGroot » Sun Mar 28, 2021 1:44 pm

Pacers Forever wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Pacers Forever wrote:Hypothetically if Pacers would want to fill their open roster spot could they sign Alize to a 10 day contract just to see if he’s improved his game since last with them ? If so then sign him for rest of the season ?


Alize is currently under contract with the Brooklyn Nets, so we could not possibly sign him until his 10 day contract there ends, or he is released. So, no.

Otherwise, we essentially signed Brissett coming into this season to replace Alize in that same role.


LOL I know that he's under contract and that we've got Brissett on a 10 day. I'm talking after this if Brooklyn doesn't resign him and Pacers don't resign Brissett. Then could they ?


I mean, if he’s a free agent and we have an open roster spot, then of course. I wouldn’t count on it, though.

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